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[TWoW Spoilers] Barristan


Ran
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Victarion is needed way more tha anyone. He is the leader of the Iron Fleet. He is the one who technically will save Mereen. He is the one who is brignign Moqorro to the Dragon Queen. If he dies, who will lead the Iron Fleet? Jorah?

Victarion is doing what Quentyn Martell didn't do. He is bringing a fleet an army, and only his fleet knows how to sail anywhere around Westeros

Barristan will be around as well as Jorah and Tyrion. Dany will be at full strength when the make it to Westeros. After that, whateber happens would be anyones guess.

Victarion's arc is tied to his brother Euron. He will not die yet until that rivalry with hm is complete. Doesn't mean we will get a crazy 1 on 1, but the arc must become complete

While GRRM seems to have set up on the surface the notion that the Volantene fleet is out to attack Dany, he’s also subtly buried an upcoming slave revolt just under the radar, with the widow of the waterfront telling Tyrion, “Tell her we are waiting, tell her to come soon,” and other clues dropped, for example, like those in Tyrion’s cyvasse game with Qavo that the slave masters are the only ones complaining about Dany’s recent actions.

In Volantis, as we know, the slaves outnumber the freedmen five to one, and Dany sort of has a reputation for freeing slaves. So, in my case, I feel there’s as much reason to expect the Volantene slaves to revolt soon, and possibly even for the Volantene fleet to carry Dany to Westeros in a “surprise twist” – not the Iron fleet.

Thanks to the spoiler chapters, unfolding in Meereen we have the Yunkish outside of Meereen’s walls, to be followed shortly by the Iron Fleet showing up. However, Vic’s crew reportedly starts off in Barristan II by attacking the Yunkish instead of the Meereenese, possibly because they mean to, or possibly because they are simply the closest force to the water, and the Ironborn have no idea that they’re not fighting the Meerenese. I mean, doesn’t it seem that Victarion is out to take Dany back to Westeros by force if necessary, with quotes like “she would not be the first woman I made a widow”?

Further, we have an apparently untrustworthy Moqorro who’s seen Vic’s “future in the flames” (a possibly awesome double entendre in this case) and a dragonhorn that comes with no guarantee of what it will actually do.

So, speculatively, if the dragonhorn “backfires” on Vic, angering one or both of the nearby dragons instead of binding them, and all Vic’s ships go up in flames like so many candles on a cake, who’s going to take Dany to Westeros now?

If this happens, I think the casual reader’s reaction will be that Dany is doubly screwed now, because an even bigger, badder navy is on its way to sack the city.

And maybe it goes this way. Or maybe, if Victarion is fighting the Yunkish on purpose, after he “saves” Meereen the Volantene navy bears down and crushes him against the shore.

Either way, it seems the five-to-one slave-to-freedmen ratio could pay off in a surprise revolt that leaves all the slave master ship captains dead, but enough ships to transport Dany, the Unsullied, and the remaining supporting mercenaries to Westeros without involving Victarion at all.

But perhaps there is a reason to believe Victarion is necessary to the plot beyond simply dying in or near Meereen after all the effort to get there, while certainly seeming like Dany’s ostensible ride to Westeros throughout most of ADWD with all the focus on his ship count.

However, if the Volantene slave revolt hinted at throughout ADWD is a real thing, it seems to me that Vic may be one of the POVs that GRRM eliminates on his way to the finish line.

Further, Euron is also a significant obstacle for Asha, and seems she is intent on overthrowing the kingsmoot by presenting Theon. So perhaps the critical bits of Euron’s whereabouts, activities and endgame plot involvement can happen without much of Victarion’s remaining involvement, unless I’m missing something integral to his necessity to the overarching plot that absolutely must be addressed before he can die.

And, if so, perhaps there’s Victarion thread I’m not caught up on, and the discussion can be continued over there.

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While GRRM seems to have set up on the surface the notion that the Volantene fleet is out to attack Dany, he’s also subtly buried an upcoming slave revolt just under the radar, with the widow of the waterfront telling Tyrion, “Tell her we are waiting, tell her to come soon,” and other clues dropped, for example, like those in Tyrion’s cyvasse game with Qavo that the slave masters are the only ones complaining about Dany’s recent actions.

