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The Bear & the Maiden fair


Capon Breath

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One of my strongest hopes for the TV show is that this song makes it in somehow. I'd love that.

Well, it should if we get the scene with Margaery, the Queen of Thorns and Sansa since Butterbumps is singing it in the background.

(Due to the poster Butterbumps! I now always think of the Tyrell fool with an extra exclamation mark, almost jumping up and down.)

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But then there's also Brienne in Vargo Hoat's(!) Bear Pit,

In deed!

And whose maidenhood is more prominent than Brienne's?

AND she had 3 suitors - though not all of them were boys.

I just wish I could work out how to turn Jaime into the bear, but he's not black, brown and hairy at all, except for his new beard.

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  • 2 weeks later...

There's a saying in Spanish: "El hombre y el oso, cuanto mas feo, mas hermoso."

Men and bears, the uglier they are, the better looking...

I think it's self-explanatory.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I agree that I don't think it was meant to portray only one story, that the bear and the maiden fair could apply to many different pairings. However, I do see the strongest parallel to Dany and Jorah. Obviously the song was written (in their world) before Dany and Jorah even met, though I do think GRRM included it as a way of showing the connection between the song and their relationship. I mean there are just too many similarities I see in the song to their situation to say that it doesn't apply to them at all. For instance:

-The BEAR and the maiden fair, the Mormont sigil just fits in with the animal in the song too perfectly to ignore. Also Dany describes Jorah many times as being hairy, just as the bear in the song is described. And of course "honey" in the maiden's hair would be Dany's blonde hair. And I know she isn't a maiden for most of the time Jorah knows her, but she is when she first meets him.

-As for the lyrics, I saw the invitation to the fair as being the Dothraki's acceptance of Jorah into their horde, thus the line "The fair? said he, But I'm a bear" is meant to convey how Jorah is out of place amongst all the Dothraki.

-Then there is the introduction of the maiden, which would be Dany being brought to Drogo.

-The bear smelling the honey is meant to show Jorah's growing attraction to Dany. And the roar the bear lets out could be seen as the moment when Dany realizes Jorah wants her.

-Then there is the line "I'll never dance with a hairy bear" which could be seen as any one of the many times Dany has thought/said she could never love Jorah.

-When the bear "lifts her high into the air" he is taking the initiative just as Jorah does when he kisses her.

-Then after, the line "I called for a knight! But you're a bear!" very closely resembles Dany's thoughts after Jorah kisses her when she thinks about how he is not a "true knight" because a true knight would not have kissed his queen.

-Therefore, the kicking and wailing would represent Dany's anger towards Jorah afterward and ultimately her dismissal of his service.

That is the part of the song that works with the events of their story that have happened already. The rest would be the possible "foreshadowing" of future events. This part I don't really know about so my guess is the following:

-The licking of the honey from her hair could possibly be referring to some heroic act Jorah does to save Dany, thus redeeming himself.

-The sighing and squealing would then be Dany forgiving Jorah and praising him for his heroism.

-Then the line "She sang: My bear so fair, and off they went" could be seen as Dany realizing she is in love with Jorah and them continuing their adventure together.

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When Butterbumps sings it as loud as he came for the Queen of Thorns, it meant to show that Joffrey is the Bear and Sansa/Margaery is the Maiden Fair, both still claim to be maidens.

Also, the lyrics fit to well for Jorah and Dany, it would be great if Dany and Jorah hear this song when they get reunited.

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In deed!

And whose maidenhood is more prominent than Brienne's?

AND she had 3 suitors - though not all of them were boys.

I just wish I could work out how to turn Jaime into the bear, but he's not black, brown and hairy at all, except for his new beard.

Jaime is the Maiden... :) Brienne is his Bear.

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If this happens, I'll burn my books.

Hey, I'm not trying to say this is what is what I think is going to happen, just my interpretation of what I believe the song suggests if it is meant to parallel Dany and Jorah's storyline. In fact, I actually think the ending of the song is very unlikely to actually occur, especially considering GRRM's tendency to favor tragic endings over happy ones.

Although, I would love for Dany and Jorah to get together and I do think she harbors some feelings for him deep down, I just don't see things working out for the guy. I think GRRM just likes to ruin some character's lives, and I think Jorah will end up being one of those characters.

