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How would you rate episode 206?  

451 members have voted

  1. 1. What's your rating from 1-10, with 10 being the highest/best

    • 1
      2
    • 2
      7
    • 3
      9
    • 4
      10
    • 5
      17
    • 6
      21
    • 7
      48
    • 8
      86
    • 9
      144
    • 10
      105


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I gave it an 8. My issues with the episode were with Dany and the killing of Lorch. I do not even think of the books anymore when I watch the show or I would not enjoy it at all. Just leave the books at the door. I am fine with the stealing of the dragons. Not a problem. It is just Danny running around pissing and moaning that bothers me. But maybe that is a good thing for when she comes into true power. Not sure.

Lorch's killing was kind of lame. Jaqen's deaths should be more mystical/mysterious. But Arya rocks and I am really looking forward to some weasel soup.

Wish the Hound wore his helmet when he rescued Sansa. That would have been awesome but the scene was still great.

Littlefinger is the fastest man alive. Either that or Westeros is the size of Rhode Island.

I still think Talysa from Volantis is Jeyne Westerling. She just did not want to let Catelyn know. It looked like Robb still did not believe her. Not sure about the point of all of that but whatever. I guess it gives more screen time to Robb.

Shae did not disgust me in her scene. That is good.

Tyrion/Joff rocked.

All things Theon at Winterfell rocked.

Jon Snow and Ygrette was decent. Wish she was captured by Ghost and not Jon but whatever. Still a good intro. She should have said "You know nothing Jon Snow" when they were lying there.

Confused as to when Jon and Qorin will have their discussion/agreement about the wildlings.

Glad to hear Ramsey Snow will be around.

Osha nude was magnificent (sorry but it was). Loved seeing the escape with Rickon and Shaggydog!! I do wish they threw in the scene where the Iron Men were beating poor Hodor. Would have added to the severity of the situation. And given us more love for poor Hodor.

Overall an 8. May be 7.5.

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You've been bitten by the book purist bug. Take the antidote quickly.

But we love the books. A desire for the series to remain faithful to the source material is fair. While reading the books I didn't spend the whole time saying to myself Martin should have done this differently. If the changes are done for practical purposes it can come off nicely. But when the changes manipulate the plot and possibly eliminate favorite moments, people have a right to, and probably will be disappointed.

I have always enjoyed dany chapters (a pretty unpopular opinion around here) and found the dragon stealing to lower her competence to an unacceptable level (she is competent to me at this point in the story, don't shoot). I immediately understood that this is a lead in to the undying, but I still dont like how it hurts your opinion of the characters involved. This same reasoning applies to events at Harrenhall. Tywin and Jaq have been made to look like novices.

6/10. Tyrion and Theon save it.

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Oh, and again, glad we didnt get any useless sex scenes... hope they will continue this way, the first part of the season was really spoiling too much time for it and eating time for other stories... hope this is over !

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A nine. Poor Theon, he can't get anything right, respect from anybody or chopping off someone's head. Pleased to see that someone looks like he's getting tired of being called a dog. His rescue of Sansa was so him - there could have been a less brutal way, I guess, but that's what you get for messing with Sansa when the Hound's around. Also, I LOVE the continued interaction between Arya and Tywin. For the actress to hold her own in scenes with such a veteran is really promising for her future. If Littlefinger didn't make the connection, he's an idiot and he's definitely not an idiot. Can't wait to see Ramsay Snow, I mean Bolton, and hopefully Reek in the new season. My one quibble - Robb's flirting with Talisa / Jeyne (?) is just boring. I'd much rather see him and Greywind torment Jaime.

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Liked this episode. I gave it an 8.5. Yes, I realise that's not on the scale so had to give it an 8 - just didn't quite have that "9 factor" for me.

Good stuff:

- By the gawds what an opening. I love the shot of Theon's face after executing Rodrik. So intense.

- Ramsay Corpsefuckin' Bolton pretty much confirmed!

- Love the shake up in Qarth. Makes it much more exciting.

- The Harrenhal scenes were all great.

