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Shae and Ros scene


Ghosteline

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I liked this scene. Apparently I'm the only person here who doesn't hate Ros and think she is a "waste of screen time." Probably because I watched season one before I read the books.

You are not the only one (and I even read the books first) - With the exception of the infamous ep107 littlefinger monologue, I think her scenes have all served a good purpose, and I liked this one.

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You are not the only one (and I even read the books first) - With the exception of the infamous ep107 littlefinger monologue, I think her scenes have all served a good purpose, and I liked this one.

I would almost agree, but then I think that a TV character LF who's sort of seemingly all over the place with no agenda might not play out so well as a book character we don't have a PoV from. I know people hate that he would confide so much in some northern whore he basically just met - but who else can he have that dialogue with? If anything it works since he "owns" her and her voice and opinion are so insignificant that he's not worried about her running off and telling someone.

I've been saying I dislike the TV Littlefinger, but that's more because he seems kind of cheesy and not so brilliant. Although I did enjoy when Tywin tells him "You act like you're the first man who's ever thought of that" or something along those lines.

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I actually really liked the Ros/Shae conversation. A nice callback to Ros actually being from Winterfell, and showing the common people's respect/reverence for the Stark family.

And to beware of the treacherous LF.
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I actually like her character. I think she plays it very well also. I don't particularly like Littlefinger's portrayal and perhaps some people put the blame on her for some of it, and some people claim she's a bad actor which I really don't get.

But on a sidenote, watching the series before reading the books is actually a benefit I wish I had. It makes you like the show more without changing anything for your appreciation of the books at all.

As far as people saying she's a bad actress, I think that is just a case of people wanting to justify their opinion beyond "I don't like this because it's different from the book." I see this kind of thing all the time here.

I too am glad I watched season one before I read the books, I guess because it helped me appreciate the show on its own merits right from the start, rather than examining it as an adaptation.

Although personally I can separate books I enjoy from their adaptations and enjoy them each on their own merits. Changes don't bother me (unless they are DRASTIC and severely diverge the tone/spirit of the film from that of the book - a la The Walking Dead - and none of the changes in Game of Thrones have been or done so). Why would you want them to be exactly the same? If you need it all to be the same, just reread the books. This is the most faithful book-to-screen adaptation I have ever seen.

I watched the show first. I don't mind Ros, I only hated that 'LittleFinger playing teacher' scene because it was just too much for me.

I can understand why some people would be uncomfortable with this scene, but I have to admit I thought "play with her ass" was HILARIOUS and it cracks me up every time I watch it, haha.

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As far as people saying she's a bad actress, I think that is just a case of people wanting to justify their opinion beyond "I don't like this because it's different from the book." I see this kind of thing all the time here.

I too am glad I watched season one before I read the books, I guess because it helped me appreciate the show on its own merits right from the start, rather than examining it as an adaptation.

Although personally I can separate books I enjoy from their adaptations and enjoy them each on their own merits. Changes don't bother me (unless they are DRASTIC and severely diverge the tone/spirit of the film from that of the book - a la The Walking Dead - and none of the changes in Game of Thrones have been or done so). Why would you want them to be exactly the same? If you need it all to be the same, just reread the books. This is the most faithful book-to-screen adaptation I have ever seen.

Nail on the head with both of these. The actress playing Ros is absolutely fine. Is she the greatest thing ever? No. But she's in no way terrible. And the changes from the books are really, really minimal in comparison to most adaptations, to the point that 90% of the complaints I see simply register as being totally over-the-top purist nonsense. The show is a faithful adaptation. Period. Adaptation being the key word here, people. That doesn't mean that every single little thing from the books is 100% identically translated into video form. It means that, for the most part, major events, plot turns, major character arcs, and most importantly the spirit of the work, is...wait for it...adapted for television.

Now don't get me wrong, there are absolutely some changes I did not like at all. The biggest one for me was the latter half of Jon's story in S2 (and a lot of Dany's story as well). The handling of Qhorin's relationship with Jon was not well executed at all. But it's not like it ruined the entire fucking show or something. It doesn't matter one iota in the grand scheme of things. And that was for a major character. To see the way people bitch about a thirty second Ros scene is almost comical in its absurdity.

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That scene was really the only one to bother me in the whole episode. Not so much that it exists, but the way they wrote it. It's as if the viewer is stupid and needs a reminder that Littlefinger is an evil-to-shoes card-carrying villain. Seriously, I expected more from the writers who usually do a good job.

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That scene was really the only one to bother me in the whole episode. Not so much that it exists, but the way they wrote it. It's as if the viewer is stupid and needs a reminder that Littlefinger is an evil-to-shoes card-carrying villain.

Can you explain why you think this?

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I think Ros knows Shae is a whore because she works for Varys, and Varys knows.

