Norse Mythology-Ragnarök and the possible ASOIAF connection

[Icickle]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ragnar%C3%B6k

It seems as if the final battle "Ragnarok" in Norse mythology may serve as an outline for future asoiaf battles. Here are a couple of things I observed that might end up being possible parallels.

Ragnarok happens during Fimbuleutr- The Mighty Winter, where three winters pass with no summer. - Obvious connection

Jormugadr the sea serpent comes from the east and paves the way for the ship Naglfar. - Victorian paves the way for Dany

Mighty, one handed Tyr' and the fierce dog Garmr slay each other in battle. - Jamie and Un-Gregor kill each other

Sutr comes from the south with a glowing sword - Sword of mourning? Dorne?

After a battle the Eagle is perched over a waterfall hunting fish from below - The Vale attacking the Riverlands?

...Among several others... Im leaving several others out in hopes that somebody else will see them to and help prove im not completely crazy.

[Icickle]

I did this quick so I probably did a pretty bad job. However I am sure there are connections to be found.

[bloodymime]

There are. Mr. Martin probably takes from a lot of different mythologies and if you search you'll likely find all sorts of topics to get you started.

One you might find intersting about Winter.

http://asoiaf.wester...51#entry3178651

[Melifeather]

WOW! Quite a lot of similarities!

[lysmonger]

omg azhor azhai is the bad guy then

[Mummer's Fart]

excerpt:

Brothers will fight

and kill each other,

sisters' children

will defile kinship.

It is harsh in the world,

whoredom rife

—an axe age, a sword age

—shields are riven—

a wind age, a wolf age—

before the world goes headlong.

No man will have

mercy on another.

[Sterling Archer]

I definitely see the parallels. In the excerpt that Mummer's Fart let loose (haha, my bad) Wind Age= Winds of Winter, Wolf Age= A Time for Wolves (something like this; GRRM's original title for last book)

Also crimson rooster= Melisandre? the deceiver? This could be intentional, which would throw her endgame into doubt, or unintentional, as she's named Stannis as Azor Ahai. Obviously I subscribe to my boy Jon Snow being tPtwP.

Edited to avoid double post.

[Mummer's Fart]

:agree: ha.

[Sterling Archer]

I think it should be considered, however, that GRRM is writing his own tale here. It's be very unfair of him to be copying something so established as Norse mythology. If this were the case, what's to stop an ambitious reader (OP) from finding this particular bit of lore and say, "aha! Got you Georgie!" Without a doubt he'll twist this up, but may be using some of these characters/plot lines/motifs to aid his story.

[BrosBeforeSnows]

I've been working on this theory for quite some time (ever since I posted the original Jaime & Bran theory last year).

I've come a long way on it, and have made some surprising connections that I'll be posting soon.

Here's the basic gist of it (I go on to explain it all in extensive detail, so I'll probably start my own thread for it when I do eventually post it).

Aesir

Odin - Aerys

Thor - Robert Baratheon

Tyr - Jaime Lannister

Freyr - Walder Frey

Heimdallr - Samwell Tarly

Jotunn

Loki - Bloodraven

Fenrir - Bran

Jormundgandr - Dany

Hel - Melisandre

Surtr - Jon Snow

Hrym - Victarion Greyjoy

Dwarves

Fafnir - Tyrion

Hreidmar - Tywin

[lysmonger]

I've been working on this theory for quite some time (ever since I posted the original Jaime & Bran theory last year).

I've come a long way on it, and have made some surprising connections that I'll be posting soon.

Here's the basic gist of it (I go on to explain it all in extensive detail, so I'll probably start my own thread for it when I do eventually post it).

Aesir

Odin - Aerys

Thor - Robert Baratheon

Tyr - Jaime Lannister

Freyr - Walder Frey

Heimdallr - Samwell Tarly

Jotunn

Loki - Bloodraven

Fenrir - Bran

Jormundgandr - Dany

Hel - Melisandre

Surtr - Jon Snow

Hrym - Victarion Greyjoy

Dwarves

Fafnir - Tyrion

Hreidmar - Tywin

"this is incorrect thinking. Think about Bloodraven==Loki. I do not think so. Think of him as Odin. You can't use one trait to assume something. And little finger essentially is Loki. Look more deeply into it.

Tyr=Jaime is correct.

Many of the characters are based on this, but not all of them. Thor is not one person in this series because that would be too big of a get away. I am saying too much.

By the way, Robert and Aerys is dead. They have no true personality aspects of either one you say. Sure thor liked to drink, but there is not much evidence of him whoring around and raping his wife.

Walder frey resembles nowhere near Frey. I mean there is no connection to him at all. Heimdaill was a complete womanizer. Samwell isn't. Think about this more. Jon Snow as surtr doesn't even make sense. Does he want to rape and killoff everything?

[TheeMikeHoncho]

I've been working on this theory for quite some time (ever since I posted the original Jaime & Bran theory last year).

I've come a long way on it, and have made some surprising connections that I'll be posting soon.

Here's the basic gist of it (I go on to explain it all in extensive detail, so I'll probably start my own thread for it when I do eventually post it).

