[Book Spoilers] EP302 Discussion

[ckal]

That woman playing Shae - where did they find her? She's awful, painful to watch. I felt awful for Dinklage. As brilliant as he is in the role of Tyrion, there was no saving that scene. Jealous!Shae is just about the worst version of her we've seen yet.

This angle that they are taking her in as well....just makes no sense. She's a whore with no power or ability to do anything except to service Tyrion. Yet they are making her out to be something far above what she is or logically could even be.

[DarkAndFullOfTurnips]

Pretty near a shit episode.

The only good scenes were mainly with Thoros and the scenes with the QOT and Theon.

The Jaime vs Brienne duel was fucking terribly executed. Terrible. Made Jaime look like an absolute chump.

And I can't help myself but to groan whenever Shae is on screen. Shae and her storyline is literally unbearable. Like Shae has any power to do anything but talks a huge game. Give me a break DnD. I will never be more excited for a character to die than when Shae bites the dust.

.

Yes the malnourished, dehydrated, physically exhausted Jaime fighting a great warrior while fettered and actually holding his own was so chump like...

[JonCon's Red Beard]

Read the book if you want the book.

Then why bother adapting a book if at the end you're going to do whatever the hell you like?

I'm ok. with big changes when it's needed, because tv/movies are a different format than books or comics, and some situations or characters can't be adapted as they were originally presented in their original format (like Selmy's hidden identity) or writers also want to tease book readers with some changes. But to change the motivations of a character and how such characters acts, then that's plain dumb.

[ckal]

I liked this episode. I found it interesting that they combined Tom o' Sevens and Thoros, and they resolved the problem of Arya not being recognized without Harwin by having the Hound appear early.

Only thing I didn't like is that it appears they are actually going to use that ridiculous storyline of Ramsay pretending to be on Theon's side and pretending to free him, only to bring him back to torture him later. Are GoT's writers that lazy that they have to take ridiculous speculation from this forum to use for story? Next thing we know, they'll actually use the silly Talisa replacing Jeyne Poole idea.

The reason they are doing this is to give the character and actor screen time. Otherwise Theon wouldn't even show up for another couple seasons. His storyline is being pushed forward (or at least being shown) when it wasn't shown in ASOS.

[Ser Farbod]

Mance is still awful. I dont care if the actor is talented. The character is drab and forgettable. Mance lept off the page in the books.

[go joff go]

I wish I could like this. While the changes to Cat's character have been far more obvious, the subtle changes to Arya's mentality/attitude have bothered me more.

Oh the whole, I enjoyed this episode. I really like how they handled the introduction of the Reeds, though I wish they kept the oath. It's almost like they're trying to wash out the entire "ice and fire" theme from the show.

I think the arya inn scene was the writers way of telling the fans, you see how stupid it would be to make arya this kick ass fighter at this point in the story and they are right. I think they are justified in telling fans to chill.

[Ross2013]

Oh, where oh, where is the murdering Arya Stark? She seems so helpless. It grids all my gears

I thought her scenes were good.

she seems helpless because she is helpless. the "murdering" Arya from the first three books is mostly in her thoughts. what exactly could she do this episode?

[ckal]

Yes the malnourished, dehydrated, physically exhausted Jaime fighting a great warrior while fettered and actually holding his own was so chump like...

Oh really? Because nobody would know that if they haven't read the books. None of this was emphasized whatsoever in this episode. I agree, the books did a nice job conveying this... and we know this.... but the show...not at all. Oh, and I would not call that 'holding his own.' He got chumped, badly.

Edited April 8, 2013 by ckal

[Magic 8 Ball]

I liked this episode. I found it interesting that they combined Tom o' Sevens and Thoros, and they resolved the problem of Arya not being recognized without Harwin by having the Hound appear early.

Only thing I didn't like is that it appears they are actually going to use that ridiculous storyline of Ramsay pretending to be on Theon's side and pretending to free him, only to bring him back to torture him later. Are GoT's writers that lazy that they have to take ridiculous speculation from this forum to use for story? Next thing we know, they'll actually use the silly Talisa replacing Jeyne Poole idea.

Well, in the books Ramsay did pretend to be on Theon's side, and also pretended to be someone he wasn't, only to have a shock reveal later and wind up torturing him. They want to introduce the character similarly, they just have to do it later under different circumstances for casting reasons. To have done the Reek reveal last season, they would have had to spend tons of time on exposition about the off-screen exploits of Ramsay and Reek to make it click. It wouldn't have worked that well, and given away the Boltons as sickos too early.

[Oakenfist]

That woman playing Shae - where did they find her? She's awful, painful to watch. I felt awful for Dinklage. As brilliant as he is in the role of Tyrion, there was no saving that scene. Jealous!Shae is just about the worst version of her we've seen yet.

She did porn before she became an actress, no joke.

[PatrickStormborn]

Then why bother adapting a book if at the end you're going to do whatever the hell you like?