In Volantis, as we know, the slaves outnumber the freedmen five to one, and Dany sort of has a reputation for freeing slaves. So, in my case, I feel there’s as much reason to expect the Volantene slaves to revolt soon, and possibly even for the Volantene fleet to carry Dany to Westeros in a “surprise twist” – not the Iron fleet.

Thanks to the spoiler chapters, unfolding in Meereen we have the Yunkish outside of Meereen’s walls, to be followed shortly by the Iron Fleet showing up. However, Vic’s crew reportedly starts off in Barristan II by attacking the Yunkish instead of the Meereenese, possibly because they mean to, or possibly because they are simply the closest force to the water, and the Ironborn have no idea that they’re not fighting the Meerenese. I mean, doesn’t it seem that Victarion is out to take Dany back to Westeros by force if necessary, with quotes like “she would not be the first woman I made a widow”?

Further, we have an apparently untrustworthy Moqorro who’s seen Vic’s “future in the flames” (a possibly awesome double entendre in this case) and a dragonhorn that comes with no guarantee of what it will actually do.

So, speculatively, if the dragonhorn “backfires” on Vic, angering one or both of the nearby dragons instead of binding them, and all Vic’s ships go up in flames like so many candles on a cake, who’s going to take Dany to Westeros now?

If this happens, I think the casual reader’s reaction will be that Dany is doubly screwed now, because an even bigger, badder navy is on its way to sack the city.

And maybe it goes this way. Or maybe, if Victarion is fighting the Yunkish on purpose, after he “saves” Meereen the Volantene navy bears down and crushes him against the shore.

Either way, it seems the five-to-one slave-to-freedmen ratio could pay off in a surprise revolt that leaves all the slave master ship captains dead, but enough ships to transport Dany, the Unsullied, and the remaining supporting mercenaries to Westeros without involving Victarion at all.

But perhaps there is a reason to believe Victarion is necessary to the plot beyond simply dying in or near Meereen after all the effort to get there, while certainly seeming like Dany’s ostensible ride to Westeros throughout most of ADWD with all the focus on his ship count.

However, if the Volantene slave revolt hinted at throughout ADWD is a real thing, it seems to me that Vic may be one of the POVs that GRRM eliminates on his way to the finish line.

Further, Euron is also a significant obstacle for Asha, and seems she is intent on overthrowing the kingsmoot by presenting Theon. So perhaps the critical bits of Euron’s whereabouts, activities and endgame plot involvement can happen without much of Victarion’s remaining involvement, unless I’m missing something integral to his necessity to the overarching plot that absolutely must be addressed before he can die.

And, if so, perhaps there’s Victarion thread I’m not caught up on, and the discussion can be continued over there.

Good points.

For me, in Volantis, the thing I rememebered more than anything was that if the Volantis Fleet attacks Dany, then Volantis will burn. The Volantis fleet is laready headed for Slaver's Bay, so it would be safe to assume that this is going to be the cas,e especially with the inevitable slave revolt that will happen. (Dany might sweep through Volantis just like the Ghiscari cities). Further growing her "people" and army.

But I don't see the Volantis Fleet destroying the Iron Fleet, though I do believe this battle is just getting started with many twists and turns.

The biggest reason for me why Victarion will stay alive for the time being is that as we speak, Euron Greyjoy is getting ready to destroy the Reach. They have to deal with the Redwyne Fleet, but they already probably on their way to High Garden. Oldtown is nearby as well. Would the Tyrells preoccupied at Kings Landing and Storm's End, the Ironborn can have a field day.

Dany has to win The Reach in order to win the throne. Who better to give her intel on Euron Greyoy then Victarion? Who else better to even tell her what the Ironborn are doing then Victarion? Saving High Garden or saving Oldtown would do Dany wonders. Banners would flock to her. Now this is just speculation, she could just as easily make her way to Storm's End or King's Landing if Aegon the Fake has already made his way there.

I doubt the Volantis Fleet can beat the Ironborn led my Euron. Victarion may try to muscle Dany, but Dany is the one with the army and the Dragons. He may wise up and say, "Hey, I may not get the Dragon Queen, but I can be Lord of the Iron Islands, kill my brother and gain lands once she comes into the throne. " Mutual gain. And the fact that Jorah and Barristan will both be against it means that Dany will probably go for it.

