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References and Homages

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I'm not a student of history, so I can't comment on character names, but note the Maesters who make/distribute opiates are based in Oldtown, ruled by Hightowers, and the nearest major city (on the Kingsroad, anyway) is Highgarden to the NE. I wonder what the farmers between the two 'high' cities grow?

--Alaric

Edited by The Real Alaric

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I'm not a student of history, so I can't comment on character names, but note the Maesters who make/distribute opiates are based in Oldtown, ruled by Hightowers, and the nearest major city (on the Kingsroad, anyway) is Highgarden to the NE. I wonder what the farmers between the two 'high' cities grow?

--Alaric

Edited by The Blackfish

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It gets better...while reviewing Robert's arrival at Winterfell, I noted that he mentions Highgarden's "fields of golden roses that stretch away as far as the eye can see"...while not all poppies are golden, California's state flower is the golden poppy, and this drawing from http://www.lieberson.com/en/neuro_medical_info/medicines shows a golden opium poppy: http://www.lieberson.com/en/Images/09_Hist...Poppy%20200.jpg

Note also "But the invaders discovered that without the Incan 'gift of the gods', the natives could barely work the fields - or mine gold. So it came to be cultivated even by the Catholic Church." ( http://www.cocaine.org ) Makes you wonder what exactly "Casterly Rock" is. Maybe gold just grows on trees in Lannister-land ( http://www.cocaine.org/cokelefs.html ).

Anyway, just some late-night free association (better than free-basing :) )

--Alaric

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The elderly Paxter Redwyne in Cersei 3 made me think of elderly Viacom chairman (and classic Hollywood Titan) Sumner Redstone ... wonder if GRRM had any dealings with Redstone in his days in Hollywood ...

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I'm not sure, but in both the Hedge Knight and ASOIAF, there are Crakehall knights called "Strongboar". There was a historical figure, Richard de Clare, the 2nd Earl of Pembroke, who was known as "Strongbow". Information about him is here.

--Tacye

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Is it possible that Howland Reed, whose dwelling apparently moves around the marshlands, is a reference to the titular character of Howl's Moving Castle by Diana Wynne Jones?

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Dunno if this has already been covered, but there was a family that participated in the Wars of the Roses named "Tyrell," and it has always been a part of popular history that Sir James Tyrell was the one to suggest to Richard III that he murder his nephews in the tower.

Can't remember what his coat of arms looked like, but I do know that he would have been a white rose.

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Is it possible that Howland Reed, whose dwelling apparently moves around the marshlands, is a reference to the titular character of Howl's Moving Castle by Diana Wynne Jones?

It's unlikely... movable dwellings have a loooong history in folklore. Silverberg has one in his Fafhrd and Grey Mouser stories, IIRC, inspired in turn by Baba Yaga myths. And frankly I'd be more willing to believe George has read Silverberg than Diana Wynne Jones. :P

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It's unlikely... movable dwellings have a loooong history in folklore. Silverberg has one in his Fafhrd and Grey Mouser stories, IIRC, inspired in turn by Baba Yaga myths. And frankly I'd be more willing to believe George has read Silverberg than Diana Wynne Jones. :P

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Oops, brain burp. Said Silverberg, meant Lieber*. :blush: Hey, they're both German names! :P

I imagine George might well have read DWJ: but I know he's read Lieber.

The names don't signify much, I think. Unless there are some other parallels.

* I do this all the time in RL. Example: the other week in a memo I referred to a work colleague, Bruce [T], as 'Bruce Campbell' throughout. :P

Edited by mormont

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Hi Everyone

I am a LONG time lurker but this is my first post. My wife and I are expecting a baby and so we have started to look at possible names and their meanings.

We had to laugh when we happened to stumble upon the meaning behind "Bran".

Bran means "raven" in Welsh. In Welsh legend Bran the Blessed (called also Bendigeid Vran) was the son of the god Llyr. Later Welsh legends describe him as a king of Britain who was killed attacking Ireland.

hmm according to one commentator on that site... Bran was attacking Ireland to rescue his sister who was being mistreated by her husband.

http://www.behindthename.com/php/view.php?name=bran-2

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Probably already discussed but Westeros and the Wall are very reminiscent of England and Hadrians Wall.

That Robert Jordan thing was interesting, didn't catch it upon my read of AFFC.

Did anyone mention that the Titan of Braavos was a nod to the Colossus of Rhodes? That one is pretty much obvious though.

Edited by Ser Piggy Of The Baby Back Rib

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I don't know how close in this is, but Alexander Pope was an incredibly intelligent, lettered man who was also small and crooked, only reaching a height of four feet six inches. Of course, he was so as a result of having TB as a child, not a genetic quirk, but still. I think that's rather intriguing.

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"at least tolkien's casual racism doesn't seem to exist in martin, though strange things tend to be afoot when we're talking about some black folks in all these books." - I just stumbled upon this sentence, and as always when I read sentences like that, I want to ask: "Care to explain?". I dislike the attempts to shove Tolkien into the rascism-corner.

But, back to topic: The way Viserys dies reminds me of the death of the roman politican Crassus. He was the third man in the first triumpherate with Caesar and Pompey. Envying the glory from their military campaigns Caesar and Pompey enjoyed, he tried to beat the feared Parthian Empire, which was the heir of ancient Persia and had an cavalry army, mainly mounted archers. Crassus lost, was captured, and then killed. The parthians executed him by pouring molten gold down his throat - a reference to Crassus status as the richest man of Rome.

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I just found a new one in the Raymond Chandler's novel, The Long Goodbye.

In one chapter, there's a character named Gregorious who's an extremly brutal cop, who would punch you as soon as look at you. He's an corrupt oxlike character. Doesn't that remind you of someone. ;)

Artanaro

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Edric is the name of the Spacing Guild conspirator in Dune Messiah, could be just a coincidence, though.

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May not be a reference, but it got me all excited:

SPOILER: small AFFC spoiler
One of the books the Reader is reading is "Signs and Portents". That's the name of Season 1 of Babylon 5!

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Ah...first post!

I'll add one of the most obvious(In my opinion,at least :P )homages:

The Targaryens,beautiful,pale,red eyed(at least some of them),incestuous,drgonlords and conquerers hailing from an ancient and refined culture,called "blood of the dragons" ...do not come from Valyria,but from Melnibonè!

Beric Dondarrion the renegade lord hiding in the woods and harrassing the troops of an unjust ruler with the aid of commoners,reminds my strongly of...well,ehr...Robin Hood!

:lol:

Obviously only 'till the storyline concerning that group does not take a more "metaphisical" path.

As an overall source of inspiration,I think Martin used alot 2 poems of the '500 Italian literature:Ariosto's "Orlando Furioso" and mostly Tasso's "La Gerusalemme Liberata".

These 2 are long poems about knights with TONS and an extremly entangled plot ,where the narration shifts continuously from one character to the other...

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First post for me too! I think I've found two nods to one of my favourite SF-F writers ever - aunt Ursula... :P

The usual name for the Stark rulers of old - Kings of Winter = "King of Winter", Ursula's short story from the Hainish series.

Children of the Forest - small, green, tree-hugging philosophy, peaceful until pissed-off = Athsheans, hilf natives of the Athshe/New Tahiti in "The Word for World is Forest"

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Good call on the Melnibonese. Though Elric would stab Dany with Stormbringer faster than you can say "pale brooding prince."

I have never met George or been to a convention but I'd bet everything I own that Varys is inspired by or partially based, either conscously or unconscously, on Hurree Babu in Kipling's "Kim."

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