Moments of Foreshadowing 2

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

OMG these are major houses in the game

Onyx, House Targaryen

Opal, House Stark

Tiger's Eye, House Martel

Tourmaline, House Bolton

Ruby, House Lannister

Amethyst, House Tully (a soft blue with a almost salmon red COA)

Sapphire, House Arryn

Emerald, House Tyrell

Jet, House Greyjoy

Jade, House Tarly

Black Diamond, House Blackfyre

Green Pearl, I can't find any strong correlation, perhaps House Mormont?

Manderly, maybe? Kinda seafoamy, right?

[tze]

Lord Mace Tyrell came forward to present his gift: a golden chalice three feet tall, with two ornate curved handles and seven faces glittering with gemstones. “Seven faces for Your Grace’s seven kingdoms,” the bride’s father explained. He showed them how each face bore the sigil of one of the great houses: ruby lion, emerald rose, onyx stag, silver trout, blue jade falcon, opal sun, and pearl direwolf.

Interesting that the House sigils on the chalice presented to Joffrey include a red lion. Not only are there elements there of bastardy (bastards frequently invert their House's colors, so a red lion on a golden field would be the expected arms of a Lannister bastard, which is of course what Joffrey is), but the death of the "red lion" also inspired the song "the Rains of Castamere", which will soon herald Joffrey's murder at his own wedding (and Joffrey is, as far as we know, poisoned by this very chalice). (Also interesting is the fact that the list of sigils begins with a "red lion" (a bastard lion) and ends with a "white direwolf" (a bastard Stark)).

Out of all of the sigils portrayed on the chalice, the only one that directly corresponds with its House's exact sigil is the Baratheon sigil---an onyx stag on a field of gold (the golden chalice). (This could represent the idea that House Baratheon remains the "rightful" rulers of the seven portrayed kingdoms.) The Lannister, Tyrell, Arryn, and Stark sigils are all inverted, color-wise; only the Baratheon, Martell (if the opal is red), and Tully sigils are their "proper" (as opposed to inverted) colors. Not quite sure what the full implications there are, but I found that interesting.

Two Houses are left off the chalice: House Greyjoy and House Targaryen. That might not be a coincidence, given that House Greyjoy and House Targaryen seem poised to ally as of ADWD.

Illyrio was reclining on a padded couch, gobbling hot peppers and pearl onions from a wooden bowl. His brow was dotted with beads of sweat, his pig’s eyes shining above his fat cheeks. Jewels danced when he moved his hands; onyx and opal, tiger’s eye and tourmaline, ruby, amethyst, sapphire, emerald, jet and jade, a black diamond, and a green pearl.

I'll take a stab at this: I think Illyrio's rings might represent the forces that will destroy him and his plans. Tyrion lists off the rings and then mentions "I could live for years on his rings . . . though I'd need a cleaver to claim them." Illyrio is eating hot pepper and onions while Tyrion casually thinks of cutting off Illyrio's fingers---onions + lost fingers = Davos, who lost his fingers for the crime of smuggling, the crime of bringing items to a place by bypassing the proper authorities (which is basically what the Aegon plan is, especially if Aegon turns out to be a Blackfyre instead of Rhaegar's son).

On Joffrey's chalice, onyx was associated with House Baratheon and opal was associated with House Martell. Tiger's eye could represent Volantis, and tourmaline could represent the Tourmaline Brotherhood of Qarth, known for giving Dany her three-headed-dragon crown. Ruby represented House Lannister on Joffrey's chalice, and also represented Rhaegar himself (specifically, his death on the Trident). The Tears of Lys were disguised as amethysts on Sansa's hairnet, and Xaro gave Dany a (supposedly) enchanted amethyst to protect her from poisons during her meeting with the Pureborn---so amethysts have been repeatedly associated with poison.

Sapphires have been associated with a number of people, including Loras Tyrell (who wore sapphire armor at the Tourney of the Hand) and Brienne of Tarth (called the Sapphire Isle), but sapphires are also notably associated with Symeon Star-Eyes, who supposedly put star sapphires in his eye sockets when he was blinded---the association with the wights and the Others is unmistakeable. Emerald was associated with House Tyrell on Joffrey's chalice. Jet and jade could have a number of implications: Rhaegal's scales have been described as "jade" on multiple occasions, and Drogon's scales are jet-black, so "jet and jade" could represent the black and green dragons. When Davos meets Ser Marlon Manderly, Ser Marlon's helm is described as "the head of the merling king", with a mother-of-pearl crown and a "jutting beard of jade and jet", so "jet and jade" are associated with "the merling king"---which also happens to be the name of the ship that rescued Sansa from King's Landing, so Sansa could come into play here. The ship that, according to Illyrio, brought the grey death to Pentos (that supposedly killed Serra) had "jet and jade" as part of its cargo, and Connington is of course poised to bring a new grey plague to Westeros. And the book that the black (jet)-associated Night's Watch has that references Azor Ahai is called "The Jade Compendium", so "jet and jade" could point toward Azor Ahai, which Rhaegar believed (the real) Aegon was, the Red Priests believe Dany is, and many readers now think Jon actually is.