The Iron Born will fight themseleves at some point. Damphair might be helping the Others and raising Krakens. Asha still wants the Iron Islands and will fight her uncle.

The Reason why I think Euron and Victarion are more tied together than Asha is because, in terms of Ironborn culture Euron is the Storm God, while Victarion is the Drowned God. (Many reasons why, but it would take too long to list now). Asha's storyline is more tied to her brother. Plus at the moment, she is in the middle of a snow storm, here team is decimated, she is injured, hundreds of miles from the sea and she is a prisoner. She wont be a factor in the politics of the Ironborn for some time, if at all. Her and Theon have an arc together.

Im not expecting a one on one final batte between Euron and Vicky, but Vicky IS probably the best Ship Commander left. A natural reaver. Imagine Dany landing of Westeros soil with Ironborn Reavers at her front(And she will do this). Moqorro is mysterious, but Vicky did save his life. I doubt he is just leading Vicky to his own demise, considering that he is willing to help bind the Dragons to him.

This is the biggets point. The Horn. Euron was planning on Vicky blowing the horn, dying and sending the Dragons straight to Euron. (Two birds, one stone). This has to be the reason, but it only works if Euron has already binded the horn to himself. But with Vicky binding himself as well, what will happen? With the dragons be split? one to euron? one to vicky? both to euron? both to vicky? neither? Its a curious thing. I do feel like the Dragons will be split though. Even if the horn is blown, it will fly to Euron, whch would given Vicky and Dany a common enemy, regardless if it was Vickys fault. he can even blame the 3 losers who blew the horn as the ones at fault.

It will also mobilize Dany for Westeros.

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For me, in Volantis, the thing I rememebered more than anything was that if the Volantis Fleet attacks Dany, then Volantis will burn. The Volantis fleet is laready headed for Slaver's Bay, so it would be safe to assume that this is going to be the cas,e especially with the inevitable slave revolt that will happen. (Dany might sweep through Volantis just like the Ghiscari cities). Further growing her "people" and army.

Fair enough. There are a lot of good ideas in your post, and I’m not claiming to know what’s going to happen, but rather to mention that the Volantene fleet is going to also matter somehow in TWOW. And it’s possible that – with all the buildup of how awesome the Ironborn/reavers are – that a “surprise loss” by the Ironborn could be in the cards.

I suppose one of my main concerns with the overarching story, though, is that GRRM is presently trying to fit 20 POVs into a single book, until we learn otherwise.

And in trying to hold with this goal, he needs to kill some characters, write others into obscurity, and/or pack more events into each chapter.

To that point, ASOS is 82 chapters, which probably doesn’t mean that each character will get 4 chapters (plus a prologue/epilogue). But if he holds to the goal of fitting all the POVs in one book, and attempting to spin compelling multi-chapter arcs, some POVs may have 8 or more chapters, where others may only have 1 or 2, and we already know of 11 or so chapters so far, representing only 8 of 20 POVs…

So while it’s entirely possible that everyone in and around Meereen lives, it also seems to me that nearly every POV has a reason for their “required” survival as well, or is simply a major character that “deserves” more chapters in GRRM’s mind than POVs he introduced in AFFC/ADWD.

OTOH, perhaps minor exceptions/minimized chapter counts could include Areo Hotah being offed by Darkstar in his only chapter, or Connington dying/being written into obscurity when Arianne shows up. Maybe Bran only has a couple chapters too because his presence is witnessed through other POVs (like Theon’s or Asha’s, and sooner rather than later). Similarly, Jon could be a “slow play” with his first chapter (possibly titled “Ghost” or “The White Wolf”) showing up very late in the book, as Jon’s “return” is clearly much anticipated by many, but he may not be required in GRRM's mind to "accomplish" a lot in TWOW.

Or maybe someone like Victarion or Barristan will be on the minimized chapter count list without necessarily dying, because characters like Dany and/or Tyrion are around to carry the narrative in their stead.

In any case, I’ve been on the “lookout” lately for foreshadowing that certain POVs might die, or ways that they can without making things like Dany’s return to Westeros “impossible.” I suppose that’s why my original position on Barristan was that he could be disposable, riding a pale mare into live battle and all, although since changed my mind for the moment. Meanwhile, Victarion could very well be sandwiched between the Yunkish/Meereenese (whoever has more forces after a few “rounds” of battle) and the Volantenes, and Dany has an “unanticipated” ride to Westeros.

