Jump to content

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

teemo

[Book Spoilers] Nitpick without repercussion!

Recommended Posts

I'm the furthest thing from a purist, mind you, as long as the changes are better, but I don't like the changes to Jon or his story one bit. They lost all the tension of them being hunted to focus all on the tension in Jon's pants.

Not to mention they've made him completely incompetent, along with Qhorin and the rest. It also makes absolutely no sense how Jon lost them in the first place. They were supposed to be waiting for him at the top of that hill, but apparently he didn't even know the direction they were headed in.

EDIT:

Also Podrick is huge. Isn't he 12 or something ? He looks taller than Cersei.

Yeah, I laughed when she called him a little boy. That guy's as big as the hound! He also looks older than -- or as old as -- Joff, so they've probably aged him up a bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The thing is that one of the most poignant aspects of Robb's story was precisely the incredible cost of a decision made so purely out of honor, rather than real knowledge of Jeyne or even necessarily true affection for her. It was so Ned. He married her because he had compromised her own honor, and in doing so, damaged his with the most far-reaching of consequences. This is exactly what I love most about the storyline and it is killing me to see them change it.

I agree with you. This is my biggest nitpick so far. I see absolutely no reason why they needed to change her name or who she is at all. It doesn't make sense Robb would betray his word to the Frey's for a piece of ass from Volantis, it just doesn't! I mean, it was hard enough to take in the books. Everyone did a facepalm and shook their heads saying what a foolish mistake Robb had made... but now, this sex scene of frantic ripping of clothing off to do it on the floor with a girl he barely knows from Volantis? BLAH.

My second biggest nitpick was the awkward scene between Jaqen and Arya. Since they dropped Weasel Soup, it felt a lot less significant how they played out the dialogue. I'm actually ok with production reasons for shortening Arya's complicated story at Harrenhal, but at least make the scene between she and Jaqen work like it did in the book and also she should have at least gotten one killing of a guard in there somewhere.

My last nitpick is a doozy though... why the HELL are they leaving out Tyrion's chain??? It's such a huge huge part of the plot and having him standing around bickering with Bronn about cleaning his nails while he pores over old books was humorous but made him seem somewhat clueless and like a bumbling idiot to be honest. Tyrion's much much more clever than that, we all love him for it, and I don't like how they're playing that scene out, boring boring. They spent more time on his lines with Cersei and with Ros (which albeit were good) than they did or could have making a solid plot road towards the making of the chain that takes so long you wonder if it will ever get done in the books! Tell me they're not going to put it in and instead made the ships just all magically burst into flame from wildfire and somehow not escape out of blackwater? LAME.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No chain. No weasel soup. No Arya killing her own guard to escape Harrenhal. Catelyn's character is nearly destroyed and she looks like a moron. Jon/Qhorin was boring. Dany is still annoying. Almost nothing happened in this episode.

Also, the writers like the word "cunt" a bit too much. Yeah yeah you're so edgy, lawl.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I thought Cat's reaction was a bit off. She owns up to her treason and repeats several times that she'll gladly be punished for it, but here she just kinda sits there. She didn't even mention that Karstark was about to kill him, which I thought was the whole point of changing the narrative. At least they could have had her stand up so she didn't have to look up to Robb and Karstark the whole time. It'll also make Robb look like a giant moron and a hypocrite : "[Jaime Lannister] has played you for a fool. You've weakened our position and brought discord into our camp". If that is so bad then what the hell are you doing walking around the countryside and having sex with Talisa Medicine Woman ? Also Podrick is huge. Isn't he 12 or something ? He looks taller than Cersei.

Which is exactly what I'm looking forward to now. I mean really, as they have written it, it would suggest that discord and weakness was given to them by Robb himself, given that it was his choice to put cousin Alton in the cell with Jaime, because he has too many live prisoners, allowing for his death, Jaime's initial escape, and Karstark's sowing discord with threats to behead him for the resulting death of his son, leaving Catelyn with an impossible decision, whilst he's off somewhere, made all the worse because he asked Volantis to join him. In HBOGoT, Robb deserves, even earns, the RW, guest right customs or not.

