Series biggest hypocrites and parasites

[Joyful Union]

No. I think that Cat is a hypocrite because when she claims that she hates Jon because he was born after Ned's affair, she never shows any resentment to Ned. When she claims that she loves her children more than anything (I do believe that she loves them and the way she stopped Bran's assasins prove it) but she abandon them to play CSI Westeros.

As for the Unsullied, when a *society* produce nothing and olny obey and serve by fighting for me are perasites.

Thats still not really hypocrisy. Also, those two reasons alone would definitely not make her the biggest hypocrite in Westeros, by any measure, when you have candidates like Stannis, Tywin and Daenarys.

The Unsullied arent a society, there a group of men that have been horrifically exploited. A parasite is someone who takes without giving back, and the Unsullied take very little, and give Daenarys back a great deal.

[Joyful Union]

I don't make a habit of quoting myself, but...

I think Cat's hypocrisy is a big part of what makes her such a deeply rounded character. If she hadn't been so rash and pursued her own interests above all else, the books would be boring as crap. It's kind of what makes her awesome.

You make good points, I agree that she definitely is hypocritical at times, but she's still far from being one of the most hypocritical characters in the books, when you look at Tywin, Stannis, Daenarys etc. I was directing my argument towards Jon, who gave no evidence for why she was hypocritical.

[The Frosted King]

Hypocrite? Cersei first of her name Baratheon.Seats two shits on a throne they have no right to, and then expects thousands to die to uphold her tawny haired bastards. Then fabricates evidence to send an innocent girl to the block to protect power she has no right to at all.

If Dany is the Mother of dragons, then Cersei is the mother of lies, treasons, falsehoods and sorrows.

Parasite? LF easily. His skill with money strikes me as something taught by Bernie Madoff. And nobody can tell where it leads back to cold hard coin. Suspect in everything that he does.

[Silverin]

Hypocrire:

Let me add Tyrion there as well.

1. Tyrion loves mocking people, and saying funny rude comment about people. When others mock him? Well he hates it.

2. He is enraged that tywin doesn't want to give him his rightful inheritence, CR. But tyrion for two whole book did everything for helping his family taking away others rightful inheritence, KL and the Throne from Stannis, Riverrun from the Tully's and by marrying Sansa he tried to take WF from the Starks.

3. Complaining that people believe he killed Joffrey, despie that when he was the Hand of the King he ordered the execution of the Antler Men based on one single persons word, namely Varys, who gave information at his trial as well, that were very damaging towards his case. tyrion actually had multiple witnesses, he had a chance to call for a trial by combat, and he had a chance of taking the black. And even if he would have been executed he would have a clean beheading. He on the other hand didn't gave any of that chance to the Antler Men, not to mention he gave them to Joffrey, knowing they will be gruesomly killed. Oh, and the Antler Men were actually innocents, they weren't Stannis spies. They had large debts toward the Throne which after their death cannot be collected. They were set up by Varys, to further bankrupt the Throne. Comparaed to them there were way more and convincing evidence (even if it was fake) that tyrion indeed killed Joffrey.

I feel sorry for tyrion that he was wrongly accused, but on the other hand he really should have reflected about his past actions, that the justice he gave to people was actually even more unfair that he recieved there.

4. Another one is he asking Sansa that she should look past his appearance and see what is inside (though I donT' think his inside is attractive either), yet he mocks women who are not hot (see his remarks about Lollys), and he cannot love a women who is ugly. So he wants women to love him for the inside, yet he is soo shallow he is unable to love an ugly woman.

(And just saying that Sansa on the other hand has a crushlike feeling towards Sandor and she was willing to marry Willas even if he would have looked like his fat and ugly father. So not even Sansa is as shallow as tyrion.)

[Hangover of the Morning]


The Unsullied arent a society, there a group of men that have been horrifically exploited. A parasite is someone who takes without giving back, and the Unsullied take very little, and give Daenarys back a great deal.


Absolutely agree. Slaves are the complete opposite of parasites. They are the ones exploited in a parasitic fashion by their masters/slavers.

Hypocrites: Every character in the book like everybody in real life is a little bit of a hypocrite.

Maester Pycelle definitely fits the description of “preaching water but drinking wine”. KGs who consider themselves knightly and honorable yet do not intervene when their king is raping or butchering innocent are massive hypocrites. I don’t condemn them for not acting (a sure death sentence) but for thinking that they are morally superior to those who break an oath in an attempt to stop the king and safe the innocents.

