Jump to content

[Book Spoilers] Book deviations in this episode


teemo

Recommended Posts

you'd think people bothered by others discussing changes from teh book would have the sense not to pen a thread titled "book deviations"

You should have seen those people last year in the "nitpick without repercussions" thread. Jesus.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

can someone please tell me where in the books it talks about or implies that Jon being a warg is partially why he was accepted by Mance? I remember it, but I have no idea where it happened. I just re-read the part where they meet in the tent and it's not there.

It's not explicitly stated but I think they made a big fuss about him being a skinchanger. I have a hazy memory now but I think the wildlings think his potential as skinchanger is very high if trained properly.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Anyone think the Giants don't look as how you pictured them in the Books?They look 20 feet tall in the show minimum, and they aren't hairy/furry enough.They definitely look nice on the show but not exactly how I pictured them.Hoping to see mammoths too.

No I agree about the giants. Like a previous poster, I pictured them like yetis just maybe a little less hairy. The book isn't specific in that they look like yetis...but it IS specific as to them NOT looking like large humans. I think Jon even thinks about how in all the stories he heard giants are described as basically large humans and how that was wrong. ETA: Also I'm pretty sure that giant was wearing clothes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What? To me, it looked like Dany lost weight. One of my friends who is in love with her was kind of grossed out by her this episode, saying she looked "gaunt" and "look what stardom did to her." (pressure to lose weight).

I felt that made sense in the show. At the beginning, she was curvalicious for her pregnancy and abortion. Later she starves badly in the desert. She gets back to health in civilization, but is no longer in the baby fat realm.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I never understood why Mance thought that Jon being a bastard was reason enough for him to join the wildlings. So what he doesn't like being a bastard? What difference did that make at the Wall, where everyone is equal? Didn't make much sense to me in the book. Jon was much more convincing in the show. My only gripe with that scene in the show was that they cut Mance's tale about infiltrating Robert's feast at Winterfell. That was pretty awesome in the book and I wish they hadn't cut it. Still, there's a chance we might get that tale in another conversation, in another episode.

Being a bastard Jon has no place in the traditional social structures that exist in Westeros. The only place he could naturaly fit in/be somebody is with the wildlings where these kinda social structures/preconceptions don't really exist. You could argue that Jon went to the NW to find a place where he belonged however we can see even there he is antagonized because of his birth (ex: "Lord Snow"). Also hes a wrag.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'll be honest -- to me - it is what it is.

People complain about the Star Wars franchise and forget how lucky they are to even have it.

Those who say they'd rather not have the PT or TCW are full of it and lying to themselves.

I enjoyed reading most of your opinions here -- and skipped the rants as they tended to be too unrealistic anyway.

I'll be watching regardless and actually am having a hard time remembering the books details that I read only within the last 2 years. : (

To me the worst change is that the TV show to me means GGRM is likely going to take 1000 years that we don;t have to ever really finish the novels.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Being a bastard Jon has no place in the traditional social structures that exist in Westeros. The only place he could naturaly fit in/be somebody is with the wildlings where these kinda social structures/preconceptions don't really exist. You could argue that Jon went to the NW to find a place where he belonged however we can see even there he is antagonized because of his birth (ex: "Lord Snow"). Also hes a wrag.

But other than Alliser Thorne, nobody cared about him being a bastard in thw NW. Only Alliser called him "Lord Snow" as an insult.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

But other than Alliser Thorne, nobody cared about him being a bastard in thw NW. Only Alliser called him "Lord Snow" as an insult.

True but Mance doesn't know that now does he? ;)

Benjen Stark's line about brothers at the NW only being given positions that they earn isn't exactly true as we have cases like Royche at the begining of the book leading rangers because of his noble blood. To most people the NW is a punishment with Jon being an exception joining voluntarily.

When talking to Jon in the book Mance most likely sees another "brother" who like himself feels he doesn't belong in NW nor enjoys its restrictive nature. This is why i personally think he accepts Jon's reason for joining plus Jon himself isn't being completely dishonest as he has shown several times resentment for being treated as a bastard.

I hope i haven't muddled my thoughts here but as always part of the fun of reading is seeing how different people interpret the same situation.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jon's reasoning in the show made just as much sense as his reasoning in the books. In the long run it doesn't matter much anyway (in fact I didn't even notice the change until I started seeing people here mention it).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't like how they scrapped the Sansa escape storyline, that was one of the biggest twists/reveals in the books,. When Sansa boards the ship and sees LF and then Ser Dontos gets his "reward".

Said it once, I'll say it again, it's because HBO have Aidan Gillen contracted and yet bog all for him to actually do (since LF is such a mercurial bg character at this point), which is why in S2 and seemingly 3, they keep shoehorning him into OOC scenes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Said it once, I'll say it again, it's because HBO have Aidan Gillen contracted and yet bog all for him to actually do (since LF is such a mercurial bg character at this point), which is why in S2 and seemingly 3, they keep shoehorning him into OOC scenes.

:agree:

That is probably the best reason to explain why many characters are getting combined and or taking lines from smaller characters.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've been dwelling on the changes they made to Danys arc this episode and in retrospect I am a little bit iffy about how they've rearranged certain things.

