Is Syrio Forel really dead?

[Whitering]

No, that's not possible. Not since AFFC, when Rennifer Longwaters gave us a detailed description of who was when in the Black Cells.

Well, we know an alt of Varys was the head gaoler. Varys = sneaky, maybe he knew who Syrio was all along so maybe Varys had a little chat with him like he did with Ned.

[The guy from the Vale]

Why include that talk at all, except to disprove S=J? And Varys might eb sneaky, but he can't retroactively erase the records in a time where pencils and erasers are unknown.

[wighty]

Syrio is as dead as Jaqen H'gar

[Light a wight tonight]

IIRC he not only stabs him through the heart, but also twists the blade. Sounds explicit to me.

A guy in Roose's armor does this. Probably Roose, but there's always a chance it wasn't. An extremely tiny chance.

Not like Garlan in Renly's armor.

[The Mother of The Others]

syrio evaporated from the pages of this series (a water dancer's demise)

Have you tried dripping some water on your copy of the book to wet it down and then re-reading the ending?

[Light a wight tonight]

This subject has been beaten so often and so hard that it's deader than Syrio. No matter how many points are brought up on either side nobody gets persuaded. IMO there's a possibility that Syrio's dead and a stronger one that he's not. I've made my case elsewhere, and won't repeat myself.

That said, I have no expectation that Syrio will crop up again. He played his part, now he can enjoy his retirement.

[The Chequered Raven]

Beeing dead and showing up later is not an uncommon thing in Westeros...

[NelyafinweMaitimo]

Personally, I'm not sure. On one hand we still have Trant walking around, but on the other we never to see a body. Plus to my knowledge we never hear it explicitly from any person that he died....

Either way, it doesn't seem to have had a an impact on the books. I do not believe that he was/is a Faceless Man, so maybe this will just be a case of a mystery never solved.

[Usrnmhsnomning]

Yep, Syrio is dead. His own admission is that he doesn't flee; he faced Trant with nothing in his hand and died seconds after Arya fled. There is absolutely no evidence to suggest he is alive; instead, people use "evidence" that he didn't die i.e "wheres his body, why doesn't Trant say he killed him" etc. Zero evidence for life, mountains of evidence for death in comparison. End of story.

[A Crow Come Over]

But it's not explicitly stated that's Roose Bolton. He is only described.

Likewise, we don't even get a description of Syrio's death, Cersei comments that the 'dancing master interfered' with Trant and make no mention of the outcome. To me if he was dead, his head would've been mounted on the spikes in Kings Landing along with the rest of the Stark household. GRRM is never gonna come out and say "Yes Syrio is dead" or "Yes, Syrio and Jaqen are the same FM", he will simply tell us to "draw our own conclusions".

[A Crow Come Over]

Yep, Syrio is dead. His own admission is that he doesn't flee; he faced Trant with nothing in his hand and died seconds after Arya fled. There is absolutely no evidence to suggest he is alive; instead, people use "evidence" that he didn't die i.e "wheres his body, why doesn't Trant say he killed him" etc. Zero evidence for life, mountains of evidence for death in comparison. End of story.

Technically he says the First Sword of Braavos does not run not "I do not run" TIFWIW

[Vale of Tears]

I love Syrio Forel and I honestly believe he did die an admiral death for the First of Braavos. I wish he didn't and I wish more he was alive, him and Arya's interaction was sweet, and his character very likeable. But given his situation, it appears as if he did indeed die either by Trants hands or even maybe Ilyn Payne beheading him later if they tossed him in the cells first then charged him to die as a traitor who knows. As someone else stated too he said himself he would never flee. Maybe GRRM didn't realize Syrio would get this much love from the fans and that's why he asked why people kept wanting to know if he died. I believe GRRM's intentions were for Syrio to die, but after seeing how many people loved Syrio and kept asking he stated to draw our own conclusions to make us satisfied of the possibility of Syrio being alive AND so GRRM has an opening to bring back Syrio if he feels like it?

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Yes. Accept it. Move on.

[Usrnmhsnomning]

Technically he says the First Sword of Braavos does not run not "I do not run" TIFWIW

Technically when he says this he's already called himself the First Sword of Braavos.