- The riot scenes were intense and scary and dope as fuck. Cersei threatening Tyrion! Tyrion steppin' to Joff! Sansa almost gang-raped! The High Septon getting torn to shreds! An old man getting punched! And The Hound finally getting to kick some ass!

- Tulisa wasn't as annoying this episode. There's hope yet.

Not so good stuff:

- Jon Snow scenes are boring yet again. I like Ygritte so far though.

- Irri, I hope she's not dead.

- Shae sucks. Bring Ros back!

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It just keeps on getting better!

The riot scene was my favorite! I was really worried for Sansa. The Hound was such as badass!

I actually found Dany scenes funny. "I did not come here to argue grammar!" hahaha

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I must admit I'm having real problems following Elio's and Linda's recaps lately.

Let me say that I have great respect for their enthusiasm, love, and knowledge of the Martin's world. Their reviews are thorough, well-written, and interesting to read.

But lately they are sounding more and more like uberfans that have trouble separating books and TV. I don't know what it is, but the nature of their critiques is increasingly becoming impenetrable and hard to follow, silly and excessive nit-picking is piling up, and overall sense of "that's not how it was in the books" is really starting to grate on me.

For my own part I have said from the start that I am completely uninterested in watching or commenting on this show just on its own merits. I am only interested in how well -- or not -- it adapts the books. We watch the show as fans of the books, we review it as fans of the books. That's it.

This does not mean it has to follow the letter, but it better follow the spirit of the story and stay true to the characters. The start to episode 6 is an example of excellent adaptation which compresses and changes but stays true to the story and the characters.

If you just want a bit of action, well, whatever.

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Considering I still haven't read the books, I would give this episode a 9/10 because it was incredibly engaing and dynamic!

Yes, perhaps Tywin is a little bit too tolerant, and Arya holding the note in her hand is quite annoying, but overall great acting for Maisie! Theon's conquest was so dramatic and bloodied, it makes you shiver. Perhaps Bran acted more like a modern child rather than a Medieval one (good point from an earlier comment posted here), but it definitely made the scene much more emotional. Oh, and Theon's butchering... horrid...

Cercei gave the best ice-cold and bitter look she could, and Tyrion slapping Joff again was priceless! We need more king-slaps! The Hound coming to the rescue was such a reliever as the rape scene looked quite authentic, although you cannot deny he acted more like a Terminator than a knight.

Jon and Ygritte were so cute! I'm jealous of Ygritte for rubbing her butt to Jon, but then again she is an incredibly beautiful and temperamental wildling :3 However, Jon capturing Ygritte instead of letting her escape is a deviation from the story, as far as I know, and it would be interesting to see how it will progress.

And Dany, oh God.... From what I read in this topic, Dany is much more shrewd and smart in the books than she is in season 2. All this whining, empty threats, and the perfectly logical and convincing replies of the Spice King definitely undermined the character.... With her dragons stolen now, I'm quite curious to see how she will reclaim them. Hopefully the House of the Undying is coming soon :) But yeah, TV-Dany is too whiny, acting more like a teenage-girl at the moment, rather than a Khaleesi and a mother of dragons....

Overall, the episode was very exciting, much more dynamic in the first half, with small bits of romance flowing in the air, and puddles of blood soaking Winterfell and King's Landing. It is a bit sad to know that some important parts of the plot are being changed in the TV-series, hopefully HBO will be more faithful to the books for the last 4 episodes of the season. Despite a few awkward/unconvincing moments and some book deviations, it was a very exciting and entertaining episode !

9/10

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Unless I'm mistaken, David and Dan themselves have made a great effort to emphasize that they're adapting the series and staying true to its spirit.

That's the benchmark they themselves have set. We merely judge them by that benchmark, since we are largely a site about the books, after all. If you take issue with it, that's more of an issue with the goals they themselves have articulated.

And no amount of ignoring the books makes the Lorch sequence any less stupid, whether you ignore the books or not. It was genuinely lazy, stupid writing that insults the intelligence of viewers.

ETA:

Or to put it more simply -- D&D have articulated two important aims for their adaptation: that it maintain the spirit of the novels and that it be good television. Good television sometimes means compression or outright changes, it is true, and as I've noted more than once, they have made some perfectly good choices in this regard, sometimes even inspired ones (the Bran-Theon scene combines elements from four different chapters, and fits them together in a unique and good way).