Again, though, I’m not claiming to know what happens, but rather “prepare myself” for some potential upcoming deaths. I also know that I’m personally interested in reading a book that ends with fewer POVs than it starts with, and that mindset can impact how I might read between the lines that someone feels less necessary (IMO) than someone else.

ETA: Not much.

Edited by Slayer of Lies
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Fair enough. There are a lot of good ideas in your post, and I’m not claiming to know what’s going to happen, but rather to mention that the Volantene fleet is going to also matter somehow in TWOW. And it’s possible that – with all the buildup of how awesome the Ironborn/reavers are – that a “surprise loss” by the Ironborn could be in the cards.

I suppose one of my main concerns with the overarching story, though, is that GRRM is presently trying to fit 20 POVs into a single book, until we learn otherwise.

And in trying to hold with this goal, he needs to kill some characters, write others into obscurity, and/or pack more events into each chapter.

To that point, ASOS is 82 chapters, which probably doesn’t mean that each character will get 4 chapters (plus a prologue/epilogue). But if he holds to the goal of fitting all the POVs in one book, and attempting to spin compelling multi-chapter arcs, some POVs may have 8 or more chapters, where others may only have 1 or 2, and we already know of 11 or so chapters so far, representing only 8 of 20 POVs…

So while it’s entirely possible that everyone in and around Meereen lives, it also seems to me that nearly every POV has a reason for their “required” survival as well, or is simply a major character that “deserves” more chapters in GRRM’s mind than POVs he introduced in AFFC/ADWD.

OTOH, perhaps minor exceptions/minimized chapter counts could include Areo Hotah being offed by Darkstar in his only chapter, or Connington dying/being written into obscurity when Arianne shows up. Maybe Bran only has a couple chapters too because his presence is witnessed through other POVs (like Theon’s or Asha’s, and sooner rather than later). Similarly, Jon could be a “slow play” with his first chapter (possibly titled “Ghost” or “The White Wolf”) showing up very late in the book, as Jon’s “return” is clearly much anticipated by many, but he may not be required in GRRM's mind to "accomplish" a lot in TWOW.

Or maybe someone like Victarion or Barristan will be on the minimized chapter count list without necessarily dying, because characters like Dany and/or Tyrion are around to carry the narrative in their stead.

In any case, I’ve been on the “lookout” lately for foreshadowing that certain POVs might die, or ways that they can without making things like Dany’s return to Westeros “impossible.” I suppose that’s why my original position on Barristan was that he could be disposable, riding a pale mare into live battle and all, although since changed my mind for the moment. Meanwhile, Victarion could very well be sandwiched between the Yunkish/Meereenese (whoever has more forces after a few “rounds” of battle) and the Volantenes, and Dany has an “unanticipated” ride to Westeros.

Again, though, I’m not claiming to know what happens, but rather “prepare myself” for some potential upcoming deaths. I also know that I’m personally interested in reading a book that ends with fewer POVs than it starts with, and that mindset can impact how I might read between the lines that someone feels less necessary (IMO) than someone else.

ETA: Not much.

I also am interested in reading a book that ends with fewer POVs then when it starts :)

I agree with everything you said and I dont know what will happen either.

I figure, especially in the beginning that certain POVs will just be minimized and then ultimately forgotten. Liek once Dany returns, there is no point for Barristan to have a POV anymore. At the moment we have 4 Greyjoy POVs. Some have to go. I dont see Damphair having too many. I see him trying to "wake" something to get Euron, only for it to back fire and for him to get himself killed and create an even bigger problem for Westeros(Uneashing an undead kraken, getting help from the others, etc).

With Theon and Asha in the same place now for the forseeable future, I don't see the need for Asha POVs anymore, unless Theon dies soon. Either way we will be down a POV.

I think Areo Hotah is finished as a POV now. Arianne Martell is now the "Eyes of Dorne" and Doran is dying, more or less.

Brienne and Jaime will be together for the forseeable future, in which case I feel like Jaime will get the bulk of the POVs and Brienne's would be minimized, if she has any at all.

