[TWoW Spoilers] The Winds of Winter - OUR PREDICTIONS -

[NotSoSilentSister]

GRRM said somewhere there will be something like the Red Wedding again.This implies a great betrayl and the death of heads of a House and their children.

This is an interesting observation. One could argue about the implications. Your reading is certainly a possibility.

Others take it to mean that some shit will go down at the Frey/Lannister wedding - a Blackfish/BWB insurgence. I kind of like that line of thinking because it would fit in with various other theories I have, but getting hung up on the word "Wedding" might indeed be a somewhat superficial take on it. It might just be something that Martin found difficult to write, because it's emotionally traumatizing.

It's interesting to speculate what, after all the torture and massacres, Martin still finds particularly difficult to write about. A betrayal of a beloved character? I just don't think he will kill of Dany, Tyrion or any of the Starks in the next book and I'm not sure what other character's death could have a traumatizing impact of Red Wedding proportions. Brienne delivering Jaime would be tragic, but in a way he had it coming, we expect it. The same applies to the death of Tommen and/or Marcella (not that they had it coming, but that we expect it). We are emotionally prepared for that. A humanitarian disaster? Cersei burning down King's Landing, killing not just herself and Tommen but also all the court and all the smallfolk? It is forshadowed in a way, when she gets all pyromanical about burning down the Tower of the Hand.

Are there any other big taboos in Westeros about from incest, kinslaying and violating guestright, that have not been breached in a devastating fashion yet?

A fairly sympathetic character turning irredeemably evil too could be difficult to write about. Dany going full-mad Aerys? Stannis sacrificing Shireen? (Shades of Iphigenia of Tauris?)

[Annikina]

A fairly sympathetic character turning irredeemably evil too could be difficult to write about. Dany going full-mad Aerys? Stannis sacrificing Shireen? (Shades of Iphigenia of Tauris?)

I don't want to sound bitchy, but Stannis sacrificing Shireen wouldn't traumatize me not even nearly like the Red Wedding did. As far as I know, there were people who liked Robb, who disliked him, who loved (me!) or hated him - but not one of them hasn't been at least touched by the Red Wedding, and doesn't agree defining it cruel and needless.

I don't know why, but I don't think I'd find this kind of attachment for Shireen. It's different from what (we thought) happened to Bran and Rickon, say. Shireen is still secondary - if not tertiary - character. However sad and pointless her death would be - and even more so if it was Stannis himself to sacrifice his daughter - I don't think it would raise the same feelings. I know I can appear cuel saying this, but it is true.

In my opinion, the most hunting things after A Storm of Swords have been the Reek chapters in ADWD. How I hated them!

[NotSoSilentSister]

I don't know why, but I don't think I'd find this kind of attachment for Shireen. It's different from what (we thought) happened to Bran and Rickon, say. Shireen is still secondary - if not tertiary - character. However sad and pointless her death would be - and even more so if it was Stannis himself to sacrifice his daughter - I don't think it would raise the same feelings. I know I can appear cuel saying this, but it is true.

Well, people might not be terribly attached to Shireen, but some people here seem to feel pretty strongly about Stannis, and if he actually were to sacrifice his daughter, I hope we all would agree that he's beyond redemption. It would be the worst thing any of the somewhat sympathetic characters would have done so far (even Jaime trying to kill Bran is not as bad as Stannis killing his own daughter would be), so Martin might well find that difficult to write.

But I agree it probably wouldn't have quite the impact the Red Wedding had. It's a tough act to follow. In order to create a WTF moment of similar traumatizing potential, the event would have to

1) be equally shocking - so it couldn't be any of the heavily forshadowed deaths, like Jaime killed by UnCat or the death of Tommen or Myrcella (and in my opinion, any Nissa-Nissa redo with Dany or Melisandre or whomever)

2) kill at least one first-tier/POV character, ideally a Stark (cum direwolf), Tyrion or Dany

3) also kill a lot of other people; I don't think that any individual character death would gut me quite as much as that bloody massacre

4) involve some kind of outrageous injustice, a betrayal, a violation of an important Westerosi taboo - we already had quite a bit of kinslaying with Stannis and Tyrion, but I guess it would be more devastating if it involved a family member you are actually emotionally attached to.