I'm ok. with big changes when it's needed, because tv/movies are a different format than books or comics, and some situations or characters can't be adapted as they were originally presented in their original format (like Selmy's hidden identity) or writers also want to tease book readers with some changes. But to change the motivations of a character and how such characters acts, then that's plain dumb.

Yes, exactly. I've defended a number of the show's deviations (although I'm not sure why I bother - D&D have absolutely no respect for the fans of this series). But most of them are awful.

The biggest problems with the show could be solved by sticking more closely to the source material.

[ckal]

Mance is still awful. I dont care if the actor is talented. The character is drab and forgettable. Mance lept off the page in the books.

'You know how I united the people? I told them we would all die.' Ok....you also defeated all challengers to become the king beyond the wall....but certain things seem to be ignored....

[Minsc]

Yawn.

When Cat's killed on the show, I don't have to put up with watching ridiculous scenes where her character is completely destroyed.

I never said anything about Bran's disability and I'm not sure why it's relevant? Being "crippled" did not leave his characterisation destroyed.

Bonus, we won't have to see Robb's character destroyed anymore either. I just re-watched the clip where he and Catelyn argue about his marriage and I ended it wishing she put him over her knee because he was being such a childish brat.

[The Northern Scholar]

I think the arya inn scene was the writers way of telling the fans, you see how stupid it would be to make arya this kick ass fighter at this point in the story and they are right. I think they are justified in telling fans to chill.

I think that's a fair point. I think I can forgive them if they can find a way to recreate the scene with the Hound at the Inn even though they've already killed the Tickler.

[Ross2013]

I liked this episode. I found it interesting that they combined Tom o' Sevens and Thoros, and they resolved the problem of Arya not being recognized without Harwin by having the Hound appear early.

Only thing I didn't like is that it appears they are actually going to use that ridiculous storyline of Ramsay pretending to be on Theon's side and pretending to free him, only to bring him back to torture him later. Are GoT's writers that lazy that they have to take ridiculous speculation from this forum to use for story? Next thing we know, they'll actually use the silly Talisa replacing Jeyne Poole idea.

I think its pretty smart they are using reeks' memories from ADWD to give the actor playing Theon something to do this season.

[ckal]

She did porn before she became an actress, no joke.

Just looked her up on wiki. Seems it is true:

"Shortly after the release of Head-On, it became known she had previously acted in pornographic films using the stage name "Dilara".^[6][7][8] This report, as published by the German tabloid newspaper Bild-Zeitung, led to a public scandal, and Kekilli's parents broke off all contact with her.["

[DarkAndFullOfTurnips]

Oh really? Because nobody would know that if they haven't read the books. None of this was emphasized whatsoever in this episode. I agree, the books did a nice job conveying this... and we know this.... but the show...not at all. Oh, and I would not call that 'holding his own.' He got chumped, badly.

If you need to be told that someone being held captive in a dungeon for an extended period of time would make you physically weak and exhausted then the fault lies with you, not the writers. He's also chained and is able to fight for a good period of time before having essentially one hand and no stamina catches up to him.

This reminds me of the kind of ridiculousness you see in those Tower of Joy threads where people are honestly shocked that 7 warriors killed 3 elite warriors.

[Howdyphillip]

That woman playing Shae - where did they find her? She's awful, painful to watch. I felt awful for Dinklage. As brilliant as he is in the role of Tyrion, there was no saving that scene. Jealous!Shae is just about the worst version of her we've seen yet.

That woman is Sibel Kikkeli and she is one of the finest young actresses in the world. She is from Germany and has won two Lolas which are the most prestigious award given for German film making.

If you are having problems with her, it is not because of her acting. She is doing an outstanding job. She has been written completely different from the books, so that is probably your issue. She is immensely talented.

[Frumpus]

The reason they are doing this is to give the character and actor screen time. Otherwise Theon wouldn't even show up for another couple seasons. His storyline is being pushed forward (or at least being shown) when it wasn't shown in ASOS.

Yes but you know its bad when fans can predict exactly what will happen a year before it happens. Come on.

Edited April 8, 2013 by Frumpus

[ckal]

If you need to be told that someone being held captive in a dungeon for an extended period of time would make you physically weak and exhausted then the fault lies with you, not the writers. He's also chained and is able to fight for a good period of time before having essentially one hand and no stamina catches up to him.

I don't need to be told that because I have read the books. For the people who have not, the show puts zero emphasis at all on any of this.

That woman is Sibel Kikkeli and she is one of the finest young actresses in the world. She is from Germany and has won two Lolas which are the most prestigious award given for German film making.

If you are having problems with her, it is not because of her acting. She is doing an outstanding job. She has been written completely different from the books, so that is probably your issue. She is immensely talented.

Regardless of what it is, the character remains painfully unbearable. And if it is entirely on the shoulders of the show runners....well there it is again. No surprise they have done something that is ridiculous.