The cool thing is, is that groups of characters(And POVs) are starting to come together.

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I also am interested in reading a book that ends with fewer POVs then when it starts :)

I agree with everything you said and I dont know what will happen either.

I figure, especially in the beginning that certain POVs will just be minimized and then ultimately forgotten. Liek once Dany returns, there is no point for Barristan to have a POV anymore. At the moment we have 4 Greyjoy POVs. Some have to go. I dont see Damphair having too many. I see him trying to "wake" something to get Euron, only for it to back fire and for him to get himself killed and create an even bigger problem for Westeros(Uneashing an undead kraken, getting help from the others, etc).

With Theon and Asha in the same place now for the forseeable future, I don't see the need for Asha POVs anymore, unless Theon dies soon. Either way we will be down a POV.

I think Areo Hotah is finished as a POV now. Arianne Martell is now the "Eyes of Dorne" and Doran is dying, more or less.

Brienne and Jaime will be together for the forseeable future, in which case I feel like Jaime will get the bulk of the POVs and Brienne's would be minimized, if she has any at all.

The cool thing is, is that groups of characters(And POVs) are starting to come together.

This is all quite possible however:

As Arianne is "Eyes of Dorne" in Stormlands and possibly even in KL, thus Areoh migh be needed as our Eyes in the Dorne - for how long thats another matter...

Theon and Asha - they are at the same point now - but this does not mean they can not split into different directions - being at the same point for a while does not automatically mean death to one of the PoVs - after all - in GoT we had several PoVs at the same location for almost entire book ( in KL - Edd, Sansa, Arya, briefly Joined by Cat; not to mention that almost all Povs exept Danny gathered in Winterfell in the beginning of Got)

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I also am interested in reading a book that ends with fewer POVs then when it starts :)

I agree with everything you said and I dont know what will happen either.

I figure, especially in the beginning that certain POVs will just be minimized and then ultimately forgotten. Liek once Dany returns, there is no point for Barristan to have a POV anymore. At the moment we have 4 Greyjoy POVs. Some have to go. I dont see Damphair having too many. I see him trying to "wake" something to get Euron, only for it to back fire and for him to get himself killed and create an even bigger problem for Westeros(Uneashing an undead kraken, getting help from the others, etc).

With Theon and Asha in the same place now for the forseeable future, I don't see the need for Asha POVs anymore, unless Theon dies soon. Either way we will be down a POV.

I think Areo Hotah is finished as a POV now. Arianne Martell is now the "Eyes of Dorne" and Doran is dying, more or less.

Brienne and Jaime will be together for the forseeable future, in which case I feel like Jaime will get the bulk of the POVs and Brienne's would be minimized, if she has any at all.

The cool thing is, is that groups of characters(And POVs) are starting to come together.

Once again, I’m with you on the majority of your ideas! See below for more...

This is all quite possible however:

As Arianne is "Eyes of Dorne" in Stormlands and possibly even in KL, thus Areoh migh be needed as our Eyes in the Dorne - for how long thats another matter...

Theon and Asha - they are at the same point now - but this does not mean they can not split into different directions - being at the same point for a while does not automatically mean death to one of the PoVs - after all - in GoT we had several PoVs at the same location for almost entire book ( in KL - Edd, Sansa, Arya, briefly Joined by Cat; not to mention that almost all Povs exept Danny gathered in Winterfell in the beginning of Got)

The couple notes I would add to both of your posts are that – if Lemore is Ashara – then Barristan can go off-page for a while after the battle of Meereen, and after reuniting with Dany, etc., but might have some interesting play later as the POV that reveals Lemore/Ashara through his thoughts, or provides a public reveal, and/or betrays Dany for Aegon as the Treason for Love, etc. But I agree that he does not need a ton of POVs beyond the battle of Meereen given what we know at present.

As for WF, I also like the potential for interchange between Asha and Theon POVs, and hope for a balance of the two in the telling of the battle of ice, the heart tree on the isle, WF, and possibly beyond. If they stay together, as the “Torgon’s kingsmoot precedent” indicates they should, then they can possibly continue “trading off” chapters to keep things interesting. But who knows if GRRM will “allow” them to remain together for long, noting that he doesn’t often lay plans in the text and then follow through with them as stated in dialogue? Not to mention that overruling the kingsmoot is what the reader wants, and therefore not likely what GRRM will give them (at least anytime soon).

