Errant Bard Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 her silver trotting to a darkling stream under a sea of stars is hardly symbolical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon tarkaryen Posted April 9, 2006 Author Share Posted April 9, 2006 her silver trotting to a darkling stream under a sea of stars is hardly symbolical. Umm sorry but I think thats not from the same triplet?am I wrong? I dont have the book here right now so Im not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dornishman Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 but any other prophecy from that triplet is symbolical,therefore,this one also have to be symbolical. What? 1) Thats plainly no logic at all. The triplets are of course thematically structured, but not necessariyl stylistcially structured! 2) And cut it with the "must" "is definitly" "need to be" - it snot like youd definitly know! Not me, either, so that exactly why I presented several options. Nothing "must" be here, goddamn! Btw, Ive remembered something else. Dany is called the "Stormborn", some of the more faithful Ironborn might have a problem with that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Targaryen Posted April 9, 2006 Share Posted April 9, 2006 But I wasn't especially thinking about Waters, I just said that passing for a bastard is easier than claiming you are a long dead guy ressurected, if you have the correct physical appearance. Oh, I was confused since Waters would not have to "pass" for a bastard seeing as he already is one. her silver trotting to a darkling stream under a sea of stars is hardly symbolical. Not sure what you mean here. Could you elaborate? I don't want to make the same mistake I did with the bastard thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errant Bard Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 Umm sorry but I think thats not from the same triplet?am I wrong?Yep you are the triplet goes like this: [...]mother of dragons, slayer of lies... Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars. A corpse stoof at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly. A blue flower grew from a chinck in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness... mother of dragons, bride of fire... The one depicting her riding her silver is not symbolical because it indeed describes perfectly what happened on her wedding night, see: They rode out together as the star came out, leaving the khalasar [...] it was full dark when they stopped at a grassy place beside a small stream.The prophecy is quite litteral on this one. Maybe it is only past events that are put without symbolism in the prophecy, tho. It is of course an adequate writing trick for Martin, to not spoil the story ahead too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Targaryen Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 I still think it "symbolizes" Drogo. So there is still symbolism there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errant Bard Posted April 10, 2006 Share Posted April 10, 2006 Whatever floats your boat, but you cannot say that the other visions could not be real scenes because there has to be some unity in style, since this one, despite its symbolism, is something that genuinely occured as it is. Maybe it's a real corpse we see, but it symbolize something bigger like sentient wights invading the free cities, for example. Or maybe it's just a corpse, period. In any case I don't think the "unity of style" argument holds water here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon tarkaryen Posted April 10, 2006 Author Share Posted April 10, 2006 Umm sorry but I think thats not from the same triplet?am I wrong?Yep you are the triplet goes like this: The one depicting her riding her silver is not symbolical because it indeed describes perfectly what happened on her wedding night, see: The prophecy is quite litteral on this one. Maybe it is only past events that are put without symbolism in the prophecy, tho. It is of course an adequate writing trick for Martin, to not spoil the story ahead too much. yes first one is clear,but other two... Whatever floats your boat, but you cannot say that the other visions could not be real scenes because there has to be some unity in style, since this one, despite its symbolism, is something that genuinely occured as it is. Maybe it's a real corpse we see, but it symbolize something bigger like sentient wights invading the free cities, for example. Or maybe it's just a corpse, period. In any case I don't think the "unity of style" argument holds water here. yes,true.looks like there really is no unity of style....so we are again nowhere.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Targaryen Posted April 11, 2006 Share Posted April 11, 2006 I don't think I personally made the unity of style argument, unless you mean that all the triplets pertain to something that they say they pertain to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon tarkaryen Posted April 11, 2006 Author Share Posted April 11, 2006 I don't think I personally made the unity of style argument, unless you mean that all the triplets pertain to something that they say they pertain to. Ill say that more or lass what we(or at least I) mean. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rhaenys Posted April 11, 2006 Share Posted April 11, 2006 Ah...so nice to check back after a prolonged absence and see that no one has really put a chink in my exposition of the "grey corpse smiling sadly = Greyjoy" thing... Seriously, though, was it just too long? Too dense? Too boring? Too unasked-for? :cry: BTW - on the possibility of it being an actual prow and not symbolic at all, I see where that's coming from - how do you know its not even somebody's sadly smiling corpse attached to the front of the ship as a prow? However, that sounds an awful lot like something EURON might do...and, as we all know, no one can prove that it is Euron (although apparently it's a big accomplishment to prove that it doesn't have to be Euron, Theon, Victarion, or my aunt Martha). Seriously though - my challenge still stands - somebody prove that it's more likely than not that the second of three parts of the bride of fire triplet does not correspond to a Greyjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Targaryen Posted April 12, 2006 Share Posted April 12, 2006 I totally agreed with your post so I don't accept the challenge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rhaenys Posted April 12, 2006 Share Posted April 12, 2006 I totally agreed with your post so I don't accept the challenge. Thanks - I actually noticed that. I should probably bet something, but I couldn't think of anything suitable. BTW - anybody buying my contention that the corpse thing may be linked to the saying of the ironborn? All in all, I have to say that this thread has been a productive experience for me (or at least as productive as any argument I might engage in about a world that doesn't really exist), since I started off thinking it was Euron, and now I really don't (except for the whole mount to dread issue, maybe...). Speaking of Euron, and seeing how he is the title of this thread, did anyone ever decide why he's drinking so much shade of the evening anyway? I recall that Pyat Pree told Dany that you had to drink more than a little of it to acquire the blue lips... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Targaryen Posted April 12, 2006 Share Posted April 12, 2006 Speaking of Euron, and seeing how he is the title of this thread, did anyone ever decide why he's drinking so much shade of the evening anyway? I recall that Pyat Pree told Dany that you had to drink more than a little of it to acquire the blue lips... It's supposed to open your mind to visions and such. He probably wants that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rhaenys Posted April 12, 2006 Share Posted April 12, 2006 It's supposed to open your mind to visions and such. He probably wants that. It probably establishes that he spent time in Qarth as well, though - of course, he's pretty much spent time everywhere (except Valyria, that liar), so I guess that's not an earthshattering conclusion or anything. I still think he has some connection with the undying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon tarkaryen Posted April 12, 2006 Author Share Posted April 12, 2006 BTW - anybody buying my contention that the corpse thing may be linked to the saying of the ironborn? Yes I belive in that. It probably establishes that he spent time in Qarth as well, though - of course, he's pretty much spent time everywhere (except Valyria, that liar), so I guess that's not an earthshattering conclusion or anything. I still think he has some connection with the undying. Pyat Pree said its supposed to "open your eyes and ears",but its is possible,as you said,it has something with undying. Btw,why do you think he is lieing about Valyria?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Blackfyre Posted April 12, 2006 Share Posted April 12, 2006 Well, IMHO Euron is drinking so much Shade of the Evening because once you start tripping its a hard habit to break...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon tarkaryen Posted April 12, 2006 Author Share Posted April 12, 2006 Well, IMHO Euron is drinking so much Shade of the Evening because once you start tripping its a hard habit to break...... hehehe heroin of westeros Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rhaenys Posted April 12, 2006 Share Posted April 12, 2006 Yes I belive in that. Pyat Pree said its supposed to "open your eyes and ears",but its is possible,as you said,it has something with undying. Btw,why do you rhink he is lieing abou Valyria?? Really, I only think that because the Doom sounds pretty bad, after all, and also because it seems like a waste of space to have a character doubt that he was actually there (it was the Reader, right?) if there isn't any reason to doubt it. However, I do feel that the Euron character has a lot of untapped potential, and it would be cool if he turned out to be more than the mummer's show that I think he is. On a side note, IMO, tripping is not a difficult habit to break... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon tarkaryen Posted April 12, 2006 Author Share Posted April 12, 2006 Really, I only think that because the Doom sounds pretty bad, after all, and also because it seems like a waste of space to have a character doubt that he was actually there (it was the Reader, right?) if there isn't any reason to doubt it. However, I do feel that the Euron character has a lot of untapped potential, and it would be cool if he turned out to be more than the mummer's show that I think he is. On a side note, IMO, tripping is not a difficult habit to break... well of course they doubted.They only has Euron's word on that....no proof or witnesses...but that doesnt mean its not true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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