Black diamonds have been worn by Xaro, Renly, and (most notably) were part of Theon's misshapen crown as the false Prince of Winterfell. The pearl was associated with House Stark on Joffrey's chalice, and green represents the greenseers, so a green pearl might represent a greenseer of House Stark. For that matter, the "Black Pearl" of Braavos descends from Aegon IV and one of his mistresses (the first Black Pearl), so the "green pearl" might tie somehow into the idea of a bastard descending from Aegon IV.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Two Houses are left off the chalice: House Greyjoy and House Targaryen. That might not be a coincidence, given that House Greyjoy and House Targaryen seem poised to ally as of ADWD.

I think there are a couple of other possible reasons for this, too.

1. The Greyjoys are kind of the "black sheep" of the great houses and aren't "worthy" of a spot on the chalice. Joffrey says he might have to replace the Stark pearl with something for the kraken, implying that the Grejoys are moving up as the Starks are falling.

2. It's good Baratheon propaganda to obliterate any presence of the Targaryens from the "great house list." If the Targs were on the chalice, it would send a signal that they're still "hanging around."

I'll take a stab at this: I think Illyrio's rings might represent the forces that will destroy him and his plans. Tyrion lists off the rings and then mentions "I could live for years on his rings . . . though I'd need a cleaver to claim them." Illyrio is eating hot pepper and onions while Tyrion casually thinks of cutting off Illyrio's fingers---onions + lost fingers = Davos, who lost his fingers for the crime of smuggling, the crime of bringing items to a place by bypassing the proper authorities (which is basically what the Aegon plan is, especially if Aegon turns out to be a Blackfyre instead of Rhaegar's son).

On Joffrey's chalice, onyx was associated with House Baratheon and opal was associated with House Martell. Tiger's eye could represent Volantis, and tourmaline could represent the Tourmaline Brotherhood of Qarth, known for giving Dany her three-headed-dragon crown. Ruby represented House Lannister on Joffrey's chalice, and also represented Rhaegar himself (specifically, his death on the Trident). The Tears of Lys were disguised as amethysts on Sansa's hairnet, and Xaro gave Dany a (supposedly) enchanted amethyst to protect her from poisons during her meeting with the Pureborn---so amethysts have been repeatedly associated with poison.

Sapphires have been associated with a number of people, including Loras Tyrell (who wore sapphire armor at the Tourney of the Hand) and Brienne of Tarth (called the Sapphire Isle), but sapphires are also notably associated with Symeon Star-Eyes, who supposedly put star sapphires in his eye sockets when he was blinded---the association with the wights and the Others is unmistakeable. Emerald was associated with House Tyrell on Joffrey's chalice. Jet and jade could have a number of implications: Rhaegal's scales have been described as "jade" on multiple occasions, and Drogon's scales are jet-black, so "jet and jade" could represent the black and green dragons. When Davos meets Ser Marlon Manderly, Ser Marlon's helm is described as "the head of the merling king", with a mother-of-pearl crown and a "jutting beard of jade and jet", so "jet and jade" are associated with "the merling king"---which also happens to be the name of the ship that rescued Sansa from King's Landing, so Sansa could come into play here. The ship that, according to Illyrio, brought the grey death to Pentos (that supposedly killed Serra) had "jet and jade" as part of its cargo, and Connington is of course poised to bring a new grey plague to Westeros. And the book that the black (jet)-associated Night's Watch has that references Azor Ahai is called "The Jade Compendium", so "jet and jade" could point toward Azor Ahai, which Rhaegar believed (the real) Aegon was, the Red Priests believe Dany is, and many readers now think Jon actually is.

Black diamonds have been worn by Xaro, Renly, and (most notably) were part of Theon's misshapen crown as the false Prince of Winterfell. The pearl was associated with House Stark on Joffrey's chalice, and green represents the greenseers, so a green pearl might represent a greenseer of House Stark. For that matter, the "Black Pearl" of Braavos descends from Aegon IV and one of his mistresses (the first Black Pearl), so the "green pearl" might tie somehow into the idea of a bastard descending from Aegon IV.

