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[Book Spoilers] EP 208 Discussion

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There is no fucking way that Ramsey Snow was just chillin' on a dock on the Iron Islands. Do people think that Roose just magically knew that they'd be able to convince Theon to take Winterfell and set that plan in motion? Hate this Dagmar = Ramsey business.

Up until tonight, I really didn't pay attention to anyone theorizing that Dagmer was Ramsay. At all. But, it just seems like they're really endeavoring to prop the character of Dagmer up. He's almost in every scene with Theon. Granted, it's to give Theon someone to talk to, but, that aside. Maybe Roose had known Theon couldn't be trusted, and, as a backup plan, he decided to plant Ramsay on Pyke for Theon's homecoming?

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Not a mistake at all, as I see it. He's saying he'd worship even some foreign phony god if only that'd get his sons back.

That's is exactly how I took it as well.

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The sanitizing of Arya. Granted, she's ordered deaths so you can't say the character to innocent. But they didn't have her kill anyone during the "battle" at House Darry and they don't even have her kill the guard to escape. They delete one of the best parts in the book, the Weasel Soup storyline and Arya's Harrenhal arc concludes with a giant disappointment. That's what I call taking a great part of the book and intentionally making his shitty.

Did she escape already? I wasn't clear on that, if they had only just gotten past one of the gates. If that's really the end of her stay in Harrenhal, that's really lame. Having her slit the guard's throat and not care at all is the best ending for her arc for the season. Plus, she has to meet up with Jaqen again; him knowing her real name and giving her the coin is very important.

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Up until tonight, I really didn't pay attention to anyone theorizing that Dagmer was Ramsay. At all. But, it just seems like they're really endeavoring to prop the character of Dagmer up. He's almost in every scene with Theon. Granted, it's to give Theon someone to talk to, but, that aside. Maybe Roose had known Theon couldn't be trusted, and, as a backup plan, he decided to plant Ramsay on Pyke for Theon's homecoming?

Gods, I hope you're wrong.

Asha's (OK, Yara's) plea to Theon is not getting enough attention. It feels quite prescient to me considering what we book readers know what is in store for Theon.

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Did she escape already? I wasn't clear on that, if they had only just gotten past one of the gates. If that's really the end of her stay in Harrenhal, that's really lame. Having her slit the guard's throat and not care at all is the best ending for her arc for the season. Plus, she has to meet up with Jaqen again; him knowing her real name and giving her the coin is very important.

Yeah, it didn't occur to me until several posters pointed that out...technically the escape isn't necessarily over, so there is still hope. Totally agree with you.

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Can anyone remind me from the books of what the justification was for Renly getting Storm's End in the first place? He was just a youngin' and Stannis had already put down the Greyjoy Rebellion, right? Also, was it Mayce Tyrell who was holing Stannis up under siege? May The Seven forgive me as I have only read the books twice.

Well the most obvious and simple answer is that Robert liked Renly more than Stannis. What happened if I recall is that when Stannis was lifted from the siege (it was indeed Mace) he went off to capture Dragonstone which is where he was when the war ended so Robert gave it to him.

And the Greyjoy Rebellion had not happened yet.

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Yeah, it didn't occur to me until several posters pointed that out...technically the escape isn't necessarily over, so there is still hope. Totally agree with you.

I can't see how that wasn't meant to be the escape. We'll see them again in ep. 10, but they're gone from Harrenhal. That joint is going to go monkey shit crazy when the dead guards are found; Arya and co. can't just be chillin' in the outer-bailey of the castle -- they'd be found in minutes.