I think Ros will be a collection of characters...

I think she will be Dontos and help get Sansa out. Then "evil Shae" and testify against Tyrion. Which will either get her killed (by Tyrion) or she will escape KL and we will see her again in the North either suffering at the hands of Ramsey or whoring in Moles Town, and then consequently at the Wall. Shae will be hung by Tywin, and Tyrion will kill him. It's also possible Ros makes it to Harrenhal and eventually gets to be the washerwoman Jamie takes along to Riverrun. (Pia) Although the timing probably wouldn't work for that part.

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My question is why is Shae still alive? Tywin knew that Tyrion brought a whore into his bed. I have to re-watch the scene, but he may have even said, "that" whore which I take as the specific camp follower Tywin told Tyrion not to bring to court. So clearly Tywin knows Shae is a whore and not a handmaiden.

Is this a goof up in the translation from book to film? Or am I missing something.

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To everyone saying that Ros sucks because she takes away screen time from actual book characters: A lot of the characters from the book wouldn't have the screen time they do if it weren't for Ros....The main function of Ros is to be the lens through which we see a lot of the non-POV characters from the books: Theon, LF, Pycelle, Varys, etc. She serves as the means in which we actually see what these characters are doing in the background, since viewers dont have the convenience of inner monologues and exposition. Shes also a vehicle to further develop and explore these characters from their print counterparts. I watched the show before reading the books *dodges tomatoes*, and I was pretty confused about Theon until that scene with him and her in season 1.

Whether her scenes help the viewer glean some really important insights into LF's backstory/personality, or simply provide an accent to themes or events already happening (IE P90X Pycelle doing some power squats and stretches before pretending to be flimsy, decrepit, brittle Pycelle that everyone sees), shes important to the show. And judging by the scene from 301, shes going to keep on trucking with this role, and maybe even become more central to the plot, as some have suggested. Not to mention that from a show standpoint, having a recognizable face to interact with all of the main characters and cover as much ground in Westeros as she has is something shows are rarely afforded. Shes a very well written character.

And to all the armchair casting coordinators out there analyzing her teeth and saying shes sucks...Calm down and leave the books on the shelf while the show is on. I mean, I get having gripes and problems here and there, and I know that not everyone is going to like her...but this type of venom and disgust for a really well written character just seems misplaced.

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I would almost agree, but then I think that a TV character LF who's sort of seemingly all over the place with no agenda might not play out so well as a book character we don't have a PoV from. I know people hate that he would confide so much in some northern whore he basically just met - but who else can he have that dialogue with?

The counter to that arguement is that Littlefinger isn't a PoV character so the readers don't get any insight into what he is thinking or doing when he isn't interacting with a PoV character either. The only reasonable explanation for creating new scenes for him is that the actor needs work, much like Robb and Jaime couldn't just be gone for all of season 2 and hope to keep the actor under contract. Of course that excuse only works if you have already included all the possible scenes that Littlefinger was in from the book first, which they haven't.

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To everyone saying that Ros sucks because she takes away screen time from actual book characters: A lot of the characters from the book wouldn't have the screen time they do if it weren't for Ros....The main function of Ros is to be the lens through which we see a lot of the non-POV characters from the books: Theon, LF, Pycelle, Varys, etc. She serves as the means in which we actually see what these characters are doing in the background, since viewers dont have the convenience of inner monologues and exposition. Shes also a vehicle to further develop and explore these characters from their print counterparts. I watched the show before reading the books *dodges tomatoes*, and I was pretty confused about Theon until that scene with him and her in season 1.

Whether her scenes help the viewer glean some really important insights into LF's backstory/personality, or simply provide an accent to themes or events already happening (IE P90X Pycelle doing some power squats and stretches before pretending to be flimsy, decrepit, brittle Pycelle that everyone sees), shes important to the show. And judging by the scene from 301, shes going to keep on trucking with this role, and maybe even become more central to the plot, as some have suggested. Not to mention that from a show standpoint, having a recognizable face to interact with all of the main characters and cover as much ground in Westeros as she has is something shows are rarely afforded. Shes a very well written character.

And to all the armchair casting coordinators out there analyzing her teeth and saying shes sucks...Calm down and leave the books on the shelf while the show is on. I mean, I get having gripes and problems here and there, and I know that not everyone is going to like her...but this type of venom and disgust for a really well written character just seems misplaced.

And now there is tea coming out my nose. Thanks. :P

But other than that, I totally agree. Ros is 'glue' more than a character. She's a useful (and very pretty) plot device.

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I saw this posted on another board and thought it was kind of interesting. Not sure I buy it but I was wondering if anyone else thought this scene was a shot at "book purist"?

"I was rewatching the first episode and realized something- I think the Shae/Sansa scene was sort of a subtle shot at the hardcore fans. Watch the scene again only pretend Sansa is D&D and Shae is book purists. The scene kind of has a totally new meaning when viewed that way.