Brilliant analysis, as usual. Even if your ideas don't end up panning out, I always enjoy reading them. :)

[Ice Turtle]

Interesting that the House sigils on the chalice presented to Joffrey include a red lion. Not only are there elements there of bastardy (bastards frequently invert their House's colors, so a red lion on a golden field would be the expected arms of a Lannister bastard, which is of course what Joffrey is), but the death of the "red lion" also inspired the song "the Rains of Castamere", which will soon herald Joffrey's murder at his own wedding (and Joffrey is, as far as we know, poisoned by this very chalice).

Very interesting point about the red lion.

[The Hungry W0lf]

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but:

And one possible about Stoneheart and Jaime:

Jaime speaking to Cat. I hate the though of Uncat sending Jaime to kill Cersei, but this seems to support this. And it seems that she will go with him.

Sometimes she felt as though her heart was made of stone AGOT page 359

[Fire Eater]

Very interesting point about the red lion.

Combine that with Lady Olenna calling for "The Rains of Castamere" to be played whilst slipping the poison into Joff's chalice.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Combine that with Lady Olenna calling for "The Rains of Castamere" to be played whilst slipping the poison into Joff's chalice.

Which would be the second time the Rains of Castamere signaled death at a wedding ...

And speaking of wedding songs, let us not forget Manderly's suggestions for The Rat Cook, Brave Danny Flint and (I think?) The Night That Ended.

[Fire Eater]

"I loved a maid as red as autumn with sunset in her hair." (Sansa, she has auburn hair).

"I loved a maid as white as winter, with moonglow in her hair." (Val)

The light of the half-moon turned Val's honey-blond hair a pale silver and left her cheeks as white as snow.

"I loved a maid as fair as summer with sunlight in her hair" (Cersei)

I can analyze it this way:

Cersei the Summer Queen

Sansa the Autumn Queen, she was Queen of love and beauty at the Tourney of the Hand

Val the Winter Queen: Her sister was a queen why not her.

[Ser Pollo Loco]

"I loved a maid as red as autumn with sunset in her hair." (Sansa, she has auburn hair).

"I loved a maid as white as winter, with moonglow in her hair." (Val)

"I loved a maid as fair as summer with sunlight in her hair" (Cersei)

I can analyze it this way:

Cersei the Summer Queen

Sansa the Autumn Queen, she was Queen of love and beauty at the Tourney of the Hand

Val the Winter Queen: Her sister was a queen why not her.

You maybe right but I could just as easily see

"I loved a maid as red as autumn with sunset in her hair." (Ygritte).

"I loved a maid as white as winter, with moonglow in her hair." (Val)

"I loved a maid as fair as summer with sunlight in her hair" (Dany)

If this is foreshadowing then Val i'm almost sure of because Jon see's that her hair looks silver when the moon is shinning on it

[Ser Wun Wun]

You maybe right but I could just as easily see

"I loved a maid as red as autumn with sunset in her hair." (Ygritte).

"I loved a maid as white as winter, with moonglow in her hair." (Val)

"I loved a maid as fair as summer with sunlight in her hair" (Dany)

If this is foreshadowing then Val i'm almost sure of because Jon see's that her hair looks silver when the moon is shinning on it

Interesting...but personally I would switch Dany and Val in that equation, since Dany has silver hair and Val is actually blonde (that little incident with the moonlight shining on her aside). Maybe Jon loves Dany, she dies, then he moves on with Val?

What song do those lyrics come from by the way? Who sings them? I'm awful at remembering that sort of stuff.

[tze]

"I loved a maid as red as autumn with sunset in her hair." (Sansa, she has auburn hair).

"I loved a maid as white as winter, with moonglow in her hair." (Val)

"I loved a maid as fair as summer with sunlight in her hair" (Cersei)

I can analyze it this way:

Cersei the Summer Queen

Sansa the Autumn Queen, she was Queen of love and beauty at the Tourney of the Hand

Val the Winter Queen: Her sister was a queen why not her.

Very, very interesting.

"I loved a maid as red as autumn with sunset in her hair." I think this could represent Melisandre. Mel is heavily associated with the color red, and autumn represented the zenith of her powers.

I agree with Val as the "winter maid" and Cersei as "the summer maid", as the description of Val is too spot-on to be a coincidence (and Dany, of course, is not associated with winter), and House Lannister is heavily associated with their golden hair (Lann the Clever supposedly "stole gold from the sun" to color his hair). Though I do wonder if the point might be less about a single woman as a queen-figure, and more to highlight the particular groups that come to power in various seasons?

The "maid with summer in her hair" would then represent House Lannister, whose power was (ironically) strongest in the summer, (the time before everyone started rebelling against them). The "maid with sunset in her hair", Melisandre, could represent the Red Priesthood, whose powers seem to have grown the most during the autumn---but in winter, the fires die, so it would make sense for winter's arrival to actually signal the downfall of the Red Priests' powers. The "maid with moonglow in her hair", Val, could represent the wildlings in general---as the people most accustomed to winter, winter would logically be the time when they will be most powerful.