It's so much easier to blame Catelyn. And it really rather makes sense in the books. But the show makes the idea odd because those that are holding her accountable, forcefully and loudly, are the hypocrites, overly emotional in the accusation, while she sits calmly and takes it. It's so completely upside down and backwards, one can't help but notice it feels a bit off. I don't like what they've done to one of the few Mother/Son relationships that was presented as positive and nurturing. Instead, we laud Dany because she is willing to sacrifice everything because her dragons, DRAGONS, are her children, and we have little difficulty enjoying as Cercei mucks around protecting her children, one of which is a vile little shit, but we vilify Catelyn for doing something in the hopes of protecting her children, the only children who are in every sense of the word, in real danger? I simply can't wrap my head around it.

And really, how is it that woman got Jaime out of there unobserved in the first place. Really? She just walked him out, commanding everyone to step aside, and then served herself up for punishment afterwards? Seriously, that just pushes even my considerable abilities of "willing suspension of disbelief." You don't have to be a "purist" to question the logistics of that scenario; it simply doesn't make sense, even for a TV adaptation. Certainly "purists" are going to dislike alterations from the original meat, but for me, it's the changes, or adaptations, that don't hold up logically that are the most bothersome.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So the Jon storyline looks to be getting us to the same place, but now Jon is an idiot, Qhorin is not a badass, and the sacrifice of the rangers is a casual aside. What was the point of the changes?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Which is exactly what I'm looking forward to now. I mean really, as they have written it, it would suggest that discord and weakness was given to them by Robb himself, given that it was his choice to put cousin Alton in the cell with Jaime, because he has too many live prisoners, allowing for his death, Jaime's initial escape, and Karstark's sowing discord with threats to behead him for the resulting death of his son, leaving Catelyn with an impossible decision, whilst he's off somewhere, made all the worse because he asked Volantis to join him. In HBOGoT, Robb deserves, even earns, the RW, guest right customs or not.

I do hope they eventually spin it that way, showing that Robb made one political mistake after another, but I'm worried they're gonna go with "she tricked Robb into sleeping with her !!" instead if Talisa does turn out to be Jeyne Westerling.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is a chain, it can be seen in the promo picture with Bronn.

Three pages of nitpicking and no one points out the following... Lord Karstark prayed to one of The Seven!!!

He clearly says something about The Father when he should be talking about an old tree.

Also I'm completely dumbfounded by the fact that Talisa is Talisa. What manner of retardation is this?

So all across the world people have the same basic accent and language save for the Bravosi and Dothraki?

Apart from the already mentioned complaints this sure shits over the world building in this series.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
this is probably a really petty nitpick but why no beyond the wall points on the opening map?

If you remember Bran's first dream after he was pushed from the window, he can't see beyond the wall because there is a blinding light. That's my rationale.

Also there isn't really anything to attach moving cogs to north of the wall, except walruses.

My Nitpick:

Where the hell is ghost while Jon gets captured? I understand that it's expensive to CGI the wolves. But, if you cut the scene with Dany (kinda pointless, we've already established many times that Jorah is like "Lets flee and live together" and Dany's like "But, draaaaaagons") and extend Jon Snow getting kicked in the snow a bit where he sees ghost tailing him in the distance, he can gesture to Ghost "stay behind for now"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So I never thought I'd say this, but I am now looking forward to the Red Wedding.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is a chain, it can be seen in the promo picture with Bronn.

Three pages of nitpicking and no one points out the following... Lord Karstark prayed to one of The Seven!!!

He clearly says something about The Father when he should be talking about an old tree.