As for Brienne and Jaime, I’m not sure what to think of that pairing… Because Jaime has turned from being the most hated guy in the land to a character we can relate with and have started to like, it seems a “cathartic” death may be in is his future. Meanwhile, in Brienne’s “happiest” possible ending (assuming she’s Dunk’s ancestor), being elevated to LC of the KG would be a great “epilogue” for her. But it’s unclear to me at the moment what GRRM plans in the short or long game for either of these two…

Meanwhile, the only suggestion I “disagree” with is Areo's POVs being done already, or being the "eyes of Dorne," at least for long...

Even though when ADWD ends it seems like Areo is accompanying Arianne and not Obara (he thinks: We may depart by midday after hearing of Doran’s plans for Arianne to meet up with fAegon), the TWOW Arianne sample chapter indicates he’s with Obara.

From Arianne I, not spoiler-tagged due to the fact that we’re in a Barristan spoiler thread:

"Be careful what you pray for, princess," he replied. "Darkstar could put an end to Lady Obara just as easily."

She has Areo Hotah with her.” Prince Doran's captain of guards had dispatched Ser Arys Oakheart with a single blow, though the Kingsguard were supposed to be the finest knights in all the realm. "No man can stand against Hotah."

Hence my “suggestion” that – despite the “hype” and the singular display of Hotah’s fighting prowess in dispatching Arys – having Darkstar take Hotah out of the game does two things: It provides an expositive window into Balon Swann, Obara Sand and the hunt for Darkstar, and it also may very well provide the reader with an “oh shit” moment at the end of Areo’s final chapter when “No man can stand against Hotah” is proven wrong.

So I don't this he's done, and he may start in Dorne, but he might already be afield when we get to his chapter, given the Arianne chapter making mention of his whereabouts.

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I think I've said this before, but the POV characters are not there to WATCH the story, they ARE the story. Alternatively, wherever a POV goes, the journey is important, not the destination. For example, Victorian's journey to Slaver's Bay didn't need him as a POV. A few lines about the Iron Fleet being spotted in the Stepstones or something followed by the surprise when in Winds of Winter they show up for the Battle for Meereen would still have been effective story telling. Yet, those were some interesting chapters.


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Wasn't Volantis the Free City that tried to reestablish the Valyrian dynasties after the Doom? I think it would be interesting if the Volantene slave revolt didn't go exactly as the readers expect it to. The Volantene leadership could be receptive to Dany when she shows up, since she's obviously blessed with very authentic Valyryian blood. If she explains to them what happened in Yunkai, Astapor and Mereen and insists their slaves be let go, will the leaders display any pragmatism and end their slavery? I know all through Dance the difficulty of upending a slavery based economy is made apparent, but it'd be surprising if Volantis chose to free its slaves instead of being burnt down by Dany.


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Probably not going to happen. The elites have a stranglehold on power and they're not going to give it up. They already are trying to mount an offense against Dany so her Valyrian bloodline means nothing to them. I doubt the slaves (4/5 of the population) are going to be forgiving to the people who enslaved them - no Nelson Mandelas in that bunch. I expect there to be a revolt and a bloody one at that.


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Probably not going to happen. The elites have a stranglehold on power and they're not going to give it up. They already are trying to mount an offense against Dany so her Valyrian bloodline means nothing to them. I doubt the slaves (4/5 of the population) are going to be forgiving to the people who enslaved them - no Nelson Mandelas in that bunch. I expect there to be a revolt and a bloody one at that.

exactly. It was already predicted that if they took up arms against Dany that the city will bleed/burn. So yea, Volantis is finished. And personally, I expect Dany or members of her team to turn North and take out Pentos as well.

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Not Pentos! At least not if she can help it. Didn't she say as much to the tattered prince? Illyrio is from Pentos and she did not want to betray him, IIRC.

Yes, but she has not met Tyrion yet, thus has not been told about Ilyrio's true intentions all along. How much loyalty will she feel to Ilyrio when she learns he had Aegon in his pocket the whole time and did not expect her to survive in the Dothraki sea?