I think Jon being stabbed by his sworn brothers might hit all the marks, if he actually stays dead, that is. It has not had quite the impact of the Red Wedding yet, because most readers believe Jon will be back, and in a better condition than UnCat.

[Dumptruck]

I am the biggest lurker around but you have moved me to remember so pretty thought provoking conclusions, in no particular order, omitting predictions but seeing the "players" possible moves or future allainces.

A this point in our majestic and epice tale we have what I believe is plenty of charectors to complete the story, while new people may appear the important ones stories will play out in the next 3 that's right three books. i will predict that Ser Martin will have a muse and crank out two books very quickly at some point, there is too many factors to list the least of which is you strike while the iron is hot and nother Book is just too lucrative to not cause inspiration. Not saying a lack of integrity on our leige lords part it's just that he has a lot too say about this huge world.

Arya Stark: We refer to her as Arya only too often, she is a Stark thru and thru when she learns about what has beenhappening and feels empowered she will return to exact revenge, save her brothers and her Wolf she is warg as well coupled with the FM training she is a force.

Jaquin gave her a coin "If the time comes that you shall need me again just give this coin to any man in Bravos and you shall find me" (Paraphrase). we know he is in Oldtown, Sam is in Oldtown this is a tidy way for her to get informatin and allies. Gendry is not lost to her and will fight by her side if asked by a now mature and cunning Arya of house Stark. This is how I see her returning gaining information, fighters and a ferocious Wolf Pack led by a She wolf from hell. I can see Sam brave when he meets her wolf after knowing Ghost.

Ghost, Jon appearing to die and Dragons in Winterfell.

All related somehow, Ghost was named for Jon's story line IMHO what better Wolf to house a dead mans essence for a while untill he comes back relieved of being LCONW. Who and what Jon is I do not know but can hardly wait to find out.

Winterfell Dragon-Hot springs nuff said it exists bound to the Starks (all Starks are Wargs).

Danny is coming back with the Largest Dothraki host ever-when she see's Jorah with a Slave Tattoo all will be forgiven

No time for the rest now

[aryagonnakill]

I've seen some posts on here about Stannis burning Shireen. I don't think thats very practical but I do think that if crazyness go's down at the wall and Stannis' bitchy wife gets the axe, or maybe even not, that Mel might burn Shireen to bring back Jon. Mel is smart enough to know that Val isn't considered a queen by anyone, she knows the babe isn't Mance's, Aemon is gone, Shireen is the only one left with kings blood.

[Annikina]

I honestly hope that something big is up with Daenerys, and about to happen. For how much I love her character - and I do - her chapters in ADWD were almost too much to bare, I couldn't stand them anymore. Nothing was happening that didn't happen also in ACOK and ASOS, just the same things over and over again. Hence, there must be some reason for her for not have moved to Asshai, if not go over the sea to Westeros. We may have seen the beginning of it with her in the desert with Drogon, meeting the Dothraki again. Better live up to the waiting now.

Same goes for Tyrion, by the way. He's one of my favorites, but the line "where do the whores go?" is getting old and stale, I hardly stand it anymore. He has done more than Daenerys, this is true (The Citadel, Young Griffin, the Free Companies etc) but that's that.

The Winds Of Winter calls for some BAMF awesomeness.

I agree to the "dragons in Winterfell" theory, btw.

[Timebean]

This is too much fun but doomed to be all wrong because old George loves surprises...but here goes.

Arya - I think she still has alot of training to go through, but I think she may end up back in Westeros soon...maybe to shadow another assasin to learn some new tricks. The Bravoosi bank has all kinds of folks who haven't paid their debts, so it could be someone high up that she gets the chance to assasinate...maybe even Cersei? Or the old master of coin, Littlefinger? It may be the way to get her hooked back up with Sansa (what a reunion)!!

