[ADWD Spoilers] Jon 1

[Bad Hound!]

2 things:

1. In Jon's first chapter, he starts out with a dream (warging Ghost) and he can "see" his black brother on the other side of the wall (that would be Summer, Bran's direwolf), and his sister in a warmer land, with 100 little grey cousins (that would be Arya's direwolf in the Riverlands I guess). It says he lost contact with another (assume it's Robb's wolf Grey Wind). There doesn't seem to be a mention of Rickon's wolf Shaggydog as far as I can tell.

Is it just me or is this the first time we are told that the direwolves can "see" each other? I mean, Ghost knows that it is raining on Summer, and that Nymeria can hear her 100 little grey cousins.

2. Right, all this talk of R + L = J is driving me mad.

Jon has a direwolf, same as the other Stark kids. To me, that makes him a Stark. Why would he have a direwolf if he was Rhaegar's bastard son? I must be missing something. I know he has a "different" direwolf (I think the 5 direwolves given to the trueborn Stark kids were together with their dead mother, whereas Ghost was found a little bit further down) but still, there was a direwolf for him, and isn't that a sign that he is one of the Starks?

Answers welcome!! Thank you

[The Dire Wolf]

I thought it was strange that he could sense all but one. I assumed the one was Lady....and thought maybe we were wrong about Grey Wind really being killed...

[The Ghost and the Hound]

2 things:

1. In Jon's first chapter, he starts out with a dream (warging Ghost) and he can "see" his black brother on the other side of the wall (that would be Summer, Bran's direwolf), and his sister in a warmer land, with 100 little grey cousins (that would be Arya's direwolf in the Riverlands I guess). It says he lost contact with another (assume it's Robb's wolf Grey Wind). There doesn't seem to be a mention of Rickon's wolf Shaggydog as far as I can tell.

Is it just me or is this the first time we are told that the direwolves can "see" each other? I mean, Ghost knows that it is raining on Summer, and that Nymeria can hear her 100 little grey cousins.

2. Right, all this talk of R + L = J is driving me mad.

Jon has a direwolf, same as the other Stark kids. To me, that makes him a Stark. Why would he have a direwolf if he was Rhaegar's bastard son? I must be missing something. I know he has a "different" direwolf (I think the 5 direwolves given to the trueborn Stark kids were together with their dead mother, whereas Ghost was found a little bit further down) but still, there was a direwolf for him, and isn't that a sign that he is one of the Starks?

Answers welcome!! Thank you

Lyanna was a Stark. And if the Gods placed the direwolves before them at the beginning of GOT, then they must've known Snow is of the blood. It's also possible that Jon is the offspring of Ned + Ashara Dayne, or even Wylla as some would suggest, but the R+L remains the strongest case as of yet.

Where in the book are you now?

[Bad Hound!]

I'm re-reading, and just at Tyrion 2 right now

[evita mgfs]

I am in ther middle of a reread of AGoT focusing on the direwolves, which includes the "Starks" since they are "wolves". Anyways, we have been analyzing at great length the development of the relationships between each Stark and his/her wolf. As of yet, we have no direct evidence of warging in AGoT around chapter 38 or so. But the children are mirroring their wolves and vice versa, the wolves are protective of the Starks, Summer has the power to make Bran stronger while he is in a coma, Robb grows stronger physically with Grey Wind at his side, and the wolves and Starks are projecting their emotions one each other; lastly, the wolves "sense" things - like "dark wings; dark words", death, danger, etc.

I am wondering as my reread progresses if each direwolf links up with some special "power" or "boon" for each Stark. It seems that Grey Wind is a fearsome warrior and battlestrategist; Summer is spiritual healer and protector - the one closely linked to the CotF; but Ghost IS the weirwoods - he IS Bloodraven, a mirror image of white and red. I am postulating that Ghost may have a special link to the forces that are the old gods, and this link will allow him to communicate with his brother Bran, maybe even share Bran's visits through the faces of the weirwoods. This relationship may be how Jon learns of his past.

So, maybe as you continue your reread you might noticed something I missed. Everytime I reread just a Page, I find something "new".

[Lady Gaga's bastard]

Well Bran sees Shaggydog in Skagos. He's wounded from fighting a goat (unicorn to some)

[Bad Hound!]

Yes, it's pretty powerful when Ghost sees Nymeria leading "100 little grey cousins" and Shaggydog eating what is described as a large mountain goat (possibly a unicorn as you say)

What is interesting is that as Nymeria is separated from Arya, she is leading a large group. Now when Arya was in the Riverlands either with the BwB or with the Hounds, she never closely bonded with Nymeria. And now Nymeria is a leader whereas Arya is exiled, isolated, alone, and changing. So there is a clear separation there.

Whereas at this point in the beginning of ADWD, Ghost is very close to Jon, and Summer to Bran (we don't know about Shaggydog and Rickon). So Evita mgfs, what you say is very interesting, and both Ghost and Summer are really linked up with Jon and Bran, and that this is the Old Gods doing. Just like (I think) it was the Old Gods placing the direwolves pups in the Stark children in the first place.

I just find it intriguing what's happening with Nymeria.

