Jaime will save his children

[Sworn Shield]

Am I the only person on this forum that thinks Tommen and Myrcella are going to live. I know the whole "gold shall be their crowns and gold shall be their shrouds", but when do prophecies ever turn out like we think they do.

However the main reason I think they will live is when ever I read Jaime chapters in AFFC and ADWD it seems like he wants to be a father to his two children. IIRC Jaime thinks, 'would Tommen prefer to be king or have a father?'. For me what is more likely is that Jaime is going to rescue his children, tell them and the realm that he is their father and let the realm and Cersei be damned.

I know GRRM is a dark author and ASOIAF is a dark book series, but after having time to get to know Tommen and Myrcella I would hate to see them killed off. If they are killed off it actually makes Ned's death even more meaningless as it was Ned's refusal to see what happened to the Targ kids happen again that got him killed. Ned has been kicked in the teeth once too many times, I don't want to see his mercy to be completely for nothing.

Edited for Dyslexia

[Jaime's Wench]

I know GRRM is a dark author and ASOIAF is a dark book series, but after having time to get to know Tommen and Myrcella I would hate to see them killed off. If they are killed off it actually makes Ned's death even more meaningless as it was Ned's refusal to see what happened to the Targ kids happen again that got him killed. Ned has been kicked in the teeth once too many times, I don't want to see his mercy to be completely for nothing.

I have never seen it like this, but you are right. It was his compassion for Joffrey, Tommen and Mycrella that killed him and it would make that somewhat meaningless. I am fairly sure Joffrey needed to die in order to push other people's stories forward, including Jaime's.

I hate the prophecy, just because GRRM seems to stick by his prophecies so far. It has to play some part in the Lannister conclusion, but I hope that it is not fulfilled exactly how it is perceived to. Maybe the 'gold will shroud them' will mean that they will become Lannisters in name, and die Lannisters of Casterly Rock, having regained those lands with their father? (Now there is some wishful thinking!)

I do think it would be very cruel of GRRM to maim Mycrella and then kill her, though. I think she will be crowned in a Martell or Tyrell conspiracy (perhaps involving Aegon?), but where Tommen will be at that point is anybody's guess.

[I do not sew]

No way those kids are fucked.

[Sworn Shield]

Yes Joffrey had to die, his crimes were numerous and it was a mercy to the realm that was killed off. However what has Tommen and Mycrella ever done to warrant them to be 'fucked'. Perhaps they will be killed off, but if I see them die it will feel like one hell of a low blow to the kids, to Jaime, to Ned and to me the reader.

[Jaime's Wench]

It would be a low blow. I do not think GRRM would have Jaime suddenly begin to care for them if he didn't intend for Jaime to do something about it (hence why I get so annoyed those who believe he's about to die at the hands of Stoneheart). Yes, one may die, but GRRM hasn't killed any on-screen kids yet... He has put them through a very tough time, but he hasn't yet killed them. He might not have even killed Aegon, during Robert's Rebellion.

I know as both a writer and a reader I would not be very happy if he killed them both, especially since they both have promising qualities to their personalities.

[brAnthelAstgreenseer]

Jaime will survive the series for sure and so will his kids... but i dont think at any point he is going to be nedded to save them at all..

[I do not sew]

Yes Joffrey had to die, his crimes were numerous and it was a mercy to the realm that was killed off. However what has Tommen and Mycrella ever done to warrant them to be 'fucked'. Perhaps they will be killed off, but if I see them die it will feel like one hell of a low blow to the kids, to Jaime, to Ned and to me the reader.

"Deserves got nuthin' to do with it."

Prophecy aside (I refuse to dissect those fuckers) their House is all but destroyed and an insane amount of powerful and ruthless players would prosper from their deaths. Not much when weighed against "but they're daddy luvs dem now and they are so nice and I just wouldn't like it bleh nope nope yucky" I know, but what can I say I guess I'm just cynical.

[Jaime's Wench]

"Deserves got nuthin' to do with it."

Prophecy aside (I refuse to dissect those fuckers) their House is all but destroyed and an insane amount of powerful and ruthless players would prosper from their deaths. Not much when weighed against "but they're daddy luvs dem now and they are so nice and I just wouldn't like it bleh nope nope yucky" I know, but what can I say I guess I'm just cynical.

That is quite true. But at the same time, there would be very little satisfaction in killing them both and destroying the whole of Lannister House. I do not see GRRM destroying any House completely - and in order for the Lannisters to survive, you need at least one of them.

[Winter's Knight]

Wait, since when does Jaime care about his children as a father would? Because his idea of telling them about their parentage and claiming them is downright idiotic and the worst possible thing he could do to them.