Aesir

Odin - Aerys

Thor - Robert Baratheon

Tyr - Jaime Lannister

Freyr - Walder Frey

Heimdallr - Samwell Tarly

Jotunn

Loki - Bloodraven

Fenrir - Bran

Jormundgandr - Dany

Hel - Melisandre

Surtr - Jon Snow

Hrym - Victarion Greyjoy

Dwarves

Fafnir - Tyrion

Hreidmar - Tywin

I've been working on this theory for quite some time (ever since I posted the original Jaime & Bran theory last year).

I've come a long way on it, and have made some surprising connections that I'll be posting soon.

Here's the basic gist of it (I go on to explain it all in extensive detail, so I'll probably start my own thread for it when I do eventually post it).

Aesir

Odin - Aerys

Thor - Robert Baratheon

Tyr - Jaime Lannister

Freyr - Walder Frey

Heimdallr - Samwell Tarly

Jotunn

Loki - Bloodraven

Fenrir - Bran

Jormundgandr - Dany

Hel - Melisandre

Surtr - Jon Snow

Hrym - Victarion Greyjoy

Dwarves

Fafnir - Tyrion

Hreidmar - Tywin

If Jon is Azor Ahai then he would represent Baldur, i would think that Surtur is Drogon. I agree with lysmonger about BR-Odin connection, the weirwoods (yggrasill), the one eye, and the ravens are all qualities that both share. some deities have multiple characters that could fit the bill. Loki could be represented by many players in this story like the Kindly Man, Varys, and Little Finger. I dont think you could categorize any individual as a representation of an individual norse deity, only that they share similar qualities.

[Icickle]

There is also the mention of the three rooster crows that will start the wars. Will this correspond to the horns in the book? Sams horn, victorians horn, is there another?

[lysmonger]

If Jon is Azor Ahai then he would represent Baldur, i would think that Surtur is Drogon. I agree with lysmonger about BR-Odin connection, the weirwoods (yggrasill), the one eye, and the ravens are all qualities that both share. some deities have multiple characters that could fit the bill. Loki could be represented by many players in this story like the Kindly Man, Varys, and Little Finger. I dont think you could categorize any individual as a representation of an individual norse deity, only that they share similar qualities.

Be careful on thinking Jon is azor ahai. and Yes Littlefinger is Loki. Looks like him talks like him. Is constantly made fun of his birth and presumed sexual prowess....

[Mummer's Fart]

Be careful on thinking Jon is azor ahai. and Yes Littlefinger is Loki. Looks like him talks like him. Is constantly made fun of his birth and presumed sexual prowess....

Jon is more likely than Stannis

[TheeMikeHoncho]

Be careful on thinking Jon is azor ahai. and Yes Littlefinger is Loki. Looks like him talks like him. Is constantly made fun of his birth and presumed sexual prowess....

Yeah we should be careful of predictions, but if Jon does arrise he fits Baldur (Odin's son who is to be ressurrected to fight for Asgard in the time of Ragnarok) to a tee.

Yes Little Finger does represent Loki, but others do as well like the two mentioned. Both master deceivers and either mystical or skillfull(or both) shapeshifters. I will give it to you, LF's lust for power is extremely Loki like.

[three-eyed monkey]

I think GRRM borrows from a lot of different mythologies but there's nothing wrong with that. There is certainly a strong Hindu yuga cycle feel to ASoIaF, r maybe Plato's great year, with the last golden age being the time of the children of the forest, the coming of the first men marks the plunge into the iron age, a time of war etc., and the return of magic heralds the ascent back to a golden age once more.

Be it Norse, Hindu, Greek, Egyptian, Celtic, I'm sure he's familiar with them all. Renly's ghost has shades (excuse the pun) of the Illiad. The wall is a bit like Hadrians wall, the wildlings a bit like the picts. The ironborn are sort of like vikings while the Dothraki resemble the mongol hordes. Dany being married to Drogo sounds like something from Attila the Hun. Dorne reminds me of Andalusia, Highgarden of France. His religions are based on real religions, many of his characters are inspired by historical figures, that's part of what makes it so real.

He just gives it a twist for some extra bite, and does it really well.

[LaroC]

I completely agree with three-eyed monkey.

GRRM is a very skilled author, plainly capable of picking details anda characters from many legends without have need to make an identical rereanding of an entire mythology.

The Faith refers to the expansion of the Chatolic church, with theis liturgies, many formal rituals and ostentaions. And armed Faith is a reference to the Crusades. The weirwoods and the children are reprepresntations of the Dryads (spirits of the forest) from Celtic Mythology.

The slavers bay resembles to North African people, with the pyramids, the harpy, the slaving and the very hierarchical society.

Also in the Rain Forest (i'm brazilian) there are shamanic religions that belive in the knowledge provided by an entity, a spirit from the Ayahuasca three. The ritual to access this knowledge is identical to the one done by Bran (drinking the bitter root porridage, and havings vivid dreams about yourself).

So, in short, i don't belive that there is an exact character in aSoIaF for each one in the Norse mythology.

[Ser Liam of Overton]

Mighty, one handed Tyr' and the fierce dog Garmr slay each other in battle. - Jamie and Un-Gregor kill each other

Does anyone else think this ties nicely with the Valonqar prophecy? Jaime not actually killing Cersei directly, but condeming her to death by beating her champion? Not that I can conceive a way to why Jaime for fight against UnGregor at the moment.

[three-eyed monkey]

Exactly, LaroC, as oscar wilde once said (or was it james joyce?), the best writers are often the best readers and GRRM is one hell of a writer. :bowdown: