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Umberto

[Book Spoilers] The Bastard of Bolton confirmed

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They can do plenty of Theon/Ramsay scenes next season. They are going to be super creepy, torture scenes, but we will get to see Theons transformation into Reek. They can also add to the Ramsay freakshow by showing the Lady Hornwood scene next season too.

Kyra and the keys. That creeped me out so much. It would be good/bad to see in real time.

They really should transplant the Criminal Minds people into Westeros.

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They can do plenty of Theon/Ramsay scenes next season. They are going to be super creepy, torture scenes, but we will get to see Theons transformation into Reek. They can also add to the Ramsay freakshow by showing the Lady Hornwood scene next season too.

How is that going to play on TV, though? The scene with Joff, Roz and the other prostitute was wince inducing for many - and that only implied the worst part of it. Flaying is another step beyond that.

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My thoughts on this are as follows: Asha/Yara comes to Winterfell with no reinforcements, just like in the books, Theon refuses to withdraw from the castle. Dagmer and the other Ironborn under the command of Theon see this as a threat to their lives (considering they will soon be attacked by a superior northern force) they sell Theon out to the besiegers (one of whom is perhaps the masked Ramsay) only to be cut down and maybe end with the sack of winterfell to confuse things up.

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they can think of another way that Reek appears.... now that it has been confirmed there are 2 Boltons, all of my worries are out the window. I said it before, D&D love Theon's story, they will take extra care in not ruining it.

I agree with you that the producers really seem to like the Theon tragedy story and are using it as one of the main themes for the show when it was only one of many side stories in the book. They're playing it up a lot more for the show so I'm quite sure they will have the "Reek" story line in there bold and creepy as can be - which means with pretty much all certainty Ramsay will make an appearance. I don't think it will be this season however. They've already said some things from the third book are being moved up to season 2 and some things from book 2 delayed until season 3 (which for me I hope means the Reeds will also still make an appearance when Bran and Rickon start their journey).

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Perhaps D&D will try to give tv people some of the same surprise book readers got by trying to conceal the new Reek's identity. If we see the original Reek in a gimp like mask then insinuate Theon's death. Maybe they can get A little surprise when he's revealed. I know it's a lot to ask, but I was caught off guard when I read it, and I want my non-reader friends to get a little of that.

(null)

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How is that going to play on TV, though? The scene with Joff, Roz and the other prostitute was wince inducing for many - and that only implied the worst part of it. Flaying is another step beyond that.

I don't think David and Dan are afraid to push the envelope and do it. It's not like you have to show the skin peeling off. Just Ramsay prepping the flaying knife and Theon freaking out. Ramsay creeps me out in the books, he has to be a horror movie esque villain in the show and to do that you show what he does to Theon. You also see Theons demise into insanity. Creepy? For sure. Great drama? Yessir.

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How is that going to play on TV, though? The scene with Joff, Roz and the other prostitute was wince inducing for many - and that only implied the worst part of it. Flaying is another step beyond that.

In terms of human torture/killing, I can't think of anything worse than a man being flayed alive in a scene, it's several volumes worse than even a gruesome beheading, like Ser Rodrick's was.

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If HBO feels like televised flaying is the next step they need to take we will see us some televised flayin'

People still believe they can rely on the book format to predict how the rest of this season will play out and how the next one begins?

Really?

Theon's arc this year has already been emotionally packed and surprising, especially for audiences that have purely watched the show.

I'm starting to believe the sack of Winterfell won't happen early next season.

In episode 8 he holds down the fort, the visitor is probably his sister, episode 9 is supposedly going to focus purely on the Battle of Blackwater.

Maybe the Theon ending will be the miller boys... I wonder if they'll show it for a scam right away or manipulate us in thinking they really are who they are posed as...

They have said several times that they have move things around.

One thing that I'm disappointed in is that the Ironborn will be flaying first. Shouldn't they be drowning someone by now?

This is the reason people get stuck on the possibility of Dagmer being Ramsay because they've given him some of Boltons early role.

HBO didn't feel the need to cram Ramsay in so early. Some of you worry about managing the Theon character and ultimately believe they'd end his arc and leave it so abruptly.

They can milk it. This season is his downfall, next season is his punishment...

If they somehow secretly slipped that Cilian Murphy guy in this season I'd fall over backwards.