Jagan Hagar - OH! it is killing me trying to figure out what he is doing in Oldtown. I would love a few POVs from him. He is an assasin, so who is he there to kill? I thought it might be Marwyn the Mage (he has stepped on alot of toes) but Marwyn split. Maybe a Hightower (he needs those keys to get to someone who doesn't walk around alot)? Thing is, he was (possibly) on his way to the Wall with Yoren when things went all to hell. Maybe he is after Sam for some weird reason. But who would want Sam killed? Arrgg, it is too much, I can't speculate without sounding an utter fool!

Davos - I think it is wistful thinking that he will find Rickon. It is too neat and simple for George's style.

Tyrion - I can't see Dany or Selmy embracing him, really. The problem is that Tyrion is a kinslayer now, and I think it makes it more difficut for him to be accepted anywhere, despite his knowledge/wit. We love him, but no one in the book does. I think he may end up back in Westeros as part of the company. Maybe they will be hired by Stannis's knight? I would love for him to hook back up with Jaime...

Dany - I think Dany is on her way to Asshai. I have a feeling she needs to go there (the east/west, light/shadow prophecy). I think Quaithe is there and has been commuinicating with Dany via the glass candles (or some other form of magic). I think she will find real answers there and come closer to her true purpose. I mean, the lamest way this can end is with Dany on the throne. She is a terrible ruler!! :)

Jon - I don't think he will be "reanimated" - I think he just gets hurt really bad, realizes his warging powers more fully and understands he can use that somehow. Maybe in a warging/dream state he can communicate with Bran and get a bit of insight.

Bran - is not going to have anything to do with the dragons. That is not his purpose. I think Bran's purpose is to pass on the knowledge from the past and from the children of the forest. The children's magic and that of the dragons are not the same thing.

Victarion is going to be around for a while. George loves this character (look how fun he is to read...imagine how fun he is to write!!). No, he is going to be a major player! He has the greatest fleet out there (except for maybe the Bravossi). Got to be important.

Someone crews up big time, the Wall comes down, and that will be at the very end of the book (to drive us mad!!).

Anyway, that is my two cents!

[TheeMikeHoncho]

If there is a betrayal similar to the Red Wedding, I would assume it will happen either at Sansa's wedding or it will happen to Dany. Unless when he said this it was before the whole Jon/Caesar thing...

it already did happen to dany- someone tried to poison her at her own wedding after all.

[TheeMikeHoncho]

I've seen some posts on here about Stannis burning Shireen. I don't think thats very practical but I do think that if crazyness go's down at the wall and Stannis' bitchy wife gets the axe, or maybe even not, that Mel might burn Shireen to bring back Jon. Mel is smart enough to know that Val isn't considered a queen by anyone, she knows the babe isn't Mance's, Aemon is gone, Shireen is the only one left with kings blood.

Shireen isnt the only one left with Kings Blood- Stannis has Theon.

[phanks7]

I've read a lot of these posts, but not all of them, so if I repeat some of the predictions, please forgive me. Ignore all the grammatical errors. Some of these predictions are vague, and I realize that.

Jon - He is my favorite character, but he is dead. FORTUNATELY, Mel is going to rez him and make a puppet out of him like Stannis and Mance. I think Jon will eventually begin to distrust her again, but not until the last book. Also, he is Rhaegar's boy and will be a dragon rider, but other than that I have no clue.

Mel - She wrote the letter to Jon, knowing that it would infuriate him to the point of breaking his vows. She knows this will get him killed, so she can rez him and control him.

Night's Watch - It will be torn apart by internal rife w/o Jon there and ultimately disband or be obliterated. I think it will be reformed one day though.

The North (in general) - The wall will be torn down and all the "mythical" creatures will move south. I don't think the North will ever regain all the land. It will belong to the creatures that were there before men. I see the whitewalkers as an army meant to reclaim what is theirs, but that's just my opinion. This will not happen until the last book though.

Tyrian - He will get in good with Victarion and Selme. He will be a dragonrider, as well. Jon and he were buddies and I think he and Dany will have something similar if they ever meet.