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Why is no one talking about how great a job Tom Wlaschiha is doing as Jaqen H'ghar? The scene when Arya says his name and they have that whole conversation is just brilliantly acted on both parts. They really seem to have chemistry, maybe it's just Maisie Williams because she was fantastic with Tywin too but I think the Jaqen portrayal is amazing. He has a touch of humor and seriousness much like the books. Also, Oona Chaplin is totally worth the kingdom. One more thing. I don't think Jaime thinks of the Cleganes with such respect. Yes, they're both gifted, brutal killers and fighters but I think Jaime would think himself much better than those two. I would think Jaime Lannister would know many other knights more skilled and famous than The Hound and The Mountain. Selmy possibly even though he is old and Jaime is cocky as hell. Oberyn Martell? He proved himself to be pretty good, beating the Mountain later in the books. There must be better knights than the dogs.
Yes. All of this.

I think Maisie could probably have chemistry with a chair. She's so brilliant!!

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I think Maisie could probably have chemistry with a chair. She's so brilliant!!

I agree. She's awesome! :)

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I honestly don't understand all the complaints about not getting weasel soup. I mean, if TV Arya isn't known as "Weasel", how or why can they have weasel soup in the same way as the book? Get over it, people! Yes, it was a 'fun' part of the book with Arya, but in the overall context of her storyline across this asnd the next 3 books, it was a tiny little detail that really has absolutely no long term signficance. Talk about griping over inconsequential changes!

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I was very bored with this episode, but like all the episodes I still watched it twice.

DISLIKED:

I was upset that it wasnt Ghost that found the obsidian, and the 'horn'. Where has he been anyway?

I was really really looking foward to the weasel soup scene.

Annoyed that I dont knw who this Talissa chick is yet. She's still really playing up the whole volantis thing.

Bran and Rickon already in the crypts.....wtf

Useless scenes with Danny, they could of shown more Theon, or Sansa, or Jaime/Brienne, anything.

LIKED:

Tyrion/Varys scene...awesme

Jaime/Brienne scene was great!

Asha/Yara, I finally enjoyed her in this episode

Preview for Blackwater

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I thought it was interesting that Robb gave Roose the go ahead to send Ramsay to Winterfell. That will make the sack all the worse.

I wish that the reveal that B & R are alive was pushed back to ep. 10, but in the book it was clear to me they weren't dead anyway.

The dragonglass and the horn made me filled with glee! This makes me think we will get the three horn blasts in the finale.

The return of Varys was great, Bronn cleaning his nails with a dagger was great, and this was Peter Dinklage and Lena Heady's best work so far this season. Whenever Heady plays Cersei with evil glee it's fabulous. It made very happy to see that Ilyn Payne makes an appearance next week.

Robb and Talisa were so so. I really hope that they settle who she is now that they've had sex. It will be annoying if she isn't Jeyne. I'm glad I wasn't the only one confused about whether or not they made it to the Crag. Either way it doesn't matter. If the Westerling's household all knew Jeyne was going undercover they could just pretend they don't know her.

It does look like the order from Qhorin is happening so finally people will stop assuming it won't and bitching about it in advance.

Ghost needs to come back at some point.

No weasel soup is disapointing but at least they had ARya trick Jaqen. It will be interesting to see the conclusion of this arc. They do need to start setting up Arya as an angry vengeful assasain sooner or later, but I don't mind if they do that slowly.

Stannis and Davos were really good. I'm glad we got backstory on them so the non-book audience will actually care about them during the battle. It totally makes sense that Stannis is a dog person!

Blackwater will be epic! Not just because GRRM wrote it, but because Neil Marshall directed. The Descent is one of my favorite horror movies. Tyrion's story about running the sewage system in Casterly Rock makes me think they are going to show either the chain or something else that shows us Tyrion is responsible for the victory.

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Did she escape already? I wasn't clear on that, if they had only just gotten past one of the gates. If that's really the end of her stay in Harrenhal, that's really lame. Having her slit the guard's throat and not care at all is the best ending for her arc for the season. Plus, she has to meet up with Jaqen again; him knowing her real name and giving her the coin is very important.

The plot summary for episode 10..... "Tyrion awakens to a changed situation. King Joffrey doles out rewards to his subjects. As Theon stirs his men to action, Luwin offers some final advice. Brienne silences Jaime; Arya receives a gift from Jaqen; Dany goes to a strange place; Jon proves himself to Qhorin."