Danny and Stannis often act like hypocrites, though Danny’s “I conquer you all cause I am the rightful Queen of Everything” attitude probably comes more from misguided beliefs.

I think Cersei is more self-centered and egoistic than a full-blown hypocrite but I have only read the first three books (and only once) so I might be missing a great deal. Tywin considers his family to be superior to everybody else and does not mind exterminating others on his way to achieve eternal glory for House Lannister but again I don't see how it makes him a hypocrite. He does not paint himself as a paragon of morality and he doesn’t hide some of his worst atrocities (Targaryen kids, Reyenes of Castamere). I also don't think that his views on Tyrion’s whoring are hypocritical. He does not mind his son visiting brothels and be open about it, he just does not want him to bring the whores back home and marry them or parade them in front of others. I am sure that most other noble lords feel the same way about their offspring. Tywin is a horrible, calculating, unforgiving and ruthless person who treats Tyrion like shit but I don’t see him as a hypocrite.

Parasites: Littlefinger and Joffrey though each in a different way. Littlefinger has to work really hard at his "parasitism": learn skills, charm and befriend the right people, scheme, plot, wager, do long-term risky investments, shag unattractive women etc. Joff on the other hand is a spoiled brat who was born with a silver spoon in his mouth and never had to earn anything. He is a completely useless monarch who does nothing for his subjects but demands from them absolute obedience, to fight and die for him and to pay taxes to support his lavish lifestyle.

As someone mentioned Iron Islanders and, to a degree, the Dothraki and raiding Wildlings are parasitic cultures.

Not sure how Ser Jorah could be considered a parasite. He works for Danny: protects her, gives her counsel and fights for her and she probably does not even pay him.

[Sullen]

Parasite = Theon Greyjoy. Really what has Theon ever done but live off the good will of others? As for Littlefinger the man may lie, cheat, and steal his way to prominence but he has at least done this on his own.

Living off the goodwill of others? He was a hostage for crying out loud!

[Ame]

Hypoctite- So many, Cersei claims power based on the idea that she is great despite being a woman and deserves to play the game being a Lannister but when in power spends it framing women for adultery and setting a Westerosi Dr. Mangela on countless other women; she even has sex with a woman in order to feel what being dominant feels like. Tywin may have been questioning Shae but even if he was bedding her 1 slip up doesn't make him compete with the others. Dany demands her birthright in Westeros while being an Usurper in Essos, Jaime I love him but he isn't exactly father of the year and makes sweeping judgements about childcare despite the fact that Tommen acts exactly the way Cersei wants is trying to redeem himself while also trying to expand Lannister power often illegally, Lady Stoneheart (not including living Cat) executes the innocent to help avenge the RW is avenging a breach of custom with breaches of custom the way she hangs Freys who come to deliver ransom, Tyrion hits Shae and takes all of her gifts back and keeps her isolated and thinks he loves her. Joffrey demands traitors die when betraying the High Sparrow in the Great Sept by executing Ned there contrary to the agreement to send him to the wall.

Parasite- I would say a tie between Petyr Baelish for reasons stated, Theon Greyjoy for reasons stated; his taking Winterfell doesn't help his people and was according to the Ironborn plan just stupid and Ramsay for obvious reasons. Joffrey, too obvious to say why.

[Draco_Dracul]

Parasite: Littlefinger, he's the most capable of parasites because he avoids killing his host until he has nothing left to take from them.

Hypocrite: Cersei

[Hangover of the Morning]

Parasite- I would say a tie between Petyr Baelish for reasons stated, Theon Greyjoy for reasons stated; his taking Winterfell doesn't help his people and was according to the Ironborn plan just stupid and Ramsay for obvious reasons. Joffrey, too obvious to say why.

How is Theon a parasite? He is the hostage of Starks so of course he eats their food and sleeps in their beds but given the choice, I am sure he'd rather go home and live with his own family. Turning on Starks makes him a scum and a backstabber but not really a parasite.

[Theda Baratheon]

Hypocrite - Dany, Cersei

Parasite - LF, feeding off of chaos

[Ame]

How is Theon a parasite? He is the hostage of Starks so of course he eats their food and sleeps in their beds but given the choice, I am sure he'd rather go home and live with his own family. Turning on Starks makes him a scum and a backstabber but not really a parasite.

He got his chance despite acting stupidly in Pyke and actively questioning his father's judgement then went ahead and did the stupidest thing he could think of. The Bastard of Bolton alone had the ability to retake Winterfell, he takes his mens lives and throws them away while giving nothing in return. It might go better under hypocrite because of how much he demands of others while doing all of the dumbest ideas that come into his brain I could just edit it to make him another hypocrite.