[Myrish Swamp Thing]

That is quite true. But at the same time, there would be very little satisfaction in killing them both and destroying the whole of Lannister House. I do not see GRRM destroying any House completely - and in order for the Lannisters to survive, you need at least one of them.

Little satisfaction in destroying House Lannister? Speak for yourself.

Anyway, Kevan's kids can take over. The lions are not at risk.

[Helgar]

Am I the only person on this forum that thinks Tommen and Myrcella are going to live. I know the whole "gold shall be their crowns and gold shall be their shrouds", but when do prophecies ever turn out like we think they do.

More often than you'd think, in fact. Aside from the Stallion Who Will Mount the World, most other prophecies have turned out to be true. Melisandre's visions (regardless of how she interprets them), the dwarf crone's dreams, Patchface's ramblings, even Jojen's green dreams have come true. GRRM is fond of making prophecies come true.

However the main reason I think they will live is when ever I read Jaime chapters in AFFC and ADWD it seems like he wants to be a father to his two children. IIRC Jaime thinks 'Tommen would prefer to be king or have a father'. For me what is more likely is that Jaime is going to rescue his children, tell them and the realm that he is their father and let the realm and Cersei be damned.

Jaime spends more time thinking about Hildy's nipples than his kids. But even if he didn't, I can hardly see how he can save them. He's going to meet LS and even if he survives he'll be far away from both of them. And even so, how can a cripple who can hardly hold a blade save anyone against an assassin, for instance? Unless the assassin is a bear, I don't see how he can help.

I know GRRM is a dark author and ASOIAF is a dark book series, but after having time to get to know Tommen and Myrcella I would hate to see them killed off. If they are killed off it actually makes Ned's death even more meaningless as it was Ned's refusal to see what happened to the Targ kids happen again that got him killed. Ned has been kicked in the teeth once too many times, I don't want to see his mercy to be completely for nothing.

Many fans have grown fond of Tommen and Myrcella, but I don't think that's going to count for much in the end. Even if GRRM was aware of this (which he might be), he has stated he doesn't let the fanbase alter his plans for the story. So... I don't think it's likely.

[Jaime's Wench]

Hmmm. The Jaime haters have arrived so I think I will depart, in fear of getting into another argument :-p

[Helgar]

Hmmm. The Jaime haters have arrived so I think I will depart, in fear of getting into another argument :-p

There are several very good reasons to hate Jaime. House Lannister is the most controversial and morally screwed up faction in the entire series. I'd say the 'hate' is justified. :P

[I do not sew]

I love House Lannister, Tommen is hilarious and Myrcella is a surprise badass, but c'mon nah. They're boned.

And as for not destroying a House completely, tell that to House Arryn.

[Black Wolf Smith]

Tommen will die. Likely from something stupid that Cersei will do. Mycrella has been mamed, maybe that is enough. Whatever happens to them, they will never see Jaime again. Even if Lady SH doesn't kill him, he head away from them. I don't think that he will be anywhere near KL, for at least til the end of the series.

[House Of Wolves]

You could be on to something. I do think the prophecy will come true and for joffery that meant death but for tommen and mycella the meaning could be different. There can actually be different meanings to the word shroud.

1. To warp ( a corpse) in burial clothing

2. To shut off from sight , screen.

3. To shelter Protect.

So it could mean gold will be there shelter or protector . gold will screen them and shut the off from sight. now this would mean protection rather then death. gold itself could mean the money they will use to be hidden safe in exile or gold could also represent Jamie the golden knight that will protect them. I mean the guy even has a golden hand. Im not going to say there not going to die but its interesting to think about.

[Sworn Shield]

From ADWD:

"He thought of Myrcella. I will need to tell her too. The Dornishmen might not like that. Doran Martell betrothed her to his son in the belief that she was Robert's blood. Knots and tangles, Jaime thought, wishing he could cut through all of it with one swift stoke of his sword."

This makes me think Jaime's attitude to his kids is changed and he wants to be a father.

[I do not sew]

There's also a few inner monologues where he thinks about how little he gives a shit about them (I don't remember if it applied to all of them or just Joff. I do remember him not caring that Joff was dead though).

Still, once again, his fatherly love is irrelevant to the amount of force it takes to dash Tommen's head against a wall. It isn't much.

[Jaime's Wench]

Why would anyone dash Tommen's head in? He's such a useful pawn.

[Winter's Knight]

Hmmm. The Jaime haters have arrived so I think I will depart, in fear of getting into another argument :-p

Don't hate Jaime. :dunno:

The Lannister siblings are easily in my top ten list-Tyrion had fallen off on a re-read but the Tyion re-read has changed my mind about him again.