Arya will run in to Jaqen again, where he'll most likely give her the coin and then face change in front of her. And it seems Jon's story will most likely have Qhorin and Jon face off while they are captured, as he'll tell him to kill him in front of the wildlings to prove his loyalty, and egg on the wildlings to encourage Jon to do the same. So Jon's arc WILL end like it does in ACoK, it's just that it was a little different to get there, and I'm alright with it. So since it seems we are getting everything wrapped up like in the book, let us be happy!

Although I did find it weird Robb imprisoned Catelyn, whereas in ASoS, he knew she did it for the best. I guess since the Tullys aren't in this season, we'll have to save face with that one. And I was hoping throughout Robb and Talisa's conversation(s) she'd reveal she is actually of House Westerling, and that her name is Jeyne. They can still reveal this, but I hope if they do they do it in episode 10.

I LOVED the digging up of the dragonglass and horn. When I saw them digging in the snow I knew it was coming. And with Ghost's absence, we'll probably see him by the end of the season. He's probably close by, just stalking them, as he probably knows the threat Jon faces.

And I was also expecting the mention of the chain, especially near the end where they were looking across the bay, I just thought Tyrion would mention it. But hey, Blackwater's gonna be a beast nonetheless!

And about Bran and Rickon being revealed already, I can see why they did it, as episode 9 will only be King's Landing, so they probably didn't want to have the non-book readers still clinging to the death of Bran and Rickon, and would rather have the audience know they are safe. Although it would have been a beautiful scene if episode 10 ended with Bran, Rickon, and co. being revealed for the first time since their "deaths", with the camera following their shadowed backs out of the crypts and out into the ruined Winterfell. Would have been a great ending and shocker for the audience.

Edited by DragonAge93

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Yes. All of this. I think Maisie could probably have chemistry with a chair. She's so brilliant!!

I agree. She's awesome! :)

Yeah, it seemed obvious from S1E1 that we had ourselves a little star.

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I honestly don't understand all the complaints about not getting weasel soup. I mean, if TV Arya isn't known as "Weasel", how or why can they have weasel soup in the same way as the book? Get over it, people! Yes, it was a 'fun' part of the book with Arya, but in the overall context of her storyline across this asnd the next 3 books, it was a tiny little detail that really has absolutely no long term signficance. Talk about griping over inconsequential changes!

Plus, there is no bunch of high-born prisoners, wrapped and ready in a cell, waiting to be rescued. I hate that the soup didn't happen, simply because it was a good way to have it make sense such a small group could affect the rescue, but since there's nobody to be rescued... what did people expect? That the castle would be taken by a bunch of malnourished peasants liberated from a pen in the yard somewhere?

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I honestly don't understand all the complaints about not getting weasel soup. I mean, if TV Arya isn't known as "Weasel", how or why can they have weasel soup in the same way as the book? Get over it, people! Yes, it was a 'fun' part of the book with Arya, but in the overall context of her storyline across this asnd the next 3 books, it was a tiny little detail that really has absolutely no long term signficance. Talk about griping over inconsequential changes!

Well, I think the people that missed the weasel soup sequence would be happy if it happened and wasn't named weasel soup. Maybe it doesn't have long term signfificance, but if that's your view of what they should adapt, then they might as well skip all of Arya's scenes, since they don't impact the long term storyline at all.

Plus, it's not just the big moments that are important. That's where I feel like this season is failing. They're mainly just capturing the big moments and losing out on a lot of great little stuff and characterization. Weasel soup was one of my favorite parts in ACOK, especially Jaqen wiping the blood on Arya, so yeah, I feel like griping when it's taken out, especially when the new scenes that took the time away weren't very good.

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Bran and Rickon already in the crypts.....wtf

That's where they're supposed to be. Or are you just saying it was revealed too early?

The girl playing Arya seriously deserves an award. She has been the up there with Tyrion this season

Yeah, it seemed obvious from S1E1 that we had ourselves a little star.

Agreed. :)

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