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BananaSpice

[Book Spoilers] Theon!

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Jon betrayed the wildlings and ygritte especially ... He's pretty much responsible for her death. He also is doing some questionable things as commander. Brienne might be leading Jaime to his death.

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Nope. Not a traitor at all. He is guilty of Sedition not Treachery.

1) Robb has no idea about the parentage of Joffrey. He is rebelling against Joffreys unjust acts and the Lannisters

2) No he should not have supported Stannis. Stannis is guilty of Treachery as was Renly. Tommen is next in line to the throne followed by Myrcella.

3) The North bent the knee to the Targaryens. The end of the Targaryens means they are not beholden to the oath of King Bran

I) He is in open rebellion with the Iron Throne to which the Starks of Winterfell are sworn to and the fact that he isnt doing it because Joffery isn't the true king DOES make him a traitor to the Iron Throne.

2) Supporting Stannis is a toss up but it was the "honorable" thing to do as Ned put it. This is an opinion and I cant do anything but express my own.

3) Yes that is the name they bent the knee to but the fact remains they swore fealty to the Iron Throne and who sits it. Ned Stark swore an oath to Robert which means if the North was sworn to the Targaryens it was then sworn to the Baratheons.

Points 1 and 3 i feel were selective information on your part. Just my argument, if you have a counter i would love to hear it as i may be in error myself.

I agree with almost everything else you wrote but had to nit pick those points =P

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Isn't it an unwritten law that a son would seek vengance for his fathers murder....hence all ties to Geoffrey would be severed....and Cat knew of geoffrey's illegitamacy when she tried to broker a peace with renly and stannis....I'm sure Robb got wind of this news as well....also I'm sure robb got stannis' letters that he sent out all over the country. I'd say the murder of his father is reason enough to go to war against Geoffrey....just like Ned did when the Targs killed his father and brother and supposedly kidnapped his sister

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I) He is in open rebellion with the Iron Throne to which the Starks of Winterfell are sworn to and the fact that he isnt doing it because Joffery isn't the true king DOES make him a traitor to the Iron Throne.

2) Supporting Stannis is a toss up but it was the "honorable" thing to do as Ned put it. This is an opinion and I cant do anything but express my own.

3) Yes that is the name they bent the knee to but the fact remains they swore fealty to the Iron Throne and who sits it. Ned Stark swore an oath to Robert which means if the North was sworn to the Targaryens it was then sworn to the Baratheons.

Points 1 and 3 i feel were selective information on your part. Just my argument, if you have a counter i would love to hear it as i may be in error myself.

I agree with almost everything else you wrote but had to nit pick those points =P

Considering how f*cked the succession of Robert was, an argument for treason can be made for almost anyone.

Fealty as I see it is a social contract, with responsibility on both sides. The unjust murder of the Warden of the North effectively broke that contract. Fair reign is implied. Otherwise nobody would ever bend the knee

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For the Theon fans, if you want to feel all the feelings, flip through this tumblr - http://greyjoywords.tumblr.com/

For non fans, read it anyway and learn stufffff!! ;)

This is a good tumblr, thanks for posting it. I forgot how genuinely sympathetic he was even before ADWD.

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I) He is in open rebellion with the Iron Throne to which the Starks of Winterfell are sworn to and the fact that he isnt doing it because Joffery isn't the true king DOES make him a traitor to the Iron Throne.

2) Supporting Stannis is a toss up but it was the "honorable" thing to do as Ned put it. This is an opinion and I cant do anything but express my own.

3) Yes that is the name they bent the knee to but the fact remains they swore fealty to the Iron Throne and who sits it. Ned Stark swore an oath to Robert which means if the North was sworn to the Targaryens it was then sworn to the Baratheons.

Points 1 and 3 i feel were selective information on your part. Just my argument, if you have a counter i would love to hear it as i may be in error myself.

I agree with almost everything else you wrote but had to nit pick those points =P

That's cool.

My point is that the Starks and Greyjoys are committing acts of sedition. Stannis and Renly were committing acts of treason (but in truth, the ones really guilty of treason are Cersei and Jamie).

I'm just taking umbrage at the claims that Robb's acts of treason are far worse than Theon's and this somehow makes him a far more evil person. Both of them are guilty of sedition. Theon is additionally guilty of treachery ('treachery' not 'treason'). Similarly, I take umbrage at the bugnutty claims that Robb is directly actively responsible for infanticide are not supported by either the text or the show - and results in depressing levels of face-palming from some people reading these boards.

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The whole point I am making is that Theon is a 'baddie'. But the brilliance of what GRRM has written is that there are few that are black or white and almost everyone is in the shade of grey zone. We are inside Theon's head so we are able to understand the forces the drive him to do what he did - to connect to him and like or even love him.

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