Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Ran

[No Spoilers] EP302 Discussion

Recommended Posts

Jojen saying Bran is the most important thing: that made me think that Bran would turn out to be key in saving the world from the White Walkers. No matter how important who the ruler on the Iron Throne is, the White Walkers are far far far more important than that. I was really really pleased with Jojen and Meera. Jojen looked all fey and spooky, very suitable for someone Bran met first in a magical dream. Meera was pretty and kick-arse. I loved* her riposte about "some men are worth protecting", given Osha's relationship with Bran.

Tyrion seemed very much defeated and flat compared to his usual self, but no wonder, given what he's been through. I'm glad he's human and not a caricature. John's and Mance's scene was another reminder that it's the Walkers that matter, and that all the dire squabbling in the South is ruinously inconsequential and horrifically ironic. Poor Sam, I thought someone was going to say "We need him with us so we can eat him."! I loved loved loved Cat's scene, where she admitted she was terribly wrong to hate John just for existing, but she just couldn't overcome her emotional jealousy with rationality. The Brotherhood Without Banners guys seemed supernatural in their tracking and weapons abilities. Incredibly impressive. I was disappointed Arya couldn't avoid getting her sword smacked out of her hand instantaneously, though. Even if it's realistic, muscle-wise, I wish she'd been able to water-dance a little to keep her sword a little longer. When she picked up her sword, I actually expected her to go for him again.

The whole Brotherhood Without Banners thing made me want to see a lot more of them. I'm really worried about the Hound showing up and outing Arya. Oh! And Margery Tyrell REALLY stepped up her game as a player. On hearing that Joffrey is a monster, she delicately works her way round to insinuating to Joff that she could be a companion monster, thrilled and energized by gore and death. It was masterful manipulation, so subtly but quickly worked up to.

Theon's torture was nasty, and I found it horribly abrupt. Ok, so he's pissed off all the Greyjoys and all their people. Why don't they stick a sword in him and bedone with the Greatly Despised Disappointment? I thought Theon was way overdoing the pain of being woken up with cold water, until I remembered what being in a cold, stone place is really like, and what being cold to the bone is really like. Adding ice-cold water on top of that would very likely send you into Shock. Given the poor actors being blizzarded on in Iceland, I wouldn't be surprised if poor Alfie Allen really was good and freezing by the time they threw a bucket of ice water on him. His muscular spasms were very convincing as they went on and on.

Jaime and Brienne got the best scene. I was so thrilled with the fight on the bridge I was left begging by Bolton (Roose Bolton's son? bastard? other?) and his men cutting it short. What an episode cliffhanger! ARGHH.*

*The highlighted stuff here is copypasta from a post I made in an Off-Topic forum dedicated to MMORPGs.

Edited by Aripyanfar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Was anyone else as distraught as I was when Rob and Cat discussed the "available option" of Bran and Rickon's possible survival of the burning of Winterfell?

Did I miss the part of the TV series where they learned they weren't actually charred?

(really pushing to remember this one!)

Me too ...I dont remember the bit where Bran and Rickon were revealed to be alive, im sure in the books up until Manderley and sending Stannis to find Rickon.... all still believed them to be dead? Edited by Arianne O

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No matter how important who the ruler on the Iron Throne is, the White Walkers are far far far more important than that.

True. That's easy to forget in all the chaos and other concerns. What was it one of the characters (Lord Commander Mormont?) said, if the White Walkers make it beyond the wall and go south, "everyone you've ever known will be dead."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jojen & Bran are meant to be, guys.

The only one thing that matters-- you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

that made me think that Bran would turn out to be key in saving the world from the White Walkers.

White walkers are killed by burning. Daenerys is coming. See a connection?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've seen a couple non-book readers misunderstanding who is torturing Theon, thinking the Ironborn have him. If you recall from S2, Robb's bannerman Roose Bolton sends "his bastard" to Winterfell from the Dreadfort (check the map, it's relatively close to Winterfell). Robb said all the Iron Islanders would be spared with the exception of Theon Greyjoy. Theon was of couse beseiged by attackers (remember the horn-blower). The Ironborn then turn him over to save their skin.

