[TWOW Spoilers] Miscon reading : two Winds of Winter chapters

[Talking Hodor]

Brienne will probably lead him to the BWB and then her Jaime and Podrick will smash the BWB to bits.

I dont know if Podrick will be freed when Jaime arrives or if they will have to break him out, but once he is out, pod is going to kick some ass.

IF Brienne learned one thing from Jaime, it is that somtimes an Oath needs to be broken.(sword is also named Oathbreaker)

I think Jamie will be able to convince Lady Stoneheart that he's still looking for her daughters via Brienne and hasn't broken any oath to her. He may even agree to help her out by bagging a few Freys.

[Podcast]

Not necessarily, as Jaime may very well be the one to kill Cersei. There is a delicious irony in the thought that the one thing Cersei prized almost as much as herself, the bond between her and Jaime, would be her undoing.

As for Brienne, I love Brienne, but she is the one I worry most about. Good and noble people don't last long in these books.

How about this then for Brienne's storyline. Faced with the killing of Jaime in order to be true to unCat she kills unCat and becomes the oathbreaker she loathed in Jaime, in order to save him. There'd be a great deal of angst in that decision for our noblest of noble she- And where would we all sit in judgement of her then? Oathbreaker to an evil undead persona, or heroic defender of the reformed?

[Persicaria]

How about this then for Brienne's storyline. Faced with the killing of Jaime in order to be true to unCat she kills unCat and becomes the oathbreaker she loathed in Jaime, in order to save him. There'd be a great deal of angst in that decision for our noblest of noble she- And where would we all sit in judgement of her then? Oathbreaker to an evil undead persona, or heroic defender of the reformed?

Except the whole brotherhood is there. She would have to cleave through several men who have proven very loyal to Lady Stoneheart . I mean I would like for there to be some sort of solution that would enable Brienne to keep her life and her good heart, but I just find it very unlikely.

[Podcast]

There might be an opportunity if the brotherhood are already questioning their own loyalty to Lady Stoneheart...

[Persicaria]

There might be an opportunity if the brotherhood are already questioning their own loyalty to Lady Stoneheart...

We don't really see any hints of that yet. Why would they fall apart for Jaime and Brienne though? Jaime hasn't the best of reputations, and while Brienne has behaved honorably she is still bound and brought forth to Lady Stone Heart. Not saying I don't want a happy ending; I just try not to get my hopes up.

[Ladywhiskers]

Podric, Jaime, and Brienne, might actually be able to take on the brotherhood, or at least fight them off long enough to be able to flee. .

[AryaRocks]

If (F)Aegon is real, he would be a little brother too?

[Ladywhiskers]

I had forgotten that gold was one of the Martell house colors. Now that they've got Oberyn Martell striding around in yellow with golden suns, I'm convinced that Myrcella, at least, will have a golden shroud of the dead kind. Tommen, too, probably.

Aegon would be a little brother of Rhaenys. I suspect he's a false Dmitri, though.

[metr0man]

I think Brienne will end up killing Jaime Lannister during trial by combat. Really at this point there isn't much else for his character to do.

[Ladywhiskers]

I wouldn't be so quick to decide that. He had that weird dream, and I think it's prophetic in some way. Until we see the two of them fighting off monsters in a crypt, he's not done. Besides, he's gotta stick around to kill Cersei. Unless it turns out that Valonquar is a priestly office we didn't know about, and the Sparrow or some other Septon ends up doing it ceremonially, which is always a distinct possibility.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

I heard GRRM read the Victarion chapter this weekend as well. Was anyone present there who remembers details to make the summary on that chapter more complete? Anyone any additional details?

[Zarafrustra]

I'm just going to leave this here.

http://shrani.si/f/2N/WW/Y02ZDsz/shit.gif

[HelenaExMachina]

I heard GRRM read the Victarion chapter this weekend as well. Was anyone present there who remembers details to make the summary on that chapter more complete? Anyone any additional details?

I'm sure I have seen a YouTube clip of the reading before (not from Carolina though) but then I'm not sure if it was a partial reading or not.

[Ladywhiskers]

I think Jamie will be able to convince Lady Stoneheart that he's still looking for her daughters via Brienne and hasn't broken any oath to her. He may even agree to help her out by bagging a few Freys.

