"Wow, I Never Noticed That."

[Lady Green]

To the vast majority of readers and tv viewers it is still a shhhhhh.

I can see how the TV viewers can still be in the dark, there was no blue rose growing from a chink of ice :( I don't understand why they did what they did to the House of the Undying, its so important to Dany's storyline!

This reminds me of the first couple of weeks of watching the TV series. I was still waiting for my fiancée to finish the first book, so I hadn't read anything yet, and stayed away from discussion boards and stuff. I went out to have coffee with a friend, and we start talking about the TV show, and she blurts out "Did you know Ned Stark dies at the end of the season?". And I didn't know. So she said "Oh, well EVERYONE knows." Biggest spoiler of my life!

:( there are worse things to spoil than Ned's loss of head though, least they didn't spoil with something from aDwD!

[Yavannie]

:( there are worse things to spoil than Ned's loss of head though, least they didn't spoil with something from aDwD!

Going very OT now, but this friend is still (more than a year later) only halfway into ACOK and I'm on my second reading of the whole series. There are so very many things I could spoil for her now, but no, I'm a good and honourable person! *sniffs*

[The Titan's Legitimate Son]

Going very OT now, but this friend is still (more than a year later) only halfway into ACOK and I'm on my second reading of the whole series. There are so very many things I could spoil for her now, but no, I'm a good and honourable person! *sniffs*

Are you a good and honourable person? Mayhaps.

[Lady Green]

Going very OT now, but this friend is still (more than a year later) only halfway into ACOK and I'm on my second reading of the whole series. There are so very many things I could spoil for her now, but no, I'm a good and honourable person! *sniffs*

how on earth have they only managed to get there!?!?

Are you a good and honourable person? Mayhaps.

Congrats, you may now challenge the Lord of the Crossing.

[The Mountain That Posts]

how on earth have they only managed to get there!?!?

Some people are super slow readers. I have a friend who must've started A Storm of Swords back in June, and he only just read the Purple Wedding last week.

[A Crow Come Over]

and he's not even really a secret anymore. We all know.

People really need to stop treating R+L=J as canon, it's far from proven.

[Lady Green]

People really need to stop treating R+L=J as canon, it's far from proven.

But highly likely, if his mother is just a fishwife, or even Ashara Dayne, then why the secrecy?

[A Crow Come Over]

But highly likely, if his mother is just a fishwife, or even Ashara Dayne, then why the secrecy?

If his mom IS Ashara (big IF) then there would be plenty of reason for secrecy.

I like the idea of Jon being Ned's son rather than being a Targaryen.

But this is off topic and I dont want to threadjack, just wanted to point out that it has not been proven yet and could very well end being a red herring.

[A Crow Come Over]

Some people are super slow readers. I have a friend who must've started A Storm of Swords back in June, and he only just read the Purple Wedding last week.

Barney gets married in SoS?

[Jslay427]

If his mom IS Ashara (big IF) then there would be plenty of reason for secrecy.

I like the idea of Jon being Ned's son rather than being a Targaryen.

But this is off topic and I dont want to threadjack, just wanted to point out that it has not been proven yet and could very well end being a red herring.

If Jon was Ned's son no way would he llet Cat treat him like that. "He is my blood, that's all you need to know"

[Jslay427]

Barney gets married in SoS?

Baby Bop couldn't forever hold her peace.

[A Crow Come Over]

If Jon was Ned's son no way would he llet Cat treat him like that. "He is my blood, that's all you need to know"

Treat him like what? A bastard? He is a bastard.

By all accounts, Jon and Catelyn hardly interacted, she may have harbored a hatred for him but she never struck him or anything like that.

[Jslay427]

Treat him like what? A bastard? He is a bastard.

By all accounts, Jon and Catelyn hardly interacted, she may have harbored a hatred for him but she never struck him or anything like that.

She told Ned that Jon couldn't stay at Winterfell when he went to KL to be hand. If Jon was really Ned's son, bastard or not, I think he would have objected and not ok'd Jon going to the NW

[A Crow Come Over]

She told Ned that Jon couldn't stay at Winterfell when he went to KL to be hand. If Jon was really Ned's son, bastard or not, I think he would have objected and not ok'd Jon going to the NW

Again, why not? Ned holds the NW in high regard and views it as an honor to join and we don't know that Ned didn't plan on sending him there anyway.

I think we should take this over to the R+L=J thread tho :P

[FittleLinger]

She told Ned that Jon couldn't stay at Winterfell when he went to KL to be hand. If Jon was really Ned's son, bastard or not, I think he would have objected and not ok'd Jon going to the NW

Actually, it's exactly the opposite. Cat looks at Jon and sees living proof of Ned's adultery. If she knew he was not Ned's son but a nephew Ned promised to take care of, she would not have been so cold to him.

And the NW was the perfect place for Jon even if he was really Ned's bastard. It is explicitly said that bastards and third sons of the Starks often take the black. heck, Ned's brother who is not a bastard was at the wall. Characters in the books think Jon really is Ned's and see nothing strange in him taking the black.

But really, let's not drift this away, there is the R+L thread for those matters.

[Pocketsaviour]

Hello! long time lurker, first time poster. ..

Currently rereading for the third time and have just realised that the little old lady who Arya meets when she's with the BWB, the one who asks Tom o'sevens for a song, is the woods witch who told Aerys's dad that Aerys had to marry his bride because the prince that was promised would come of their union.

[The Titan's Legitimate Son]

Hello! long time lurker, first time poster. ..

Currently rereading for the third time and have just realised that the little old lady who Arya meets when she's with the BWB, the one who asks Tom o'sevens for a song, is the woods witch who told Aerys's dad that Aerys had to marry his bride because the prince that was promised would come of their union.

I thought she was also supposed to be Maggy the Frog too, who told Cersei Lannister her prophecy and is the grandmother/great grand mother of Jeyne Westerling. Or am I adding 2 and 2 to make 5?

[Ser Lepus]

I thought she was also supposed to be Maggy the Frog too, who told Cersei Lannister her prophecy and is the grandmother/great grand mother of Jeyne Westerling. Or am I adding 2 and 2 to make 5?

I doubt that. Maggy the Frog married a rich merchant who created his own noble house, the Spicers, who intermarried with the Westerlings. If Maggy were alive she would be with her house.

The dwarf seer could be the same who befriended Jenny of Oldstones and Duncan the Small. That happened too long ago for a regular human being, but she could have some COTF's blood in her.

[The Titan's Legitimate Son]

I doubt that. Maggy the Frog married a rich merchant who created his own noble house, the Spicers, who intermarried with the Westerlings. If Maggy were alive she would be with her house.

The dwarf seer could be the same who befriended Jenny of Oldstones and Duncan the Small. That happened too long ago for a regular human being, but she could have some COTF's blood in her.

Her son created the house didn't he? Also, from Cersei's POV and recollection, Maggy was a woodswitch (same as Ghost of High Heart), who lived in Lannisport and so not with her family.

[RumHam]

The dwarf seer could be the same who befriended Jenny of Oldstones and Duncan the Small. That happened too long ago for a regular human being, but she could have some COTF's blood in her.

Isn't this more or less confirmed by her asking Tom O' Sevens for the song about "my Jenny?"