greygnarl Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 My new theory on the "dragonsteel" mentioned in one of the ancient manuscripts Sam was reading.It's not Valyrian Steel, the Other's swords or anything like that.I think that it's actually steel that was forged or hardened by dragons.Though with the 2000 years instead of 6000 theory the Freehold existed alongside the Long Night, even if it didn't I have this SSM. Dragons+Wargs+Steel/Bronze/Something=Dragonsteel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TooManyFreys Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 So do you mean the Iron Throne, dragonsteel? O_oI'm gonna go with the material that we know existsI assumed that Valyrian Steel WAS in part forged by dragons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 So do you mean the Iron Throne, dragonsteel? O_oI'm gonna go with the material that we know existsI assumed that Valyrian Steel WAS in part forged by dragonsWe DO know that the pale blue material wielded by the Other exists and is stronger than steel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TooManyFreys Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 We DO know that the pale blue material wielded by the Other exists and is stronger than steel.But...would they be vulnerable to their own weapons? We know that the swords are beyond god damn freezing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 But...would they be vulnerable to their own weapons? We know that the swords are beyond god damn freezing.Man, I have to go back to the Sam-in-the-library chapter. I cant recall if they were vulnerable to it or not. That would rock my whole world view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greygnarl Posted July 12, 2012 Author Share Posted July 12, 2012 It never said anything about the Others' swords.Also I forgot to mention that the Iron Throne would then be Dragonsteel. :bang: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TooManyFreys Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 AgreedThat would be the strangest Achilles heel...But back to the OP, I'm betting they were right in equating Dragonsteel to Valyrian Steel. Although I wouldn't put it past GRRM to turn that into an unfortunate assumption in a crucial time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevumar Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 My new theory on the "dragonsteel" mentioned in one of the ancient manuscripts Sam was reading.It's not Valyrian Steel, the Other's swords or anything like that.I think that it's actually steel that was forged or hardened by dragons.Valyrian steel is not mutually exclusive with dragon-forged steel. The wording of Dany's promise to Jorah in Game suggests that the two are compatible.The Iron Throne is dragon-forged steel, but not Valyrian steel. I think there has to be something to it beyond just being forged, formed, or worked in dragonfire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoolGirlsMurderFriend Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 There's nothing to say a dragon's fire imbues metal with any special properties. Spells are what makes Varyrian so good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost714 Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 I always thought that dragon flame was used to make Valyrian Steel, in combination with spells that were lost with the Doom, and that's why Jeor tells Jon that it would have taken a fire that's a hundred times hotter than the fire in his chambers, to damage Longclaw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TooManyFreys Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 I always thought that dragon flame was used to make Valyrian Steel, in combination with spells that were lost with the Doom, and that's why Jeor tells Jon that it would have taken a fire that's a hundred times hotter than the fire in his chambers, to damage Longclaw.I think so too.Side note: Too bad that didn't stop GRRM from having the Lannisters melt down Ice :bawl: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoolGirlsMurderFriend Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Maybe the spells make the fire hotter? IDK, otherwise how could they melt down ice at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Wolf Smith Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 So in short you think that they swords needed to fight the Wights have all (Mostly) been melted down in to the Iron Throne? Have not heard that one. I think I like it. Kind of makes sense, the old swords were handed down the ages, until the targs defeated them, and melted them down.IDT Valyrian Steel is Dragonsteel. It would be to simply. (of course the answer might be simple like Mountain Clans still have plenty of it or something) but it not what Sam and Jon first thought is. no way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldManDennis Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Side note: Too bad that didn't stop GRRM from having the Lannisters melt down Ice :bawl:You don't have to melt steel to work it. And I doubt the LC is a metallurgist. However you are right that it is a weak point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost714 Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 I think so too.Side note: Too bad that didn't stop GRRM from having the Lannisters melt down Ice :bawl:Well Master Armorer Tobho Mott does know some spells required for reworking Valyrian Steel, he just isn't able to make it from normal steel. So Tobho would have the capability of making a fire much more hot than that of the one that burned down Lord Commander Mormont's chambers. That's why it was possible for him to melt down Ice, to make the two swords Tywin requested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brzibrzi Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 There's nothing to say a dragon's fire imbues metal with any special properties. Spells are what makes Varyrian so good.yeah, and the method of forging - if i remember correctly, a valyrian steel sword is folded onto itself a hundred times while bein forged or something like that. that's where it gets the ripples from.aSoS spoiler:that's why reforging Ice into two smaller valyrian swords didn't sit well with me, i don't think it could've been done properly by a "regular" smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 The Long Night predates the Valyrian civilization.That's why the records are either corrupted, or Dragonsteel is something different from Valyrian steel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost714 Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 yeah, and the method of forging - if i remember correctly, a valyrian steel sword is folded onto itself a hundred times while bein forged or something like that. that's where it gets the ripples from.aSoS spoiler:that's why reforging Ice into two smaller valyrian swords didn't sit well with me, i don't think it could've been done properly by a "regular" smith.What's up with the spoiler tag?And Tobho Mott is not a "regular" smith, he is a master armorer, and it wasn't normal smithing that allowed him to make the blades for Tywin. Tobho mentions using spells to do the work, I believe he says he tried all the known spells to reforge the blades, but no matter what he did, they would not take the right Lannister crimson color, because "those old swords remember". The point being, it was spells, and being a master at his craft, that allowed him to do it. There was no "regular smith" about it.@Free NorthmanI actually tend to believe that the Last Hero(or Azor Ahai, if they are the same person), was the first person to make a sword similar to Valyrian Steel, and the Valyrian's just improved on that idea. It's possible that the Valyrians found the records of how the Last Hero made his Sword, and they took that method, and added their own improvements on it, until they came up with the perfect blade, Valyrian Steel. The Valyrians might have had the records themselves, or they might have conquered somewhere that had the records of how the Last Hero made his sword. To me, it makes sense that the Valyrian's would have better records then people in Westeros, because they were a very advanced people. If the Last Hero and Azor Ahai are the same person, then it would really make sense that the Valyrians kept better records, because so many people in Essos know the story of Azor Ahai(even Salladhor Saan knows the story). So more people knowing the story in Essos seems indicative of the Valyrians, or somebody, keeping good records, because obviously it was not forgotten throughout history. Westerosi know the story of the Last Hero, but I think we have met more people not from Westeros, that know about Azor Ahai. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brzibrzi Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 What's up with the spoiler tag?And Tobho Mott is not a "regular" smith, he is a master armorer, and it wasn't normal smithing that allowed him to make the blades for Tywin. Tobho mentions using spells to do the work, I believe he says he tried all the known spells to reforge the blades, but no matter what he did, they would not take the right Lannister crimson color, because "those old swords remember". The point being, it was spells, and being a master at his craft, that allowed him to do it. There was no "regular smith" about it.forgot about that, my mistake. still, the whole story about reforging valyrian steel smells funnyas for the spoiler tag - i'm not certain about the forum rules so i tagged it just in case. spoiling is a terrible sin and it's better not to mess with it ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost714 Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 forgot about that, my mistake. still, the whole story about reforging valyrian steel smells funnyas for the spoiler tag - i'm not certain about the forum rules so i tagged it just in case. spoiling is a terrible sin and it's better not to mess with it ;)What's funny about it, it makes sense to me?And this is the general forum section, if anyone reads a thread in this section, without reading all the books, then there is nothing you can do, they will be spoiled, but there is no requirement for you to add a spoiler tag here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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