She's a zombie. I don't think anybody will ever be able to "convince" her of anything. But he can probably kill her if he gets lucky.

[Urien the Ragged]

She's a zombie. I don't think anybody will ever be able to "convince" her of anything. But he can probably kill her if he gets lucky.

She's not really a zombie. Shes a broken woman that spent 3 days in a river before being brought back to life. I don't think she's lost the ability to reason, she's just not in a great frame of mind.

[UtherSnow]

.Oathkeeper is part of the old Stark blade Ice, which many believe to be a likely contender for Lightbringer.

Will Jaime know the whereabouts of Oathkeeper's other half? (We know it was given to Joffrey by Tywin.) Re-forging Ice complete makes sense to me. It sounds like something Lady Stoneheart would want because it's so closely associated to Ned. Gendry may the one to re-forge it as it ought to be, I think.

For it to become Lightbringer, whose heart will it need to pierce? When Azor Ahai created the original Lightbringer, it was specific about a sacrifice being made. It must pierce the heart of somebody close and dear, meaning deeply loved, without question.

Is it one way traffic between Brienne and Jaime?

What if it's something more? What if it's another sort of act concerning love?

[UtherSnow]

Been playing over the anticipated Battle For Winterfell. It's supposedly an issue to be resolved as early as possible in WINDS.

Thinking about it, this isn't strictly ONE battle. It's more likely to be a series.

First of all, where do The Boltons have to go? It's something like The Alamo without a greater cause. It doesn't have glorious defeat written all over it.

Roose Bolton is likely to leave his beserker former-bastard in charge. Ramsay is crazy enough to say he can hold it, and defeat Stannis.

Where does Roose head? Towards allies at The Twins. Where is a good assembly point for his forces? I can't see them all heading in the same direction coming out of Winterfell. Chances are Ramsay won't hang on to be slaughtered in Winterfell, unless he's a classic damned idiot and.... That boy can't be from calm, quiet Roose's loins. (As Boss Hogg might say.)

Torrhen's Square. It makes sense. Asha suggested this to Stannis before but he chose Winterfell. It can't be left now. Another battle here, I'd say. Bolton forces are twindling now. They need support from The Freys at The Twins.

Meanwhile, at White Harbor, Manderly is still thinking. Davos being Davos will prove loyal to Stannis, who places Rickon under his protection. That should be plenty for Manderly forces to commit to Stannis. It also allows Stannis to send Rickon out of harms way, with Davos.

Freys receive news of old pal Roose being banged about by Stannis. Freys have a taste for killing Kings from the North. Of-t they jolly well go, riding to rescue Roose. Once they're clear of The Twins..... Into a trap they fall.

The Vale commit forces. Not to head south, as LF wants. What experience does he have of battles? None to persuade those who have to follow him. They're better going towards The Twins, but not to storm it.

Houses Bolton & Frey defeated, Stannis can claim The North.

Edited August 4, 2014 by UtherSnow

[GrandPoobah]

Interesting. Well Joffrey's already shrouded in the dead way. I fully expect those two remaining inbred abominations to follow suit. :stillsick:

Is one of the "inbred abominations" you're talking about Dany? Daenerys Targaryen's father and mother were also brother and sister. Lots of readers tend to gloss over this fact.

While Joffrey, Myrcella and Tommen being the products of incest is troubling to the people of Westeros, it's not what would hold them back from sitting the Iron Throne. Their problem is that them being Jaime's children makes them bastards.

Many if not most Targaryen kings and queens were the product of incest.

[kayboy]

what if jaime asks for trial by combat and faces brienne. He then has to kill her by thrusting oathbreaker through her heart. Thereby becoming azor ahai reborn.

[Mithras]

what if jaime asks for trial by combat and faces brienne. He then has to kill her by thrusting oathbreaker through her heart. Thereby becoming azor ahai reborn.

Brienne will not champion a cause she does not believe in. Therefore, she will not fight for UnCat against Jaime because she tried to tell her that Jaime is a changed man and did his best to keep his vow to Cat. Therefore, I think Brienne will champion Jaime against UnCat's champion (which will probably be Lem Lemoncloak).

Edited November 19, 2014 by Mithras Stoneborn