Dany - She will head east, instead of west and will unite all of the Dothraki. He she will launch the first assault on Westeros by the end of WoW, but from the opposite direction. She will find a way to contact Selme and have him (Victarion and Tyrian too) attack from the other coast.

Davos - He is the most honest and good-hearted man in the book imo and for this reason he must die. Yes, he is a smuggler, but compared to the evil shit everyone else is doing he is a saint. GRRM makes it very clear that honor doesn't keep you alive, as we have seen with Ned and Rob. I can see two different scenarios next book. One, Rickon isn't where Manderly said, so he sent Davos on a wild goose chase and is really hiding Rickon at WH. Two, Davos finds Rickon and brings him back to the North only to be blind-sided by Stark supporters. Nobody likes Stannis and they are just settling for him, so soon as there is a Stark again they will abandon Stannis. Davos will not die until the end of WoW or maybe the beginning of book 7.

Rickon - He will be the lord of WF and will be a badass after living with Osha.

Bran - He will never see WF again, walk again, or climb again, with his body. He will have the biggest impact on Westeros imo, because he will have knowledge and knowledge is power! I think he will talk through Shireen's jester, as well as, Theon to relay his info.

Benjin Stark - He is Cold Hands or Ned Stark is. I can't remember if Ned's bones ever made it to WF or not, so please correct me if I am wrong.

Jaime and Brienne - The crime fighting duo!!! They will do something awesome, but I haven't a clue as to what it might be.

Cersei - She will kill all the Tyrel's and really screw shit up, and Sansa is the pretty young girl that threatens her position, but she obviously thinks it to be Marg. Tyrian will kill her eventually.

Gendry - He will lead the BWB after Lady Stoneheart goes batshit crazier and loses all her support. He will learn that he is Rob's bastard, and be heir to Storm's End once Stannis dies.

Stannis - He will die and I feel like he has to die. I personally feel that anyone that feels entitled to the throne does not deserve it and will perish attaining it in this series. I think the North will betray him when Rickon is discovered.

Theon - he will be Bran's relayer of information and rule the Iron Island's one day, but I'm not sure if he can have heirs or not, so that kind of presents an issue.

Arya - She will receive most of the essential Faceless Men training, but will not be enveloped by all the ideology. Something will happen, which will draw her back to Westeros and her Nymeria (and the big ass pack of wolves). I can't figure out where she fits in the grand scheme of things, but I'm sure we will have an idea by the end of WoW.

Sansa - She will find her way back to KL again, but this time with LF's training. She will see Cersei's death and become Queen somehow.

Littlefinger - One of my favorite characters. Kings and queens are just peices on a chessboard to him and he plays the game well. His lust/love for Sansa will be is downfall. His penis will get him killed.

[Stark@heart]

Is it just me or does anyone else think that Rickon has been missing for too long?

I think he's gone for good - I see something like the Legend of the Lost Wolf springing up around Rickon.

Maybe twenty years in the future he'll return to Winterfell but not during the ASOI&F series.

[Volantis]

^Mace Tarly has proven to be smart and a good battle commander so he would probably realize all those facts.

Hahahaha

[oprahnoodlemantra]

I'm really excited to see what happens in the Vale with Littlefinger and Sansa. Once Rickon is revealed and Sansa has the Vale through marriage will they be on opposing sides? Rickon would be Wymen Manderly's tool to get Northern lords to declare for Stannis but how could they not consider declaring for Sansa? Will Littlefinger advise her to declare for Stannis or fight against Stannis? I'm assuming Sansa will want to declare for Stannis but Littlefinger will tell her not to and she'll kill him then ally with Stannis because that's what Ned would have done. Her scheming will be encouraged by Mya Stone and Myranda Royce.

I'm looking forward to the battle for Winterfell, the battle in Meereen, a battle at the Wall between the NW and the wildlings, and a possible battle at Oldtown between the Redwyns and Euron Greyjoy. Maybe there will also be a battle in the Stormlands or King's Landing between Aegon and the Tyrells/Lannisters.

[Annikina]

Shireen isnt the only one left with Kings Blood- Stannis has Theon.