Edited by aryagonnakill#2
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Yes, but she has not met Tyrion yet, thus has not been told about Ilyrio's true intentions all along. How much loyalty will she feel to Ilyrio when she learns he had Aegon in his pocket the whole time and did not expect her to survive in the Dothraki sea?

Yes, this is true - if she believes Tyrion, who Quaithe warned against. Plus Pentos is a free city (Illyrio excepted) so the whole slave freeing motive is gone.

Of course Barristan seems to have promised Tatters Pentos, so it remains to be seen whether Dany will honor this commitment if she has the opportunity. IMO I would like to see her go to Westeros immediately after Volantis (or even sooner).

Edited by mushroomshirt
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Yes, this is true - if she believes Tyrion, who Quaithe warned against. Plus Pentos is a free city (Illyrio excepted) so the whole slave freeing motive is gone.

Of course Barristan seems to have promised Tatters Pentos, so it remains to be seen whether Dany will honor this commitment if she has the opportunity. IMO I would like to see her go to Westeros immediately after Volantis (or even sooner).

Well, I'm not convinced Dany will ever go back to Mereen, but she would be able to confirm the Aegon part of Tyrions story easily enough while in Volantis. Since so many Volanteene ships were used to ferry the Golden Company across the narrow sea and since Aegon is seemingly conquering the Stormlands very fast. We also do not know the whole story behind the Tattered Prince, he may be able to shed some light on Ilyrio, and maybe even Varys pasts. Ilyrio tells Tyrion how when something bad happens to Pentos they blame the prince and replace him, and in one of Quentyns chapters we hear the the Tattered prince was about to be made the prince of Pentos but that instead he fled the city. Could be a story here, could be he didn't want to be blamed for a crop shortage, either way I suspect we will find out.

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Well, I'm not convinced Dany will ever go back to Mereen, but she would be able to confirm the Aegon part of Tyrions story easily enough while in Volantis. Since so many Volanteene ships were used to ferry the Golden Company across the narrow sea and since Aegon is seemingly conquering the Stormlands very fast. We also do not know the whole story behind the Tattered Prince, he may be able to shed some light on Ilyrio, and maybe even Varys pasts. Ilyrio tells Tyrion how when something bad happens to Pentos they blame the prince and replace him, and in one of Quentyns chapters we hear the the Tattered prince was about to be made the prince of Pentos but that instead he fled the city. Could be a story here, could be he didn't want to be blamed for a crop shortage, either way I suspect we will find out.

Anyone who has slaves or has threatened Dany in the past will Burn:

Qarth: Taken up arms against her, have slaves - They will burn

Volantis - Taken up arms against her, have slaves, they will burn

Slavers Bay - had slaves, destroyed

Pentos - Have slaves, Illyrio tricked her, Tattered Prince wants it. They will burn

Also Dany can potentially get a large Khalasar behind her. If she wanted to she could take Norvos, Qohor and the Disputed Lands(Myr, Tyrosh, Lars)

Essos is nowheerenear done bleeding yet. Fire and Blood bitches

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Yes, this is true - if she believes Tyrion, who Quaithe warned against. Plus Pentos is a free city (Illyrio excepted) so the whole slave freeing motive is gone.

Of course Barristan seems to have promised Tatters Pentos, so it remains to be seen whether Dany will honor this commitment if she has the opportunity. IMO I would like to see her go to Westeros immediately after Volantis (or even sooner).

I still think the lion Quaithe warned her against is Gerion Lannister who is Tyrions favorite uncle and has been missing in Essos for 15 years.

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The Volantis slave revolt could happen after the Volantene Fleet have already been sent out, since a large portion of their military strength would be away. If I was planning a slave revolt, I would wait till the great Volantene Fleet was a couple weeks away first. So, perhaps the Volantene fleet will arrive at Mereen as an enemy of Dany, but when she shows up to sack Volantis the slaves will just open the doors for her.



When the cat is away the mice will play.


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Essos is nowheerenear done bleeding yet. Fire and Blood bitches


Pretty much. If I lived anywhere on the eastern continent I'd be packing my bags for Braavos. Just about everywhere else is hosed.


I still think the lion Quaithe warned her against is Gerion Lannister who is Tyrions favorite uncle and has been missing in Essos for 15 years.


Now there's an interesting thought.

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