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A Certain Wedding (MEGASPOILERS)


Christopher

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cat should've put that knife through lord walder's heart. she should've known there was no leaving after what had started.

"I will kill the old man, I can do that much at least."

oh, and while i feel the fault is ultimately mine for entering a thread with "MEGASPOILERS" in the title, i really wish i hadn't read here about what they did to robb's body before i had in the book. ;)

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The Freys have acquired some major bad karma by violating the guest right. I have a feeling that they will get killed off one by one until that old man Walder Frey dies. I just hope they cut his head off and sew something appropriate in its place.

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Thinking back, I think Robb's biggest mistake was not marrying a Frey (Roslin, most likely) when they first passed the Twins heading South. Had he done so at that point, the entire Jeyne Westerling situation would have been avoided altogether, the Freys would have been bound by marriage to ensure their loyalty - even if Robb's war didn't go so well, and Bolton would certainly have had second thoughts about his part of the betrayal as well.

I had thought something similar myself, but it wasn't until I read this that I started thinking more deeply. Of course the practical answer is if Robb had married a Frey when they first crossed the Twins this compelling plot point would have been ruined. However from inside the story I wonder if it wasn't a first hint of trouble to come. If I recall the offer included Robb's being able to pick his wife after the war was over. Robb was in no rush since it was all business to him. I also suppose they would want time to plan for a big celebration. I also think that for all that Walder Frey was upset and offended at the betrayal I doubt he would have wanted the full commitment at that juncture either. What if he tied himself by marriage to to the Starks and then the Starks lost? Much easier to switch to the winning side later if there was only a non-specific betrothal.

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I had thought something similar myself, but it wasn't until I read this that I started thinking more deeply. Of course the practical answer is if Robb had married a Frey when they first crossed the Twins this compelling plot point would have been ruined. However from inside the story I wonder if it wasn't a first hint of trouble to come. If I recall the offer included Robb's being able to pick his wife after the war was over. Robb was in no rush since it was all business to him. I also suppose they would want time to plan for a big celebration. I also think that for all that Walder Frey was upset and offended at the betrayal I doubt he would have wanted the full commitment at that juncture either. What if he tied himself by marriage to to the Starks and then the Starks lost? Much easier to switch to the winning side later if there was only a non-specific betrothal.

You're right of course, had Robb married a Frey at that point, we'd basically have a "and they lived happily ever after..." at this point. Still, Robb's failure was a strategic one. He won every battle in the field yet he lost the war. He had the tactics down, but he failed to see the big picture. As you wrote, WF was only reluctantly giving him his support, that should have been a warning signal. Sure, they sent of two wardens/hostages to Winterfell, but there was no one there to actually guard them. It would have made sense for Robb to force a marriage by the time of the first crossing - even if at that point in time it wouldn't have been in Frey's best interest. I think he would have pulled it off as well.

But then again, then we wouldn't have had the RW and then, of course, we wouldn't have had the story we got in AFfC and ADwD and (in a couple of years' time) TWoW... :cool4:

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I read the RW and Aryas axe in bed. After the axe I put the book down and turned off the lamp. I lay there in shock for a while before I had to get up and have a cig. I dont think ive been affected by literature that way before (except when I read about an invisible man that created heaven & earth in 7 days

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So, the most annoying part of this to me was how close Arya got to her family. Lately, I've been reading this book as characters just moving around to no aim, coming close to meeting up but never really doing so. I know the author is toying with us (especially those of us that like happy endings), so I was not surprised when Jon and Bran came so close and missed each other. But, this was such a harsh plot for me. I honestly never saw it coming, despite all the signs being there. I knew Frey had some serious insult planned, but I had convinced myself that Roslin was not a virgin and must have been pregnant with someone else's child. Bringing Arya so close to a reunion with her family, after all she's been through, and then having this happen was so cruel!

I was always voting for Robb. I suppose now, I am in Dany's court for queen. I'm not sure what the point would be, since she and most of her followers (the eunuchs) will die without children. But at least she has the people in mind. And please let someone kill Joff soon!

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A friend of mine got hooked on the TV show on my recommendation, and has been reading through the books since season 2 ended. He is three chapters away from the Red Wedding and said he will likely read the next 5 or 6 chapters tonight. I am a bit nervous with anticipation to get the "WTF just happened?!!!" text. Lol. He said "So much has happened in the last 8 chapters, I can't imagine what's coming up." Dude, you have no idea.

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I tried to stay away from spoilers as I got into the books and did a pretty good job of it. I saw thread titles with "Red Wedding" in them that I never opened, smugly thinking it must be about Joffrey's wedding. I assumed the RW was him getting what was coming to him in a huge bloodbath. As I read the book and realized Robb and Cat were attending Edmure's wedding, the dread came crashing down on me. I think it made it more effective for me, because EVERY bit of foreshadowing GRRM threw at me in the book up to it hit me in the face like a ton of bricks. I just wanted them OUT of there before they even GOT to the Twins. It was horrible to read, yet so great at the same time.