- Barristan is introduced way too late. Most of his crucial dialogue about Rhaegar, discussing the Mad King, on the ethics of using the Unsullied and the dragons happened on the ship and when Dany goes to inspect the Unsullied. Instead Jorah fills this role and the comment Khraznez makes about piss and old men was meant for Barristan. Removing his reason for being incognito sort of makes it difficult for me to see how the conversation about her families madness and her father could possibly come up. I also think (memory hazy here) it was his discussion about Rhaegar which caused her to name her dragons on the ship.

- Jorah suggesting getting the Unsullied. In the show, Dany clearly already has objections; which makes her out as a stronger and more independent minded person. But in the book, shes still nieve and it makes her so overjoyed at the prospect of getting somewhere that this causes the situation where Jorah kisses her. I don't see how that kiss could possibly be set up now. She has to decide on the Unsullied "tomorrow" according to Kraznez which suggests she'll be given them very soon which cuts a lot of the time to discuss these things.

- On a related point. Dany is seriously shocked by what she sees at Astapor and has a major argument with Jorah over this in the book. In fact I think shes even reduced to tears by it. Now, in the series, I felt they made her far too aloof and dignified about this. She also doesn't seem to fall out with Jorah over him suggesting using soldiers trained by such horrible methods. In fact they have a casual discussion about it in the lead up to the assasination attempt. Also, her strong reaction against this is crucial to understanding the extreme stance she takes against this later in the novel. I don't think the series makes it out as less of a bad thing but it doesn't seem to have struck Dany so much to the core that it makes her question "what good are rulers if not to do justice?".

Now, I may be wrong. Maybe they've already rewritten some of those lines and scenes so that they are still there. But I suspect some of these might come across as jarring and theres also the issue of timing. I think D & D are aware that not much happened with Dany in season 2 and because this series is all about emphasising her rise to power they might neglect some of the really good character stuff in ASOS part 1. I think its pretty much been revealed that the Battle of Yunkai will be in the novel and one of the earlier episodes is even titled "Second Sons" which to me implies that the bulk of Danys ASOS story leading up to the Unsullied being taken might suffer in order to get her to that point in the story.

Or, of course, they could be saving all the soul searching and romance to when they're besieging Mereen in season 4.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont know if it is intential by D and D or just poor writing, but Stannis Baratheon is starting to become an entire different character than he is in the books. The scene between Davos and Melissandrae where stannis just sat by would never have happened in the books, because Stannis sees himself as a king, and he is also proud enough to realize that a king has to stand up for his own decisions. It was he who decided (after listening to davos advice) to not bring melissandrae to blackwater, So the Stannis from the books would never just sit there and allow mellisandrae to put that blame on Davos. He would consider that a disregard for his authority as the true king of westeros, and claim total responsibility for his order to keep her out of the battle.

TLDR: Stannis in the books is too proud to just stand by while his someone is accusing his Advisor of having "fooled" stannis into a bad decision. The Stannis i know would take that as a personal insult and remind melissandrae that he is the King, and the one who made the decision, and that he is not someone who can be fooled or persuaded into making a decision if he does not believe in it himself.

It seems like the Stannis Baratheon in the TV-series is just a bitter and gullable man who does whatever melissandrae or davos (in season 2) tells him to do. He totally lacks the pride and integrety that he displays in the books,

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont know if it is intential by D and D or just poor writing, but Stannis Baratheon is starting to become an entire different character than he is in the books. The scene between Davos and Melissandrae where stannis just sat by would never have happened in the books, because Stannis sees himself as a king, and he is also proud enough to realize that a king has to stand up for his own decisions. It was he who decided (after listening to davos advice) to not bring melissandrae to blackwater, So the Stannis from the books would never just sit there and allow mellisandrae to put that blame on Davos. He would consider that a disregard for his authority as the true king of westeros, and claim total responsibility for his order to keep her out of the battle.

TLDR: Stannis in the books is too proud to just stand by while his someone is accusing his Advisor of having "fooled" stannis into a bad decision. The Stannis i know would take that as a personal insult and remind melissandrae that he is the King, and the one who made the decision, and that he is not someone who can be fooled or persuaded into making a decision if he does not believe in it himself.

It seems like the Stannis Baratheon in the TV-series is just a bitter and gullable man who does whatever melissandrae or davos (in season 2) tells him to do. He totally lacks the pride and integrety that he displays in the books,

I think this was merely compression of the storyline. Stannis does start off the post-Blackwater period in a funk - he allows the burning of several of his bannermen before Davos arrives. I think they're just trying to convey that period in one brief scene before presumably Stannis steps up to the plate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

^^Agree. If I remember correctly, Mel was convincing Stannis that they lost at Blackwater because she wasn't there (in the last episode this was weaved into Mel's dialogue with Davos) and he was kind of down. Stannis really started behaving more himself again around the time of the Florent fiasco.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It seems like the Stannis Baratheon in the TV-series is just a bitter and gullable man who does whatever melissandrae or davos (in season 2) tells him to do. He totally lacks the pride and integrety that he displays in the books,

LuisDantas is coming for you. Don't waste time, just run.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...