[Éadaoin]

Hypocrite - Dany, Cersei

Parasite - LF, feeding off of chaos

Yes.

My first thought for hypocrite was Dany, and Littlefinger was my first choice for parasite.

[Hangover of the Morning]

He got his chance despite acting stupidly in Pyke and actively questioning his father's judgement then went ahead and did the stupidest thing he could think of. The Bastard of Bolton alone had the ability to retake Winterfell, he takes his mens lives and throws them away while giving nothing in return. It might go better under hypocrite because of how much he demands of others while doing all of the dumbest ideas that come into his brain I could just edit it to make him another hypocrite.

By that definition every lord who takes his men into battle and looses is a parasite/hypocrite. My memories of ACoK are hazy (I remember the TV show more) but I thought that his crewmen went with him to Winterfell quite willingly. Don't they say something like "Ironborn do what they want and not what they are told to".

[Ame]

By that definition every lord who takes his men into battle and looses is a parasite/hypocrite. My memories of ACoK are hazy (I remember the TV show more) but I thought that his crewmen went with him to Winterfell quite willingly. Don't they say something like "Ironborn do what they want and not what they are told to".

As their leader it was his responsibility to come up with manageable goals and persuade them to follow it. He decides to crown himself Prince of Winterfell as if it makes it so; the result is the destruction of himself and others.

[Hangover of the Morning]

As their leader it was his responsibility to come up with manageable goals and persuade them to follow it. He decides to crown himself Prince of Winterfell as if it makes it so; the result is the destruction of himself and others.

Failing at leadership is not exactly parasitisms but I do not mean to argue. And Theon came up with a manageable goal (capture Winterfell) and his men followed him willingly. He believed that Balon will send him reinforcement once he'll capture the castle, which was a stupid mistake, because he didn't realise that Winterfell had no strategic value for the Ironmen. Makes him inexperienced, reckless, stupid and many other things but he is not deliberately exploiting others for his sole personal gain. I am sure he planned to reward his men if he didn't loose.

You can argue that every lord is a bit of a parasite because they do live off their subjects and give less back than what they take. But that is just the nature of the feudal system.

[pamparius]

I agree wholeheartedly with you. Cersei is far and away the biggest hypocrite. She ignores Ned's pleas for her to run and save herself and her children. Instead she starts a war,

Pretty sure the blame for starting the war falls squarely on Joffrey's shoulders.

See I never said Robert wouldn't have hunted her down and killed her, I never even implied she would have safely survived. What I said was that running was the RIGHT thing for her to do, seeing as how she actually WAS guilty. You're talking like she's a victim and she clearly isn't. She made knowing choices to have children with Jamie instead of Robert, she knew this day would come, or at least should have forseen that it might. I understand her doing anything possible to save the lives of her children but saving them at the expense of thousands of other peoples children makes her a hypocrite.

You nailed it here, though.

[ladyofslytherin]

Biggest parasite: tough call. Imma go against the grain here and say it's not Littlefinger, but Cersei. She's sucking the lifeblood out of the kingdom with her machinations, schemes, paranoia, hubris and total disregard for anything and anyone that runs counter to her own mercurial designs. She's like an infestation of fleas: one or two are irritating and itchy and bothersome, but you get enough of them latching on with no relief and it eventually kills the animal they've attached themselves to.

Second place here would be Melisandre: she's feeding off of the blind devotion of Selyse and the others she's converted to R'hllor, she actively tries to cultivate that same devotion and loyalty in Stannis and Jon and anyone else she can sink her hooks into, and I'm not convinced that her ultimate agenda is what she's playing it up to be. Something's not right about her, and while she bides her time before making her move, she's a psychic vampire that feeds on everyone she can get to hop on the Red Rahloo bandwagon.

Biggest hypocrite: Stannis gorram Baratheon. I don't care how many people shout me down: I still maintain that right of conquest is horsesh*t in the case of the Baratheons taking the throne from the Targaryens. It only means something if-

a) the conqueror wipes out every last scion of the government that existed before they came swooping in. I.e., if Robert really had done for the Targaryens like Tywin did to the Reynes & the Tarbecks; or

B) if the conquered government willingly capitulates & signs peace accords ceding lawful authority to the conquerors.

A combination of these happened when the Targaryens came in & conquered Westeros, and that's why their reign went unchallenged for so long. Neither of these happened after Robert's Rebellion, which means that, by law, the Targaryens are still the rightful rulers of Westeros and the Baratheons, or any other claimants for that matter, are emphatically not.