I'd love for Melisandre to kill Theon. I know it sounds cruel, but he has been through too much already, probably killing him would be pityful - he's nuts. Although I guess that setting him on fire until he dies is not a really mercyful end...

The other option would be for Theon/Reek to kill Ramsay Boulton. Now, that is something I'd enjoy reading- I hate the bastard!

[TheeMikeHoncho]

I'd love for Melisandre to kill Theon. I know it sounds cruel, but he has been through too much already, probably killing him would be pityful - he's nuts. Although I guess that setting him on fire until he dies is not a really mercyful end...

The other option would be for Theon/Reek to kill Ramsay Boulton. Now, that is something I'd enjoy reading- I hate the bastard!

That would be great, but in another post I suggested that Asha should be the one for 2 reasons- for Theon and all the women savaged by him.

[Sharf]

Here are my predictions ( in short ) :

Victarion is killed in battle. *The dusky woman is actually Euron*. He has one of his men blow the dragon horn. The story arc ends in a cliffhanger.

I think you're really on to something here Alex. How did I miss this? In an attempt to further destroy Victarions psyche, Euron has morphed into the Dusky woman and is having repeated intercourse with him. After stealing his wife and destroying his marriage, the only logical next move for Euron would be to actually sleep with his brother himself.

The one place where your theory goes astray is in the matter of Victarions death. I don't think he's killed in battle. Rather, after Euron reveals himself to be the Dusky woman, Victarion is incredibly distraught. Not only did his wife have an affair with Euron, but realizing he has also had an affair with Euron, Victarion takes it upon himself to actually kill....himself?

How this all plays into the broader plot line is anyone's guess.

[Lord Liam DarkStark]

I've read a lot of these posts, but not all of them, so if I repeat some of the predictions, please forgive me. Ignore all the grammatical errors. Some of these predictions are vague, and I realize that.

Jon - He is my favorite character, but he is dead. FORTUNATELY, Mel is going to rez him and make a puppet out of him like Stannis and Mance. I think Jon will eventually begin to distrust her again, but not until the last book. Also, he is Rhaegar's boy and will be a dragon rider, but other than that I have no clue.

Mel - She wrote the letter to Jon, knowing that it would infuriate him to the point of breaking his vows. She knows this will get him killed, so she can rez him and control him.

Night's Watch - It will be torn apart by internal rife w/o Jon there and ultimately disband or be obliterated. I think it will be reformed one day though.

The North (in general) - The wall will be torn down and all the "mythical" creatures will move south. I don't think the North will ever regain all the land. It will belong to the creatures that were there before men. I see the whitewalkers as an army meant to reclaim what is theirs, but that's just my opinion. This will not happen until the last book though.

Tyrian - He will get in good with Victarion and Selme. He will be a dragonrider, as well. Jon and he were buddies and I think he and Dany will have something similar if they ever meet.

Dany - She will head east, instead of west and will unite all of the Dothraki. He she will launch the first assault on Westeros by the end of WoW, but from the opposite direction. She will find a way to contact Selme and have him (Victarion and Tyrian too) attack from the other coast.

Davos - He is the most honest and good-hearted man in the book imo and for this reason he must die. Yes, he is a smuggler, but compared to the evil shit everyone else is doing he is a saint. GRRM makes it very clear that honor doesn't keep you alive, as we have seen with Ned and Rob. I can see two different scenarios next book. One, Rickon isn't where Manderly said, so he sent Davos on a wild goose chase and is really hiding Rickon at WH. Two, Davos finds Rickon and brings him back to the North only to be blind-sided by Stark supporters. Nobody likes Stannis and they are just settling for him, so soon as there is a Stark again they will abandon Stannis. Davos will not die until the end of WoW or maybe the beginning of book 7.

Rickon - He will be the lord of WF and will be a badass after living with Osha.

Bran - He will never see WF again, walk again, or climb again, with his body. He will have the biggest impact on Westeros imo, because he will have knowledge and knowledge is power! I think he will talk through Shireen's jester, as well as, Theon to relay his info.

