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The Lyanna + Rhaegar = Jon Thread


Stark Future

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1. Yes, the Blue Flower ont he Wall of Ice is to be her third husband. Read the prophecy :P

-the three visions-

"Bride of Fire, you will be wed 3 times"

2. I think it has, and it is to believed if there are 3 dragon riders it will be Dany- Jon- Tyrion, of whos all mothers died at childbirth (if u belive R + L = J)

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By the way, it's time to put to rest the "blue flower" ambiguous mention in the House of Undying. In the next and last Dany chapter of Clash of Kings, Mormont discusses her visions and he clearly says "blue rose", so either he interpreted Dany's tale as one of the famous blue winter roses, or Daenerys herfself identified the flower as a rose.

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It's not 100% certain, but I'd say 99%, since Mormont is a northman and would probably recognize a winter rose if he saw one, or had one described to him. Personally, I doubt Daenerys identified the flower as a rose, because she hasn't even been living in Westeros for more than a few days; unless someone gave her some blue roses, or one of Mormont's books described them, she'd have no idea what they are.

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It's not 100% certain, but I'd say 99%, since Mormont is a northman and would probably recognize a winter rose if he saw one, or had one described to him. Personally, I doubt Daenerys identified the flower as a rose, because she hasn't even been living in Westeros for more than a few days; unless someone gave her some blue roses, or one of Mormont's books described them, she'd have no idea what they are.

What do winter roses look like? I mean, if they look like roses she would recognize them as roses even if they have an unusual colour.

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Im sure she has seen roses. She lived pretty well until ugh his name... Sir Connigtan? Died. Illyrio mustve has some Flowers around and she is not uneducated. She must know what flowers look like. If the free cities were like southern Europe, then there are plenty of roses there.

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I picked this up on a reread of AGOT, and I don't think this line has been mentioned in the R+L= J theory clues yet. (but I could be wrong)

Unfortunately, I can't find the exact page and so can't provide the exact quote, but it's in there... somewhere... I will add another reply when I find the durn thing.

It's in one of Ned's POVs, and he's thinking about Robert and how he leaves the room when Ned is pleading with him not to have Sansa's wolf Lady killed. I believe it's after they reach King's Landing. In his mind he connects the memory of Sansa pleading for her wolf with Lyanna's pleading. I thought for a moment why Ned made that connection, but it became clear- Lyanna pleading for Ned to protect her and Rhaegar's son (Jon) from Robert's wrath. Ned was thinking about his old friend's apparent lack of conscience for the murder of innocents. (I believe Ned was also remembering the deaths of Rhaella and Aegon, but again, I can't find the exact passage.)

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It's in one of Ned's POVs, and he's thinking about Robert and how he leaves the room when Ned is pleading with him not to have Sansa's wolf Lady killed. I believe it's after they reach King's Landing. In his mind he connects the memory of Sansa pleading for her wolf with Lyanna's pleading. I thought for a moment why Ned made that connection, but it became clear- Lyanna pleading for Ned to protect her and Rhaegar's son (Jon) from Robert's wrath. Ned was thinking about his old friend's apparent lack of conscience for the murder of innocents. (I believe Ned was also remembering the deaths of Rhaella and Aegon, but again, I can't find the exact passage.)

Let me get one thing out of the way. Welcome to the board :D . I sometimes feel I'm extra mean to our community's new members, so I'll try to be nice.

In reference to your quote, this is circumstantial evidence that Lyanna asked something from Ned, which is explained one (though not the only) way, by her having a child. Does this support R+L=J? Only in that it adds fuel to Lyanna having a child with Rhaegar. As proof that Jon is that child, nahh, it does nothing :P . Cheerio and good job noticing the quote.

Artanaro

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HOLY CRAP!!!!

there are 500 posts on R+L= J now. does this make our theory fact?? cuz that would be cool.

not entirely, since many of the posts in this topic are refuting the theory.

but 500, thats quite a number. what's the largest thread on these boards anyway?

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Let me get one thing out of the way. Welcome to the board :D . I sometimes feel I'm extra mean to our community's new members, so I'll try to be nice.

In reference to your quote, this is circumstantial evidence that Lyanna asked something from Ned, which is explained one (though not the only) way, by her having a child. Does this support R+L=J? Only in that it adds fuel to Lyanna having a child with Rhaegar. As proof that Jon is that child, nahh, it does nothing :P . Cheerio and good job noticing the quote.

Artanaro

No, there is direct evidence that Lyanna asked Ned for something (hence the whole "Promise me, Ned" bit), and strong circumstantial evidence that it is protection for her child, based off of the described circumstances of her death.

By itself, it does not mean that the child that was born became Jon, but put in combination with other circumstantial evidence, and other bits of direct evidence, it seems likely that the child would be Jon simply because it is the simplest theory that doesn't require a whole lot of extraneous information (in the form of an unsupported baby-swap, and the like).

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No, there is direct evidence that Lyanna asked Ned for something (hence the whole "Promise me, Ned" bit), and strong circumstantial evidence that it is protection for her child, based off of the described circumstances of her death.

Let me rephrase. It's circumstantial that she asked Ned to protect her son, as you say. I should have moved some dependent clauses around in that sentence. Proofreading is overrated on message boards :P . Cheerio.

Artanaro

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Let me rephrase. It's circumstantial that she asked Ned to protect her son, as you say. I should have moved some dependent clauses around in that sentence. Proofreading is overrated on message boards :P . Cheerio.

Artanaro

:P:)

Although seriously, it is difference. Perhaps I should not have italicized direct; that was a little harsh.

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