But it also made

the THIRD wedding in the book SO satisfying!!!

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Big Daddy Dave,

Fix your spoiler tag, it has an extra s on the closing tag.

Yeah, Red Wedding is a spoiler in of itself. That is why most people usually just refer to it as RW. I read it completely unspoiled and still felt that dread. It was weird, because I had no idea what was going to happen, and everything seemed to be going ok, but I knew SOMETHING was wrong. It was a really well written section.

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Yeah, Red Wedding is a spoiler in of itself. That is why most people usually just refer to it as RW. I read it completely unspoiled and still felt that dread. It was weird, because I had no idea what was going to happen, and everything seemed to be going ok, but I knew SOMETHING was wrong. It was a really well written section.

I saw the signs when Cat had to make a point to ask for bread and salt for guest rights. Then things just went downhill, but even then, I didn't anticipate the extent of carnage.

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Thanks for fixing the open ended spoiler tag. Sorry I missed that. Trying to be spoiler appropriate for each thread and each forum, bearing in mind what readers should know at each point.

The guest rituals were a pretty obvious sign, but Robb working out who would succeed him as an heir was downright cryptic.

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Reading about Robb and Cat's murders was gut wrenching. I was sort of in shock; I just couldn't believe that the Freys did it, even as I was reading it.

Like TP, I suspected something was up when Cat kept pressing the guests' rights deal. But I kept hoping that I had misunderstood something, or that they had somehow survived. The description of Cat as she worries about her hair because Ned always liked it was so sad. And when Arya dreamt of her mother's body in the river while she was Nymeria, I cried. That was so sad to me. I knew then that they were dead for sure.

I am sincerely hoping that a horrid, vile, painful death lies in store for the Freys and the Boltons.

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So yeah, the reaction from my friend was pretty epic. Got like 20 text messages in a half hour ranting about the Freys and Roose and Cat, and why didn't Robb listen to Greywind, and Stannis with his @#[email protected]# leaches.

A guy I work with is probably reading it right now. He told me a few days ago that Sansa and Tyrion had wed, and I said, "Anybody dead yet?" so he knows someone's going to get it soon. I told him, "You are gonna SHIT." and, "it's shocking.... it's just shocking", and, "I'll be here for ya man." so he's been squirming in agony.

Then today he tells me that "they're on their way to Edmure's wedding" and I didn't say a word........

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Hi! First post here, I've been reading a lot and I wanted to share my girlfriend's RW experience. We were at my place when she got to Edmure's wedding, I was reading an aDwD chapter and she starts saying at loud "What's wrong with Grey Wind!?" and I just remained silent. After a few minutes I hear a whisper like "Wha..." and I watched her face expressions change on many different ways, when she finished she just stared at my with eyes wide open. No tears, she just started to insult GRRM for a good while and.... then the tears came. A LOT of them, but I was with her so I did my best to comfort her.

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Yeah, I didn't give any indication of the nature of what was coming, but he's coming into town later this week and we're going to grab lunch, and I told him he had to finish the 3rd book before he came into town, or at least reach a certain scene. I said he would know without a doubt what scene I was talking about when he reached it. I told him if he thought "yeah, this is probably the scene he was talking about" that it wasn't the scene I was talking about. There would be no "probably".

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Hi! First post here, I've been reading a lot and I wanted to share my girlfriend's RW experience. We were at my place when she got to Edmure's wedding, I was reading an aDwD chapter and she starts saying at loud "What's wrong with Grey Wind!?" and I just remained silent. After a few minutes I hear a whisper like "Wha..." and I watched her face exp<b></b>ressions change on many different ways, when she finished she just stared at my with eyes wide open. No tears, she just started to insult GRRM for a good while and.... then the tears came. A LOT of them, but I was with her so I did my best to comfort her.

Hi, Macakas - welcome to the forum.

What did your gf think of Arya's dream and seeing her mother dead in the river? That broke my heart. Poor little girl.

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Hi, Macakas - welcome to the forum.

What did your gf think of Arya's dream and seeing her mother dead in the river? That broke my heart. Poor little girl.

Hi, thanks!

I don't think she got to that part yet, after the RW her eagerness to keep on reading decreased a lot, she read the RW a couple of days ago. But what I can say is that after reading the next Arya chapter after the RW, she went berserk going through the pages searching for the next Arya one. She started breathing again after realizing she still lives, Arya is her favorite character. Myself it was different, after the RW I started to read even more!

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