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The Unholy Consult Previews 2: Murder Shae Wrote


Rhom

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You see what I mean? It's strange for him to dismiss the possibility out of hand while actually wondering what he could do with it, even saying he'd be another Seswatha! If methods such as with the Wathi Doll were always required, you'd think he would have some curiosity.

I think this is nice psychological subtlety by Bakker. Achamian is terrified of the implications of Kellhus armed with the Gnosis, so he simply rejects the possibility.

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He also doesn't show any of the oddities of the Few until later. He's not repulsed by how he sees Akka, for instance; most people with the Few react really strongly to those who are marked so deeply. Kellhus of course doesn't allow his emotions to leak, so naturally Akka wouldn't think that he could be.

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OK, those are good questions. Perhaps there's some inconsistency here. I feel like there's some flashback to when Akka was found in his fishing village, but I don't recall if there are any details there that would shed any light.

I think Bakker said on Old Three Seas that The Few is not necessarily genetic, it correlates to other characteristics, most of them having to do with intelligence. So I imagine they look around for the sharp kids, and then give them a Wathi doll esque test?
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I think Bakker said on Old Three Seas that The Few is not necessarily genetic, it correlates to other characteristics, most of them having to do with intelligence. So I imagine they look around for the sharp kids, and then give them a Wathi doll esque test?

Yeah, I was thinking this as well. There are likely people who have the potential to see the onta but no training, precisely because they weren't bright enough to be recruited by any of the Schools.

This does raise the possibility that the Cish recruit differently, specifically by looking at people who shine in the Third Sight. Advantageous in the event of an Apocalypse - it's possible you don't need the same training to get a basic grasp of Water bearing.

Possibly good news for Trisk - Meppa might end up recruiting Cish in between the final duology to stand against the Consult hordes.

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Sci - I am not too sure we'll ever get the third series. :crying:

We'll get it. My prediction is Bakker writes some horror standalones or possible some 40K novels in between TUC and the final books.

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In the latest comments to some intrepid fan on TPB, Sci, Bakker mentioned finishing LTG specifically after TUC.

I still say bring on Semantica... or those other titles he's got cooking on the backburner :P - [after a release of LTG, of course.]

EDIT:

rsbakker

I’m waiting until The Unholy Consult is done before diving into a final rewrite of LTG. The serial form I posted last year is simply a draft – and a rough one at that.

rsbakker

There will be new maps – I know that much for sure. Otherwise, I’ll be sure to answer your other questions, Benjamin, as soon as I know the answers myself.

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In the latest comments to some intrepid fan on TPB, Sci, Bakker mentioned finishing LTG specifically after TUC.

I still say bring on Semantica... or those other titles he's got cooking on the backburner :P - [after a release of LTG, of course.]

EDIT:

I'd recommend he take another dip into the probability trance if he thinks finishing LTG is better than writing a new horror standalone.

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This reread of TWP has been a gold mine for hints and information that I had forgotten. For example, I found an interesting quote that makes me even more sure that Meppa is Cnaiur, perhaps even a super early foreshadowing:

"You saved me in the desert," Proyas said.

Cnaiür quashed the sudden yearning that filled him. For some reason he missed the desert--far more so than the Steppe. What was it? Was it the anonymity of footsteps, the impossibility of leaving track or trail? Was it respect? The Carathay had killed far more than he ... Or had his heart recognized itself in her desolation?

So he identifies with it very strongly, perhaps strongly enough to return to it after leaving Moe's cave.

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The only way I'd buy Meppa as Cnauir is if there are references to the former's arms being covered.

Xin is dead.

Honestly IMO resurrecting either of these characters would turn the books into a soap opera.

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I'm pretty sure that Bakker came out with some pretty strong words on how Cnaiur's story is done and we won't see him again. Granted he could be pulling an Obi-Wan:"It's true from a certain point of view" but I don't see any reason to think so. Cnaiur's arc was wrapped up.

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Achamian saw Xinemus die, yes. Even though Xin asked him to leave...

