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[Book Spoilers] EP302 Discussion

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Jaime has been tied up and held captive for a long time. I don't think it's that unlikely. We saw Brienne defeat Loros last season so we know she is a good fighter.

Plus Jaime's hands were bound and Brienne was armored.

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Where is this nice Cat everyone is getting? I believe her moment of "weakness" was when she thought young Jon might die. She prayed for his life, but when his life was spared, she went back hating Ned's bastard. I think it's consistent, not everyone is completely evil or good in this story.

I don't think it was out of character. She only prayed for him because she felt guilty about wishing him dead in the first place.

I have a problem with her martyr complex. "it is all my fault for not loving the motherless child"

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What I find weird about the Rickard Karstark scene is... I totally buy this dialog, but what did Robb say to it? I don't know, it's not normal for someone to be told he made a huge mistake getting married to someone, and have him just shrug about it. Seemed odd to me that we didn't at least get something.

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Where is this nice Cat everyone is getting? I believe her moment of "weakness" was when she thought young Jon might die. She prayed for his life, but when his life was spared, she went back hating Ned's bastard. I think it's consistent, not everyone is completely evil or good in this story.

I'll go with this too. I don't believe if Catelyn was ignore Jon Snow if he were dying. I'd think she'd try to help him but that still wouldn't make her his mother in her eyes. She saw a young boy who was dying and she showed compassion for him. When it was done, she went back to treating him the way she always did.

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She told a 14-year old boy that he should've basically died instead of Bran. I would consider that especially mean even in that society.

When she was living in a fog of grief of deep, black depression. She had aged 20 years, she wasn't sleeping, she was barely eating. She was not, in fact, in her right mind. Holding it against her when she's basically had a total mental breakdown is... well, not being in your right mind.

But as I said, you'll see there are many people not in their right mind. ;)

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What I find weird about the Rickard Karstark scene is... I totally buy this dialog, but what did Robb say to it? I don't know, it's not normal for someone to be told he made a huge mistake getting married to someone, and have him just shrug about it. Seemed odd to me that we didn't at least get something.

when Karstark said that, I thought, "oh, this will be an interesting scene." then cuts to Cat and Talisa.

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I think she said that to seduce Joffrey.

I agree.

He's gave a great look--fascinated with the notion of anal--but as a form of humiliation with him.

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Even though there was a lot going on in this episode (something like 8 different plotlines at least), it didn't feel rushed. The writing for the non-book scenes (...or most of them) was a little clunky, but the episode moved at a good clip.

So the writers have officially introduced Shae being jealous of Sansa (or at least Tyrion commenting about her looks)...while also underlining Shae's protectiveness of Sansa and commitment to keeping her safe. So I don't know where the writers are going with that. It's setup, obviously, but given how different TV Shae is, I couldn't say for what.

I was expecting the QOT to be more...flamboyant, I guess? I liked her, but she seemed a bit subdued. I was expecting someone a little more outrageous, a little harsher, a little sharper and a little nastier.

Edited by Newstar

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The writers on the show have created a version of Margery that is both true to the books and original.

That's a wonderful way of putting it, IMO. I feel like this is exactly how Margaery would have been had we seen more of her, with either her POV or Joffrey's.

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When she was living in a fog of grief of deep, black depression. She had aged 20 years, she wasn't sleeping, she was barely eating. She was not, in fact, in her right mind. Holding it against her when she's basically had a total mental breakdown is... well, not being in your right mind.

But as I said, you'll see there are many people not in their right mind. ;)

Agreed, but now she's swallowing the grief of her other two sons and her father dead. She's not in her right mind which is why she's super-projecting her not so nice treatment of Jon to everything else that's happened.

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I said it in the "ratings" thread, but I'll say it here too.

I really don't like Osha staying with Bran instead of going with Ricken. Poor baby was sent off on his own to be raised by wolves.

I didn't interpret this scene as such. I just though Rickon was running off for a second, not to never come back.

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I said it in the "ratings" thread, but I'll say it here too.

I really don't like Osha staying with Bran instead of going with Ricken. Poor baby was sent off on his own to be raised by wolves.

That was just Ricken wandering off, not leaving. They wouldn't just let a little kid part ways with the group never to be seen again.

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Another book change: Robb and Catelyn don't know whether Bran and Rickon are dead, unlike in the books where they "knew." They're just missing and unaccounted for, which is...not great, admittedly, but very different from "confirmed dead."

Edited by Newstar

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What's with Robb and Cat not knowing that Bran and Rickon are "dead"? That's such a huge thing, everyone thinks they are dead.

theon killed the ravens at winterfell last season

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I didn't interpret this scene as such. I just though Rickon was running off for a second, not to never come back.

I hope that is true. It was "He'll be ok with the wolves" and then telling Summer to go on with him that made me think they had seperated.

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Yes...they've already resorted to Hodor pulling Bran in a cart rather than carrying him. Another season or two, and those two (Arya and Bran) are going to look like young adults, and not kids anymore.

they are growing way too fast. i wonder if it might become a problem.

next episode: Cersei does a speech saying that how much she loved Robert and how difficult was hide it

no, the cersei scene was just as wtf and happened in season 2 where cersei confides in tyrion that joff's crazy behavior is a punishment for her crazy behavior in his conception. she skirts around saying incest but the implications are crystal clear.

so both mothers feel they are being punished for failing to do something.

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