Stannis has made a huge deal about the fact that the law is the law, right is right & wrong is wrong. Good doesn't wipe out bad & vice versa. That's the rationale for why he took the ends of Davos' fingers and why he's intending to put Theon to death, among other things. He hated his brother but was duty-bound to follow him because Robert was the eldest and head of House Baratheon and that's just how Westerosi society works. It doesn't follow that he believed what his brother was doing in trying to wipe out the Targaryen line was right. He might've believed that Aerys was crazier than a sack of rats in a burning meth lab and needed to be removed from power, but I can't believe he felt the same way about Rhaegar. Even a colossal tighta$$ like Stannis had to have recognized that Rhaegar would've made an ideal ruler to bind up the wounds Aerys was carving into the Seven Kingdoms.

Even if Stannis believed that Rhaegar raped Lyanna, that necessitates a trial under Westerosi law, not summary execution. And even if you believe Rhaegar & Robert's duel on the Trident was essentially a trial by combat that proved Rhaegar "guilty" because he lost, that doesn't vitiate the legitimacy of Viserys, Danerys, Rhaenys or Aegon as the legal order of succession, with someone acting as regent until one of the Targ children was old enough to take over. I'm not counting Jon Snow here, since Stannis doesn't know that R+L=J yet.

All Stannis can talk about is the fact that he's allegedly the rightful heir to the IT, since he's Robert's heir in the absence of trueborn sons. He totally ignores the fact that if he followed the actual law, he should be backing the Targaryen horses in this race. His brains are in his scabbard on this one, though, so he's purposely and willfully ignoring that fact, instead following the law of "My brother killed the guy that ran off with his g-f and became king. His wife is a skanky ho that decided she only wanted to have her brother's babies b/c who cares if they have webbed feet and are bat-shit insane @ least they'll have pretty blonde hair like the kids that actually have a right to the throne when they grow up which is why my brother tried to have them killed but that'll be okay b/c everybody's used to having blonde crazy rulers so nobody'll really notice. Except me because I'm totally jealous of everything my brothers have that I don't and am completely mired in Middle Child Syndrome, so Imma totally point it out because my stupid big brother that I never really gave two sh*ts about got gored to death and if his kids are really all dirty incest babies then I get to be king, YAY!"

He even went so far as to arrange the assassination of his younger brother over it, in violation of all laws and customs against murder and kinslaying, to try and clear a path to a throne he knows isn't really his. Why do you think he's shouting it from the rooftops that he's the true heir to the IT? Because he thinks people might forget? Why's that? Oh, maybe because there's a Targaryen or two out there WHO ARE THE ACTUAL HEIRS TO THE IRON THRONE. You can be as tightly wound as you like; there's not much getting around that one.

On top of all of that, he's actually starting to believe his own hype about his sword actually being anything other than a blade that makes pretty light displays and him being AA reborn.

So yeah: Stannis wins Biggest Hypocrite Ever award. Also Biggest Tighta$$ and Most Likely To Grind His Teeth to Nubs.

:ph34r: *hides from Stannis superfans*

[Kolantero]

a) the conqueror wipes out every last scion of the government that existed before they came swooping in. I.e., if Robert really had done for the Targaryens like Tywin did to the Reynes & the Tarbecks; or

Umm according to who and by what logic? I'm pretty sure killing every known Targaryen except two children who are exiled counts as conquest.

[Ame]

Failing at leadership is not exactly parasitisms but I do not mean to argue. And Theon came up with a manageable goal (capture Winterfell) and his men followed him willingly. He believed that Balon will send him reinforcement once he'll capture the castle, which was a stupid mistake, because he didn't realise that Winterfell had no strategic value for the Ironmen. Makes him inexperienced, reckless, stupid and many other things but he is not deliberately exploiting others for his sole personal gain. I am sure he planned to reward his men if he didn't loose.

You can argue that every lord is a bit of a parasite because they do live off their subjects and give less back than what they take. But that is just the nature of the feudal system.

Well arguably the feudal lord supposedly provides protection, law, and justice; and if they are just too full of themselves to do it they could be considered parasites.

By the way great exposition on Stannis; of course Robert tried to deal with Dany and Viserys; and they really do make Stannis at least somewhat hypocritical because being Robert's heir and heir to the throne are different.

[Northern light]

He did his job as a finance minister well.

Hmmm. Do we have any proof of that? Considering the debt the crown has I'm skeptical.