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I know this is a little off topic (and Im not sure if this is in another thread), but there is another pure evil, very important character whom is prevalent in the 2nd book, that has had no appearance or character development thus far: The Mountain that Rides. Why? He was cast last season, he seems to be an important character moving forward, what with the trial by battle w/ Oberyn, and assumed transformation into Ser Robert Strong... What gives? Thought HE took Harrenhal, etc. Anyways, like I said off topic a bit, but still wondering why he's been left out.

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Because HBO will most likely recast Conan for season 3&4 and just wanted Ian to be a presence this season.

As an actor it is more worthwhile to save himself up when he can at least be featured in 3-4 episodes a season.

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Dagmer = Ramsay theory seemed interesting until I found out the guy who plays Dagmer is four years OLDER then the feller who plays Daddy Bolton.

I would have been excited by the idea simply because I like the dynamic these two have had so far, with Dagmer being the little bird manipulating Theon's every move. However, people note the glaring hole over why/how the Ironborn would accept the dude in the first place. But Dagmer just being Dagmer with his whispers still works, cuz it's a constant reminder to Theon that he needs to try his bestest at being an Ironborn to make daddy proud and piss on his sister. Still wish it was Reek doing it, though, but this works..

Since Rodrick has been done for by Theon, I really really really hope Ramsay turns off Luwin's light.

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You're right about that.

Dagmer's show role is logical. It feels more natural as well in this compressed time not to have the audience have to wonder why Theon takes advice from a shit covered dirtbag rather than an accomplished warrior from this mysterious "squid island people" that HBO wants to establish.

They also don't have much time to win us over with Yara. Could still be epic with that one despite the contested casting.

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@Bastard of Bolton, that would be insane if Theons last scene shows Ramsey taking off his helm and it's Cillian Murphy, I think book readers will crap themselves haha.

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I really think Dagmer = Ramsay Snow. Yeah, theory's got some holes in it, but think about it:

-We've had no confimration that Dagmer is in fact ironborn, we haven't seen him interacting with any of his fellow iron islanders.

-He's taken the role of the devil on Theon's shoulder, which is exactly what 'Reek' does in the book at this point.

-Roose knew Theon was being sent back to Pyke, and could have sent word to his bastard to follow him and keep an eye on things: Roose may not have known the Greyjoys would rise against the Starks, but was aware of the possibility. Roose may say his bastard's in the Dreadfort but we all know just how trustworthy Roose is.

Someone pointed out that the actor of Dagmer is older than the actor of Roose but... he doesn't look too much older, they could get away with it.

'Dagmer' has been given way too much screen time to just be randomly killed when the Bastard of Bolton arrives. He's gotta have some wider significance.

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Well, the fact remains that Dagmer's actor is older than Roose's. That alone is the red light for me; it would be awkward as hell to see them interact.

Ramsay's presumably in his twenties. No age is ever really given, but he's described as a "young man" and almost certainly not a teen. Why age him up with an actor older than the guy playing his father? :P

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@Bastard of Bolton, that would be insane if Theons last scene shows Ramsey taking off his helm and it's Cillian Murphy, I think book readers will crap themselves haha.

That would be just perfect !

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For all the people arguing that HBO is not going to show Theon being flayed at the Dreadfort.... go watch Season 3 of Dexter. There's a villain called the Skinner in that season, and you see people both living and dead who have been wholly or partially flayed. I believe you even see the dead body of a teenage boy who has been flayed. So i don't think HBO showing us Theon's transformation into Reek, losing his fingers etc. is out of the question AT ALL for reasons of graphic-ness. It's been done before and as far as I know there was no outcry or anything. They will probably cut away from the actual act of flaying, but that's easily done. They could even just focus in on Ramsay's sick grin as he's doing it while Theon screams. It will turn heads to be sure, but really, we WANT Ramsay to turn heads!

All in all I think there's enough material in that storyline for Theon to have about as much material in Season 3 and 4 as Jaime is getting this season. We can get a scene of <insert show replacement for Kyra here> freeing Theon and them going on the run, only to be hunted down by Ramsay and his dogs, at which point it's revealed it was all Ramsay's sick game. Then Ramsay doling out his "punishment" to them both. Would be affecting as HELL, and perfect to set Ramsay up to take Joffrey's place as the show's prime sadistic sociopath. We could also conceivably have the Lady Hornwood subplot play out after Theon's a captive at the Dreadfort.

EDIT: The castration will I hope still be implied...although Spartacus: Blood and Sand showed even that...(I don't much care for that show)

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I agree, at least three scenes, or four, might be the idea next season:

- First torture, flaying.

- Escape with Kyra.

- Another flying scene, more vicious and violent.

- Him alone in the cells trying to catch rats.

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