Sansa (D&D) is saying if you don’t change things (in the book) a la that ship is from Dorne the truth (the show) will be either terrible or boring. But Shae (Book purists) doesn’t care and won’t play along and thinks if a ship(way it is in the book) is from volantis then one should just say the ship is from volantis. Even Ros’ line watch sansa with Littlefinger (D&D with littlefinger) followed by shae (book purists) saying I always do, has a totally different meaning. Its a very clever scene. viewed that way"

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I saw this posted on another board and thought it was kind of interesting. Not sure I buy it but I was wondering if anyone else thought this scene was a shot at "book purist"?

"I was rewatching the first episode and realized something- I think the Shae/Sansa scene was sort of a subtle shot at the hardcore fans. Watch the scene again only pretend Sansa is D&D and Shae is book purists. The scene kind of has a totally new meaning when viewed that way.

Sansa (D&D) is saying if you don’t change things (in the book) a la that ship is from Dorne the truth (the show) will be either terrible or boring. But Shae (Book purists) doesn’t care and won’t play along and thinks if a ship(way it is in the book) is from volantis then one should just say the ship is from volantis. Even Ros’ line watch sansa with Littlefinger (D&D with littlefinger) followed by shae (book purists) saying I always do, has a totally different meaning. Its a very clever scene. viewed that way"

Nice reasoning. I doubt they went that deep, but I like it. This is one very intelligent idea. Congratulations.

Also, welcome to the forums :cheers:

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To everyone saying that Ros sucks because she takes away screen time from actual book characters: A lot of the characters from the book wouldn't have the screen time they do if it weren't for Ros....The main function of Ros is to be the lens through which we see a lot of the non-POV characters from the books: Theon, LF, Pycelle, Varys, etc. She serves as the means in which we actually see what these characters are doing in the background, since viewers dont have the convenience of inner monologues and exposition. Shes also a vehicle to further develop and explore these characters from their print counterparts. I watched the show before reading the books *dodges tomatoes*, and I was pretty confused about Theon until that scene with him and her in season 1.

Whether her scenes help the viewer glean some really important insights into LF's backstory/personality, or simply provide an accent to themes or events already happening (IE P90X Pycelle doing some power squats and stretches before pretending to be flimsy, decrepit, brittle Pycelle that everyone sees), shes important to the show. And judging by the scene from 301, shes going to keep on trucking with this role, and maybe even become more central to the plot, as some have suggested. Not to mention that from a show standpoint, having a recognizable face to interact with all of the main characters and cover as much ground in Westeros as she has is something shows are rarely afforded. Shes a very well written character.

And to all the armchair casting coordinators out there analyzing her teeth and saying shes sucks...Calm down and leave the books on the shelf while the show is on. I mean, I get having gripes and problems here and there, and I know that not everyone is going to like her...but this type of venom and disgust for a really well written character just seems misplaced.

:laugh: :cheers: Thank you! P90X.LOLOLOL
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Hi, newbie here - I'm really hooked on this series! It's nice to find such an informative site. A lot of my questions have been answered in the course of wandering around the threads for the past couple of days.

This has been a fascinating thread so far - I've studied women's issues for a long time and the subtext of the TV series regarding women and their roles in Westeros society (I haven't read the books yet) is explored in this article in the online New Yorker Magazine:

http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/television/2012/05/07/120507crte_television_nussbaum

The author of the review gets a few series details wrong, but it offers what I thought was an interesting point of view.

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I like Esmé Bianco and I understand the need for Ros as a plot device. But I still found the scene in question the worst on the 1st episode by far. It was just unecessary, unless you are a lazy viewer who "forgot" that Littlefinger is evil or something. Littlefinger talking to Sansa was necessary plot development, even Shae being onscreen there was ok. But Ros was just not needed at this point.

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I like Esmé Bianco and I understand the need for Ros as a plot device. But I still found the scene in question the worst on the 1st episode by far. It was just unecessary, unless you are a lazy viewer who "forgot" that Littlefinger is evil or something. Littlefinger talking to Sansa was necessary plot development, even Shae being onscreen there was ok. But Ros was just not needed at this point.

Don't over estimate people. There are a number of viewers who think that Rob arrived at the ruins of Winterfell, not the ruins of Harrenhall, despite Rob and Roose clearly talking about Harrenhall, and the fact it has been shown a number of times previously.

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Don't over estimate people. There are a number of viewers who think that Rob arrived at the ruins of Winterfell, not the ruins of Harrenhall, despite Rob and Roose clearly talking about Harrenhall, and the fact it has been shown a number of times previously.

Well, these people probably wouldn't understand the series anyway, right? What's next? Should the characters also wear badges with their names on it?

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