And spring is the one season which gets no verse, so we don't know which "maid" will be "loved" in spring. This might be a hint that we won't actually see the arrival of spring, so we'll never know who would become powerful in spring.

[Fire Eater]

and [Jaime and Brienne] were back in the saddle before the sun came up.

Jaime and Brienne are saddled onto a horse together when they are taken to Harrenhal by the Bloody Mummers. Jaime was losing spirit, but later managed to undergo his rebirth like the sun (which he is often compared to) rising. It could also at hint Jaime and Brienne's relationship.

"Oh, yes," said Tyrion. "I am the very soul of kindness, And I would know about bad dreams."

Cersei can attest to that in AFfC.

Why waste your breath on the dead?

Beric Dondarrion gives the breath of life to a dead Catelyn.

the moon rose higher in the sky, and down below the ground the heads of forgotten kings whispered secrets.

Bloodraven was the head of King Aerys I's reign, and he can speak only in whispers now in subterranean cave of the CotF.

[Ice Turtle]

From The Mystery Knight:

Oak and iron guard me well, or else I'm dead and doomed to hell, Dunk thought, before he remembered that this shield was made of pine.

From Wiki:

House Hewett of Oakenshield rules over one of the Shield Islands. The Shield Islands are a considerable sea strength and were the first line of defense during the days that the ironborn pirates tried to sail up the Mander to sack the wealth of the Reach.

Lord Hewett's castle, with thick walls and studded oaken gates evoking the ancient arms of the house, sits above the harbor of Lord Hewett's Town, which is a relatively big port.

They blazon their arms with an oaken escutcheon studded with iron, a field bendy of undulating blue and white.Their words are not mentioned in the books.

Could this mean that either Highgarden or Oldtown is doomed to hell? Or maybe whole Reach?

[1234567]

Not sure if this one has been mentioned, but it might tie into Stoneheart taking back Riverrun at Daven's wedding.

Cat talking about Walder Frey

Catelyn would gladly have spitted the querulous old man and roasted him over a fire.

[Catelyn's Treacherous Womb]

Did anyone discuss this yet?

"The next morning she woke stiff and sore and aching, with ants crawling on her arms and legs and face. When she realized what they were, she kicked aside the stalks of dry brown grass that had served as her bed and blanket and struggled to her feet. She had bites all over her, little red bumps, itchy and inflamed. Where did all the ants come from? Dany brushed them from her arms and legs and belly. She ran a hand across her stubbly scalp where her hair had burned away, and felt more ants on her head, and one crawling down the back of her neck. She knocked them off and crushed them under her bare feet. There were so many …

It turned out that their anthill was on the other side of her wall. She wondered how the ants had managed to climb over it and find her. To them these tumbledown stones must loom as huge as the Wall of Westeros. The biggest wall in all the world, her brother Viserys used to say, as proud as if he'd built it himself.

Viserys told her tales of knights so poor that they had to sleep beneath the ancient hedges that grew along the byways of the Seven Kingdoms. Dany would have given much and more for a nice thick hedge. Preferably one without an anthill."

Is this GRRM confirming that we will have Dany vs WW?

I think there are a number of possibilities there:

[snip]

Wow, I can't believe I hadn't noticed that foreshadowing. Amazing.

[Fire Eater]

Jaime on shaving his head: I don’t look as much like Cersei this way. She’ll hate that.

That's taken care of when Cersei has to undergo her walk of shame.

[ASOIAF best series ever]

In the begining of the A Clash of Kings Prologue maester Cressen thinks to himself "Pylos had come to replace him when he died. He did not mind. Someone must take his place, and sooner than he would like..."

This obviously shows that the Maester is getting old but it also foreshadows his death.

[Tyrion_is_Omar]

Probably, has been discussed many times before, but

The birth of Mance's child foreshadow the truth about the birth of Jon.

[Ser Wun Wun]

Probably, has been discussed many times before, but

The birth of Mance's child foreshadow the truth about the birth of Jon.

I've never heard that.

What do you mean exactly? You mean the baby switch Jon pulled (even though I don't think Jon was switched with anyone)? Or do you mean the actual birth? As in they were both born while their father was away at battle, and their mothers died?

[Ice Turtle]

Probably, has been discussed many times before, but

The birth of Mance's child foreshadow the truth about the birth of Jon.

I don't think I heard this one before, but it's really interesting how Mance's son's life mirrors Jon's in a way and of course there is Bael's story.