Neuropunctured Metapsukhari or MoenghusHimself before this turns into Meppa is X. I simply feel Meppa has to offer us backstory on what Moenghus actually accomplished in his thirty years and also, some goddamn insight into Cishaurim religious practices...

I believe the only POV we have from a believer (besides the limited Omnipresent 3rd person war narratives that sometimes feature the Water-Bearers) is Fanashila's:

"Sometimes, when the overseers were distracted, she would search the brocaded panels that regaled the tarp walls for the Two Scimitars of Fane. They were all over, little signs of her people's faith. Then she would silently repeat the words she had heard so many times in Tabernacle.

One for the Unbeliever... One for the Unseeing Eye... (lol, lockesnow ;))" (TTT, p274)

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Here's a question. Would Fanayal have recognized most of the Cishaurim?

I kind of get the impression that Fanayal also does not know who Meppa is although I don't think the text is completely conclusive on that. Given how close the religion and the administrative rulership seemed to be in Fanimry, you'd think that the Padarijah's heir would know or recognize most of the hierarchy of the Cish.

I don't see why this would be the case. You're assuming all the Primaries were stationed near major political sites. We've no reason to assume that AFAIK.

Also, knowing someone by name and recognizing them are different things.

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Yeah I think Fanayal should know all the primaries and incandati and even if he didn't know them by sight I would think he'd be able to figure out which one Meppa is based on other factors even if Meppa himself has forgotten.

Also just to throw it out their I am a believer that Fanimry is the true religion for the reason's you guys said, but also because I feel like it would be hard for Bakker to resist the temptation of having a fair number of readers base their metaphysical interpretations on the Intrithi framework simply because that is the one we are the most exposed to.

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Edit: Apparently the board does not support Arabic text but in the process of making my cool little fake Shahada I found out that Fane at least the way I spelled in Arabic translates as, Narrated, coincidence or intentional? I wonder.

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But we do know that Shimeh was the holiest of holies, and that the Cish would have had a temple or something there.

We also have an idea from the SS about roughly how many Cish could take the field, and it's just a little over a hundred counting tertiaries. There aren't too many primaries and there are only nine Incandati. And those guys would be straight-up revered in Fanim lands.

Yet one of the most prominent Cish, Big Moe, was also one of the weakest in power. The numbers of Primaries is based on the information gleaned by the Scarlet Spires. Surely the Cish did not advertise their true numbers so publicly[?]

That the Cish had a temple in Shimeh does not mean all the Cish were there. In fact, it's incredibly likely that the Cish, as the Fanim's only answer to the Schools, had at minimum Primaries if not Incandati in other regions in the even[t] of an attack.

I think people are rationalizing in the hopes that Meppa is a character from the past novels. Yet there are, AFAIK, no serious clues about Meppa's identity. He could be Cnauir or Big Moe, but there has to be some legitimate clue in the text. Both have scars on their arms, but unless I'm forgetting no covering of Meppa's arms has been mentioned.

A reveal that you cannot deduce from your reading is a worthless reveal. Better that Meppa offer us some insight into Fanim thoughts about God and serve whatever end Big Moe or Kellhus has set him up to serve.

Basically Meppa kills Fayanal, Zeum takes over the Empire only to feel the Whirlwind on the horizon on the last page of TUC.

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I very much doubt that Meppa is anyone we've seen before, but It seems to me that as a prince Fanayal should have known anyone of importance in the Cishaurim hierarchy even if they were stationed in other areas, the fact that he seems not to know who Meppa is, is a riddle.

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Yeah I mean there's definitely an argument either way. To me the question of Moe's strength isn't really important, since he died without using the Psukhe for anything other than Calling Kellhus (on screen anyway).

It's been a whole since I read TDTCB, but IIRC Moe is the Cish on screen with the Emperor who takes on the face of the Fanim war general to have the conversation with the Emperor. That is a second spell from Moe on screen. It further confuses the debate because it seems a very powerful spell but its also similar to Calling as it's communication at a distance.
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