Benjin Stark - He is Cold Hands or Ned Stark is. I can't remember if Ned's bones ever made it to WF or not, so please correct me if I am wrong.

Jaime and Brienne - The crime fighting duo!!! They will do something awesome, but I haven't a clue as to what it might be.

Cersei - She will kill all the Tyrel's and really screw shit up, and Sansa is the pretty young girl that threatens her position, but she obviously thinks it to be Marg. Tyrian will kill her eventually.

Gendry - He will lead the BWB after Lady Stoneheart goes batshit crazier and loses all her support. He will learn that he is Rob's bastard, and be heir to Storm's End once Stannis dies.

Stannis - He will die and I feel like he has to die. I personally feel that anyone that feels entitled to the throne does not deserve it and will perish attaining it in this series. I think the North will betray him when Rickon is discovered.

Theon - he will be Bran's relayer of information and rule the Iron Island's one day, but I'm not sure if he can have heirs or not, so that kind of presents an issue.

Arya - She will receive most of the essential Faceless Men training, but will not be enveloped by all the ideology. Something will happen, which will draw her back to Westeros and her Nymeria (and the big ass pack of wolves). I can't figure out where she fits in the grand scheme of things, but I'm sure we will have an idea by the end of WoW.

Sansa - She will find her way back to KL again, but this time with LF's training. She will see Cersei's death and become Queen somehow.

Littlefinger - One of my favorite characters. Kings and queens are just peices on a chessboard to him and he plays the game well. His lust/love for Sansa will be is downfall. His penis will get him killed.

Wow. Now those are crackpot. There are too many holes in your ideas to name them all. But I'll start with sansa becoming queen. How will she be queen? Aegon? I don't think sansa is the younger more beautiful queen. That has to be or should be dany. And there is big indication Tyrion or JAMIE WILL KILL CERSEI after she sees her children die. But shireen's fool is always in mel's visions surrounded by death. Theon has no penis. So I doubt he'll ever lead the ironborn especially since he is week and they don't follow the weak. Ned stark's bones are lost in the neck maybe with howland reed and lady maege mormont. Coldhand's might be benjen. I've thought that before. Rickon I think will become wild with osha. Cause the stark wolves match their master's and his is the wild shaggydog. I think sansa is just a damsel that will learn to save herself. A play on the damsel being saved by the knight. Davos may die on skagos or save rickon. Its hard to say. LF may die thanks to sansa. But how or by who I don't know.

[Lord Liam DarkStark]

^ Your clarification about the Dornish armies is spot on in my opinion. Mace Tarly has proven to be smart and a good battle commander so he would probably realize all those facts. Also the part about delaying a trial so it could be 7 on 7 would provide a way for Sandor to get to Kings Landing from the quite isle.

Please tell me where mace tyrell proved himself as smart and a good commande...All the evidence shows quite the opposite. Listen to the queen of thornes.

[By the Old Gods Not theNew]

im pretty sure that was a typo, because it was in reference to a discussion about Randyll Tarly aryagonnakill just switched up Mace and Randyll - thus Randyll Tarly became Mace Tarly - which is understandable considering the similarity of their last names and close association.

[Tony Soprano]

I think you're really on to something here Alex. How did I miss this? In an attempt to further destroy Victarions psyche, Euron has morphed into the Dusky woman and is having repeated intercourse with him. After stealing his wife and destroying his marriage, the only logical next move for Euron would be to actually sleep with his brother himself.

The one place where your theory goes astray is in the matter of Victarions death. I don't think he's killed in battle. Rather, after Euron reveals himself to be the Dusky woman, Victarion is incredibly distraught. Not only did his wife have an affair with Euron, but realizing he has also had an affair with Euron, Victarion takes it upon himself to actually kill....himself?

How this all plays into the broader plot line is anyone's guess.

You're new here, so you probably don't know, but I've said countless of times that I misspoke.

I meant to say the dusky woman is actually working for Euron. That's she'll eventually betray Victarion once he's outlived his usefulness, and somehow, the horn will end up in Euron's hands once again.