Now, the report via Bolton says that Winterfell was put to the torch and the Ironborn fled, no one has heard from Theon, and there is no sign of Bran & Rickon. But the X crucifix that Theon is attached to matches the "flayed man" sigil of House Bolton.

Bolton's Bastard has Theon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

White walkers are killed by burning. Daenerys is coming. See a connection?

A Song of ICE and FIRE? Oh yeah, I'd be all kinds of surprised if the dragons weren't used to beat the White Walkers, assuming that twisty tragedian GRRM has the White Walkers beaten. But I presume the WW army is going to be so powerful it's going to take a joint effort to beat them back into sleep, or extinction for all time. Being key doesn't necessarily mean you do the largest part of a job yourself. It might take dragons AND all the armies left in the South, AND all the magicians including Worg people. Making the WW extinct would be ideal, so maybe the dragons do the bulk of WW slaying, and Bran is key to their final death beyond sleep?

Who hasn't ever speculated by now that Daenarys might hook up with someone in the West, militarily and/or romantically, by the last season? My dream happy ending puts Daenerys and John Snow on the Iron Throne together, with Robb in the North. Although I like Arya even better than John, so Arya and Daenerys! But then there are three dragons, so that'd be awesome, if Arya and John got to be dragon riders. And of course I want Bran and Tyrion on the Little Council. Oh happy world. I'm scared I'm not going to get it. T.T

Edited by Aripyanfar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've seen a couple non-book readers misunderstanding who is torturing Theon, thinking the Ironborn have him. If you recall from S2, Robb's bannerman Roose Bolton sends "his bastard" to Winterfell from the Dreadfort (check the map, it's relatively close to Winterfell). Robb said all the Iron Islanders would be spared with the exception of Theon Greyjoy. Theon was of couse beseiged by attackers (remember the horn-blower). The Ironborn then turn him over to save their skin.

Now, the report via Bolton says that Winterfell was put to the torch and the Ironborn fled, no one has heard from Theon, and there is no sign of Bran & Rickon. But the X crucifix that Theon is attached to matches the "flayed man" sigil of House Bolton.

Bolton's Bastard has Theon.

That was what I was speculating without spelling it out for everyone.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That was what I was speculating without spelling it out for everyone.

It's starting to come together but understand there has been a lot to process here - now that I'm reading the first book and getting near to the point where Eddard loses his head, certain details are becoming much more clear.

The biggest problem for me is that now I'm starting to be really disgusted with book Sansa - she was so wrapped up in her girly dreams that she hung onto the idea of marrying Joffrey waa-a-a-a-ay too long after he started being the world's biggest spring-loaded shithead - i.e., the show of babyish cowardice in the fight with Arya by the river and the subsequent lies he told. Big red flag there but Sansa just dismissed it. Duh???

I have to keep remembering that TV Sansa now sees the danger and wants to accept the help LF is offering. Dangerous as he is, she seems to have no other options and man, she has got to get the heck outta Dodge, like NOW.

As for Theon, I can't help but feel sorry for the little boy he used to be, who was taken from his childhood home - probably not a warm, fuzzy place in itself, and transplanted among people to whom he was always the "less than" person - and he's now so messed up by the fact that he's never really had any kind of complete acceptance and love in his life, despite what his sister told him - it makes me sad for him and even though he acted like an absolute idiot at Winterfell, especially the murders he committed or ordered done, I still don't think he deserves to be tortured. Brought to trial and imprisoned for his crimes, yes, but not tortured. It was a relief to see that his sister sent someone to help him escape, which next week's previews seem to show him doing.

And yes, I made the connection between the bloody X banners (accurately deemed "gruesome" by Jaime Lannister) and the X rack he's tied to right now. Chilling stuff. Poor Theon, he just has had the worst lifelong luck, the kid can't seem to catch a break.

These characters are something else! GRRM is an awesome writer. Reading on...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And yes, I made the connection between the bloody X banners (accurately deemed "gruesome" by Jaime Lannister) and the X rack he's tied to right now. Chilling stuff. Poor Theon, he just has had the worst lifelong luck, the kid can't seem to catch a break.

He wasn't dealt the best hand, but he created a lot of his own misfortune. But I suppose once he was sent home, there was really no way he could come out from that situation looking like a winner. I blame Robb.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×