Somebody said that it is intentional as he would pray or sacrifice to foreign gods and not old ones just to get his sons back

I really think that after the battle of the "yellow fork" any other stupid mistake in history geography or religion is adding just as superficial / careless writing of the series

Probably the red wedding will be a brown one

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

-Tywin is officially a fool now

-The show has a completely messed up perception of time being needed (Tywin specifically says Stannis is only days away from Kings Landing - How is he supposed to get there soon enough? Or are they cutting that? Tyrion also apparently can have the smiths make a giant chain within a day?)

-Yeah Robb/Talisa really doesn't make any sense, Robb wouldn't do it nor would Catelyn allow him to do it...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OMG hope im not right but the only reason Robb will marry Tallysa is if she gets pregnant and Robb doesnt want a bastard as his mother instucted him

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm actually cheering for the Red Wedding solely to put an end to Robb/Talisa scenes. Why is it that she keeps barging into Robb's tent? This is not a M.A.S.H. unit; she's an unattached woman of dubious status, he's the King in the North, and this is Westeros, where rank and privilege count for, if not everything, than almost everything.

And here I was hoping for another Roz-free episode. I knew she was going to be Alayaya's stand-in. I suppose it's too much to expect that she leaves King's Landing after this season and never reappears in the show...

Hopefully Tyrion has already set the smiths to working on the giant chain and won't have a sudden flash of inspiration 30 hours before the battle...

I think that Emilia Clarke would have been better served without a scene in this episode. As much as I enjoy looking at the Mighty Cheekbones and Azure Eyes of Iain Glen, the scene was a waste - more whining about the dragons. I can only hope that we'll get to see all three of the critters before Season 2 ends. Maybe Drogon will have taught his brothers how to cook by then...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Speaking of rank and privilege can I nitpick one detail about episode 7?

How in the hell does it make sense of one of Karstark's sons to be positioned as a jailer. This really seems demeaning when considering Mord and the ones described in ADWD.

Seemed like a shitty plot device and one of the many reasons I couldn't be buggered to discuss last weeks episode.

Somebody said that it is intentional as he would pray or sacrifice to foreign gods and not old ones just to get his sons back I really think that after the battle of the "yellow fork" any other stupid mistake in history geography or religion is adding just as superficial / careless writing of the series Probably the red wedding will be a brown one

Good gods... I know that GRRM involvement is minimal but you'd think they'd have him go over the scripts!

Oh and one more thing, the new Mountain makes me cringe anytime I see him and I hope they recast Conan.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Reading through this thread, two things stuck out:

1. How is it a good thing when you can predict what's going to happen (Responding to OP)?That's generally not something a television show or any other artistic creation should aspire to. It's also the reason why Robb's story is badly written IMO, and it's also bad writing in all other cases.

2. Speaking about Robb, his love story is cheesy for sure. It's very cliché which is why you can predict what's going to happen. I did find this one of the more succesful sex scenes, tasteful in comparison to the whore abuse.

I disagree that it was better in the books because there is NOTHING in the books to compare to. It's just bad television but I totally understand why they added it. This is not to "one-up" on grrm, it just makes sense to show this part of the story and keep Robb's presence more continuous for the non-readers. Good decision/bad execution.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The weasel soup is fundamentally silly. All I remember about it was that they poured it on some people and then slaughter happened. The basic idea behind the scene, "Girl is greedy", is what they needed to get down. Obviously they didn't that either, but people must get what is at the heart of a scene rather than just what was presented the first time around.

The Jeyne changes are to make us give a shit. You can argue if it's executed well, but the original story was lame. Robb finds girl after she heals him, Robb falls in love. I seriously had no reason to care for Jeyne in the books, no real position on her place in society, and no reason to care about Robb's decision as it related to himself but rather how it related to the rest of the North. If you just did that (and off screen, no less) it would be the most boring story in the entire TV show.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

want to point something out, i believe it was in the past episodes

cat married ned and he essentially left on his wedding night to fight in robert's rebellion, robert's rebellion was before rob ert married cersei

cat got pregnant with rob on their wedding night

soooooo

joffrey is older than robb?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×