[Light a wight tonight]

Technically he says the First Sword of Braavos does not run not "I do not run" TIFWIW

He says nothing about the former First Sword, does he?

[Moon-Pale Maiden]

The only way Syrio could have survived the duel with Trant in full armor is if he was able to wound or disable Trant long enough to get away. Since it doesn't seem like Trant suffered any type of injury, I would have to say Syrio was unfortunately another casualty of the day.

If GRRM described every single detail, we'd get bored. It's better to leave things for us to conclude ourselves, as he said, and use our imagination to determine how that battle ended.

More importantly, crackpot theories aside, what would Syrio Forel add to the story five books later if he returned? I think Syrio would just complicate and confuse Arya's plot. If he was going to become a major player in her story, he would have arrived already. We only have two books left; Arya's training is almost done. She's got to go back to Westeros soon and complete her plot destiny.

[Ours if the Fury]

he could be dead but i have a theory that he could possible Jaqen H'ghar hence he changed his face to escape kings landing

[Woftis]

he could be dead but i have a theory that he could possible Jaqen H'ghar hence he changed his face to escape kings landing

Jaqen was already in the cells before the events with Syrio/Trant.

[Dr. Pepper]

Those aren't the only possibilities. Trant could have taken him prisoner, and thrown him in the black cells, where he changed into Jaqen.

Jaqen, Rorge and Biter were signed over by Ned to Yoren before the Stark household was taken hostage and/or killed. During the Stark household purge, everyone including the Septa was killed. The only ones to make it were Sansa and Arya (who escaped) and Jeyne Poole, who was with Sansa and we know what happened to her. If they killed even the Septa, there is no reason at all they would allow the dancing master live especially when Syrio took up arms against various guard units loyal to the crown and/or Lannisters.

I don't really believe he is still alive, unless maybe it is relevant to Arya's faceless man story. Just saying. GRRM said "draw your own conclusions"

that is pretty vague and isn't by any means a confirmation.

I admit, I find it incredibly annoying that these "Is Syrio Alive" threads pop up every week. But I still find it preferable to GRRM spoon feeding answers to the fandom. New readers are constantly coming to the series. Until he's finished with the series, I think it's a fun game he plays by keeping his answers the same for everyone whether they've been reading since 1996 or 2013. It's a lot more satisfying to draw our own conclusions rather than having things explicitly verified by the author.

Martin rarely outright confirms or denies things that aren't explicitly stated in the books. As far as I recall, the few things that have been explicitly confirmed by him are Brienne's last word (sword, which was blindingly obvious since she showed up later) and that Targaryens are not fireproof (which was also obvious since Viserys died from molten gold being poured over his head). Other things are given vague responses if they haven't already been outright stated or proven in the books.

I think, given the evidence, the conclusion to be drawn is that Syrio was a fun character who got himself dead.

[Woftis]

Jaqen, Rorge and Biter were signed over by Ned to Yoren before the Stark household was taken hostage and/or killed. During the Stark household purge, everyone including the Septa was killed. The only ones to make it were Sansa and Arya (who escaped) and Jeyne Poole, who was with Sansa and we know what happened to her. If they killed even the Septa, there is no reason at all they would allow the dancing master live especially when Syrio took up arms against various guard units loyal to the crown and/or Lannisters.

I admit, I find it incredibly annoying that these "Is Syrio Alive" threads pop up every week. But I still find it preferable to GRRM spoon feeding answers to the fandom. New readers are constantly coming to the series. Until he's finished with the series, I think it's a fun game he plays by keeping his answers the same for everyone whether they've been reading since 1996 or 2013. It's a lot more satisfying to draw our own conclusions rather than having things explicitly verified by the author.

Martin rarely outright confirms or denies things that aren't explicitly stated in the books. As far as I recall, the few things that have been explicitly confirmed by him are Brienne's last word (sword, which was blindingly obvious since she showed up later) and that Targaryens are not fireproof (which was also obvious since Viserys died from molten gold being poured over his head). Other things are given vague responses if they haven't already been outright stated or proven in the books.

I think, given the evidence, the conclusion to be drawn is that Syrio was a fun character who got himself dead.

The Syrio thing seems to be one of the few times GRRM has seemed irritated by how often it's speculated :lol: ....or that's how I interpreted it anyway.