[hollypenyo77]

Concerning the last par (R+L=J), I think since both the Starks and Targaryens are both such old families, he will show strong ties to each. Being a warg is really tied with the Starks and direwolves, but if and when he comes in contact with the dragons, he may be really connected to that part of his lineage as well. He just hasn't been exposed to any of that side of his family yet, so we'll have to find out.

[evita mgfs]

Yes, it's pretty powerful when Ghost sees Nymeria leading "100 little grey cousins" and Shaggydog eating what is described as a large mountain goat (possibly a unicorn as you say)

What is interesting is that as Nymeria is separated from Arya, she is leading a large group. Now when Arya was in the Riverlands either with the BwB or with the Hounds, she never closely bonded with Nymeria. And now Nymeria is a leader whereas Arya is exiled, isolated, alone, and changing. So there is a clear separation there.

Whereas at this point in the beginning of ADWD, Ghost is very close to Jon, and Summer to Bran (we don't know about Shaggydog and Rickon). So Evita mgfs, what you say is very interesting, and both Ghost and Summer are really linked up with Jon and Bran, and that this is the Old Gods doing. Just like (I think) it was the Old Gods placing the direwolves pups in the Stark children in the first place.

I just find it intriguing what's happening with Nymeria.

:bowdown: :bowdown: BAD HOUND: You are doing a good job analyzing and interpreting aspects of Martin's novels. I noticed a few of your observations that maybe I can make clearer since our AGoT ReRead Thread focuses on the "Direwolves, Dragons [Eggs], Mormont's Raven, and Cats, Oh MY! Pets or Providence?"

1. Regarding how the direwolves are found: Ned hears Robb call out for all to join him. Ned says casually, "Let's go learn what my sons have ROOTED OUT". [i am paraphrasing, but "rooted out" are Ned's exact words. Martin's word choice is deliberate: he does not have Ned say the obvious: "Let's go see what my sons have found". The verb "rooted" and modifier "out" are meaningful, especially for those Martin fans on a reread. Roots of the weirwood trees correlate with the aspects that are the old gods, the CotF, and Bloodraven. The heart tree at Winterfell has roots that grow deep into the earth and probably the roots extend beneath the towers, buildings, walls, and the crypts that are Winterfell. Moreover, Martin personifies Winterfell, the heart tree, and the crypts, endowing them human characteristics.

2. Theon's knee-jerk reaction on first seeing the direwolves is "gods!", which is another insinuation that the forces of the old gods are at work regarding the pups.

3. "Something" draws Jon back over the bridge to find Ghost after the party started on their way again. Bran hears nothing; Ghost is silent: thus, Jon Snow may instinctively feel Ghost's presence and Jon goes to him, or perhaps Ghost and Jon immediately have a connection that allows them to communicate telepathically.

In another thread about Arya's Destiny, Arya Nym pointed out with evidence from the novels that Nymeria may be a hell-bitch leading a pack, but Nymeria will not allow other wolves to mount her: she is a "virgin" wolf. Now, this seemed significant to Arya's further development as a "warg". Even though Arya and Nym are separated, Haggon says in V6S's POV when a warg takes a wolf, it is a marriage. So literally and symbolically, Arya and Nym are "linked" for life even though at the present they are separated by land and water. Other posters also speculated that when and if Nym does mate with another, Nym's choice would somehow impact Arya's future male romances. However, I wish to point out that many posters truly wanted Nymeria to end up with Ghost, and some even ventured to say if Nymeria and Ghost hitch up, this may bring Arya and Jon together. Now that was mere speculation, and lots of other "male" counterparts were also suggested for Arya.

I agree that Nymeria is intriguing, but I am partial to all the direwolves! :dunno:

[Bad Hound!]

Thanks Evita for sharing your re-read. What you say about Nymeria makes her even more interesting to me.

So an interesting point will be her choice of mating partner: it may have significance for Arya but I don't know if it will be literally: if she chooses Ghost, could it really mean that Arya will "choose" Jon?

The thing is that at the moment Arya and Jon believe they are siblings (Ned's children), but maybe it will be shown later that Jon is not Ned's and so nothing would prevent them getting together. We already know they have a bond, but so far it had been a sibling's bond, they just got on really well as kids and Arya really looked up to him like her favourite big brother.

The other thing is that Arya's current path doesn't lend itself much to her coming back to Westeros to be a Stark again, connecting with her direwolf and marrying someone etc. But maybe Nymeria's transformation into a leader of wolves will make a her a powerful influence, and she can drag Arya away from Braavos and back into Westeros to reconnect with her siblings, Jon and the direwolf world? I think it's interesting how Nymeria is now growing into a feared leader scaring the hell out of whole communities of men in the Riverlands.

And I agree that all the direwolves are fascinating, I'm loving the fact that they all have very different personalities, and I think GRRM is doing a fantastic job at making each direwolf as complex as a human character.

So a quick question for you, if you are fascinated by the direwolves, are you one of the people convinced that Grey Wind is not dead, having somehow escaped the RW and that now Ghost can see 3 of his siblings plus one he cannot sense?

I have to say I hadn't even thought of that until I saw some nicely presented points on a thread and I re-read Jon's chapter: it is kind of true that GRRM's phrasing could be interpreted in 2 different ways (4 remaining direwolves, of which one he cannot sense, or 4 remaining direwolves plus one he cannot sense).