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For the Dany & Jorah possibility, it would make sense for the goat to be MMD, IMO. She is one of the lamb people, but has an attitude and destroyed everything for Dany, more characteristic of a goat. Blood sacrifices usually included a lamb or goat back in biblical times (or an ox if you were really well off). Burn a goat and get three boys.

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Come on now, who cares about female desire? Dany just need to get over herself and automatically submit to the nice guy wanting her. ;)

Motion seconded. Said action shall be followed by penning of several angry e-mails to GRRM.

What's up with all these women who keep thinking feminine desire matter? Who cares what they want, it's the nice guy that matters. :)

Although, I would love for Dany and Jorah to get together and I do think she harbors some feelings for him deep down, I just don't see things working out for the guy. I think GRRM just likes to ruin some character's lives, and I think Jorah will end up being one of those characters.

Really? I got a very different interpretation. It seemed she tried but really has no romantic or sexual feelings towards him and I don't think she'll change her mind on that either. He doesn't seem to be her type at all and he may genuinely love her, but Jorah did spy on her. That doesn't mean that I don't feel for him, as I do. He's a very broken man in Dance and I can't see any other ending for him than tragic. But, I don't want the two of them to be together.

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This is interesting and it also suggests something to me.

I have been puzzled by the casting of Iain Glenn, as Jorah, as Glenn is quite handsome and charismatic. However, apparently Martin had to tell the producers how the story would end in case anything happened to him. So if they were told that Jorah and Dany would "end up together" or at least have some "Romantic Shennaigans" well the casting of Glenn makes more sense.

What do you think?

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This is interesting and it also suggests something to me.

I have been puzzled by the casting of Iain Glenn, as Jorah, as Glenn is quite handsome and charismatic. However, apparently Martin had to tell the producers how the story would end in case anything happened to him. So if they were told that Jorah and Dany would "end up together" or at least have some "Romantic Shennaigans" well the casting of Glenn makes more sense.

What do you think?

I don't think you can read anything into the casting of Ian Glenn. It's television; in general, you are going to find pretty people in a show. Look at the Hound and Tyrion, two people who are supposed to be rather ugly. Both look much better on the show than they do in the books. He's eye candy, completely agree, but every show needs eye candy.

As of the end of Dance, we still saw no sign of sexual attraction from Dany for Jorah. She cared for him and saw him as a friend. If we want to put a label on it, I think she saw him as something closer to a father figure than a potential love interest.

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I doubt Dany is gonna like Jorah anymore with his enormous slave tattoo on his face. I second (or hundred?) the motion to burn my books if Dany ends up with him lol. I'd rather see pretty much anyone in the books lol.

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As of the end of Dance, we still saw no sign of sexual attraction from Dany for Jorah. She cared for him and saw him as a friend. If we want to put a label on it, I think she saw him as something closer to a father figure than a potential love interest.

You don't need to be attracted to someone sexually in order to love them, in fact sometimes it takes falling in love with someont to find them sexually attractive. And I think the reason there isn't much evidence to go on for my claim that Dany has feelings for Jorah is that she doesn't really know it yet herself. Although she has been through a lot, she is still young, and when you are young you are still very concerned with physical appearance (take Dany's attraction to Daario for example). And we know that Dany thinks Jorah is old and unattractive, thus causing her to believe that she does not love him because those are the things that she thinks are important when looking for a partner. And not because she is shallow, but because she is young and the only man she has ever really loved (Drogo) just so happened to be younger and more attractive, so thats really all she has to go off of. Therefore, I think she dismissed Jorah as being someone she could love because she could not picture them together sexually, ignoring all the other signs that show that she may possibly love him. For instance, when Jorah kissed her, she kissed him back and did not push him away at any point during the long kiss. Also, there is a point where she considers marrying Jorah (and Daario). You do not consider marriage if you don't have any feelings for that person. And at the end of DWD when Dany thinks about Jorah she says that she wants to "press up against his chest" which may just mean she wants to be comforted by him, but if so, why not just say she wanted to hug him? Instead she made it more seem more intimate. I don't know. I could be completely wrong on all my analysis, but to me it just seems like she may have more romantic feelings for him than she knows.

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  • 3 months later...

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