So... judge on those two axes: how much does a scene succeed to hew to the spirit of the novels, and how good is the scene as television? Judging the show purely as drama ignores the stated ambitions of the producers, just as judging it purely as an adaptation ignores it.

The problem is, even by your own defined standard of how you're reviewing it, I think you miss the mark. It IS staying true to the spirit of the novels, and I think you are in the minority in thinking it doesn't. I much prefer the analysis from two other fan sites, winteriscoming and avclub, both of whom have analyses using your basic guidelines and both of whom think the adaptation is very true to the spirit. When I see Myrcella crying as a criticism, it makes me question your entire analysis.

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honestly, it was not as good as I hoped it would be. The scene with Arya threw me off and the stuff about Dany's dragons being stolen... it doesn't seem to fit. I am pretty understanding when it comes to changing things for TV. However, it seems like somethings are added just for the added tension and not adding to the storytelling and condensing.

I will watch it again and see how I feel after that, but for now, it was a bit disappointing.

BTW even when GoT is disappointing it is still the best thing on TV.

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Is it me, or has this episode had the biggest gulf between people who liked it and people who didn't?

My guess is the people who discovered ASOIAF only after the TV show started are the ones who like it, probably because they are more used to standard TV fare, while all the real fans tend to dislike it.

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If i forget the book then its a 8.5, but compared to the book then its a 6. I dont know how i feel about the changes they have made from the book. Sometimes i think its good & it gives the readers of the book something new, but sometimes i think they should stay faithful to the books. I'm worried that butterfly effect of them changing things now will effect the show too much in further episodes & seasons. From small things like no Lady Tanda & Lolly's to bigger things like no Reeds. i guess time will tell.

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When I see Myrcella crying as a criticism, it makes me question your entire analysis.

Why? That was one of the defining moments for that character - at that age, to be sent away from her family and to not show emotion at it? Instead of changing into a Princess not just in name, she remains a child.. Did I care about this change specifically, not really - Myrcella has always been "meh" to me, but I always ask when I see changes of this natuer, why make this change? Why not just have her not cry? It doesn't lengthen the scene, cost any more, bring in any other characters. Why not just leave it as it is?

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The problem is, even by your own defined standard of how you're reviewing it, I think you miss the mark. It IS staying true to the spirit of the novels, and I think you are in the minority in thinking it doesn't. I much prefer the analysis from two other fan sites, winteriscoming and avclub, both of whom have analyses using your basic guidelines and both of whom think the adaptation is very true to the spirit. When I see Myrcella crying as a criticism, it makes me question your entire analysis.

That's nice. Then read their analysis instead. If anyone thinks that is true to the spirit of the books, I question their reading of the books and I have no interest in their analysis because it is coming from someone who doesn't really know what they are talking about.

Myrcella being noted as not crying was a rather defining aspect of that character.

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I don't rest my feelings on Myrcella or anything like that -- but we do try to be complete in noting all changes, that included (and as greywolf says, that actually helps define Myrcella...)

But the Lorch scene is bad TV, badly staged and badly written, with a humorous tone that's I'll-befitting the spirit of the novels. Can you imagine GRRM having written that scene and playing it for a laugh as the show did? I can't, and so it fails both tests, badly. I find it unaccountable how so few critics have noticed the lazy, dissonant writing of the Lorch scene (and the one before it, for that matter), but in any case, it felt symptomatic of an episode that leaned too heavily on contrivances that would get Mad Men or Breaking Bad or Justified taken to the woodshed by critics if scenes that were as contrived and clumsy made it onto those shows.

And again, there was some terrific writing in there, which is why the unevenness is all the more disappointing.

In the end, it's a sea of opinions. Read the ones that speak to you, and hang the rest.

Edited by Ran

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Unless I'm mistaken, David and Dan themselves have made a great effort to emphasize that they're adapting the series and staying true to its spirit.

That's the benchmark they themselves have set. We merely judge them by that benchmark, since we are largely a site about the books, after all. If you take issue with it, that's more of an issue with the goals they themselves have articulated.

And no amount of ignoring the books makes the Lorch sequence any less stupid, whether you ignore the books or not. It was genuinely lazy, stupid writing that insults the intelligence of viewers.

ETA:

Or to put it more simply -- D&D have articulated two important aims for their adaptation: that it maintain the spirit of the novels and that it be good television. Good television sometimes means compression or outright changes, it is true, and as I've noted more than once, they have made some perfectly good choices in this regard, sometimes even inspired ones (the Bran-Theon scene combines elements from four different chapters, and fits them together in a unique and good way).

So... judge on those two axes: how much does a scene succeed to hew to the spirit of the novels, and how good is the scene as television? Judging the show purely as drama ignores the stated ambitions of the producers, just as judging it purely as an adaptation ignores it.

While I agree with the content of your comment, I fail to see how you (or anyone) can judge this at this point, when these diversions from the storyline have not run their full course.

There have been a multitude of complaints about immaterial things (peaches! Xaro is straight!). At least fifty percent, if not more, of the complaints seem to revolve around these types of issues. We all have favorite things -- they cut one of my favorite book lines period from last night for no apparent reason -- but sometimes we have to get over them. Even such things as potentially cutting the Reeds fall here under your definition, which I am all good with.

But Dany's dragon getting stolen? Jon and Ygritte being together earlier? I suppose some of these could lead to truly substantial changes, but right now it's pretty easy to get back to thematic and character consistency and also hit major plot points. (E.g. people are freaking that we won't get Qhorin/Jon. It's possible we won't. It's possible it won't be like in the books, with Qhorin losing on purpose. But it's still possible we'll end up exactly where we started but with a better basis for allowing Jon to join the wildings, more Jon plot in season 2 and more Ygritte.)

I've frankly seen very few significant and permanent departures. I haven't seen anything with unavoidable butterfly effects on the main characters.

I rated this episode a 9.

It was fantastic to have a plot-filled action episode. The Bran-Theon scenes were amazing. I like the extension with Ygritte as long as they can get back to the story.

I like the stolen dragons storyline -- Dany's book plot is slow. I wasn't a huge fan of yet another verbal sparring session with the Spice King, but I do enjoy that they are dragging out Dany' progression as a person. In season one she went from weak and quiet to strong and loud. But she really hasn't discovered what it means to rule, and frankly, she's a tremendously selfish person right now. She will evolve between now and Mereen -- where she makes a decision to stop using everyone around her.

The riot scene was fantastic, and we finally get a little Sandor and Sansa. I didn't mind the Arya changes, either -- one, it provides better motivation for not picking someone more strategic and two, I don't mind a little more light-hearted aspects. I'm still reeling from the darkness of Episode 4, and there's still more darkness to come -- in Winterfell, in King's Landing, etc -- so a bit of levity doesn't bother me. I think the Littlefinger scene is a bit ridiculous until you realize he knows it is her -- and then you start thinking about why he didn't tell.

Anyway, exciting fun episode. It had more problems than some other recent ones, but more upside as well. The season has been devoid of much action and like last year's episode 6, it's time to start rolling.

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That's nice. Then read their analysis instead. If anyone thinks that is true to the spirit of the books, I question their reading of the books and I have no interest in their analysis because it is coming from someone who doesn't really know what they are talking about.

Myrcella being noted as not crying was a rather defining aspect of that character.

So if people disagree with you they don't know what they're talking about? Almost every analysis I read favours this episode, the main aim of an episode is to entertain which is succesful it seems. I don't agree that making up plots will ruin the main story at all... I always wondered why Dany never had her dragons stolen when her khalasar was so small and weak in the books. The only thing I agree with is the part about Amory dying, but I didn't mind it because I enjoyed it, overall.

Edited by Michaelj

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You've been bitten by the book purist bug. Take the antidote quickly.

Seems to me you misinterpreted what I was trying to say, namely I was exactly in line with your reasoning :cheers:

Edited by Mr Fixit

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My guess is the people who discovered ASOIAF only after the TV show started are the ones who like it, probably because they are more used to standard TV fare, while all the real fans tend to dislike it.

You tell'em, tiger.

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