Jon Snow's Future - Theories old and new

[Gendels Children]

I thought that the "Someone Large and Hairy" was supposed to be Tormund, but Wun Wun works well enough for me.

But now seriously, Jon has a lot of friends over at the wall: Tormund and his men. They both outnumber and outpower the men of the NW. I mean, Bowen Marsh and all these guys are just stewards, builders and maybe some mediocre rangers. Tormund is "someone big and hairy" to begin with, and he has an army of 5000 crazed wildlings at his back.

I don't think the Wildlings are going to stand idly by when Jon's being murdered.

agreed, in ADWD Jon has 200 odd NW men wear their hoods up on their cloaks, while watching 'Mance' burn so that the wildlings wouldn't see just how many of them were green-boys cripples and grey beards. he wanted the wildling to still fear the NW. clearly Jon knew the NW stands no chance against the wildlings. not to mention not all the NWmen are on the side of the murderous stewards.. shiz will certainly go down. wether Jon is there or not I would still LOVE a POV chapter for when all the chaos hits.

[The Bear]

I disagree that being stabbed between the shoulderblades isn't (potentially) fatal. Your spinal cord is between your shoulderblades. Could be that third stab wound severed his spinal cord, hence not feeling anything else - he could be paralysed. That could be the catalyst that fully brings him into his warg abilities. I'm not saying I believe that it's what happened or anything, just that it's yet another thing that is possible.

I think the most likely outcome is that Mel will heal him (dead or alive) and he will end up being Azor Ahai and/or TPWWP

[Isaac Scranton]

Jon conceivably could survive, if Ghost intervenes, laying comatose and healing as his spirit wanders, either in his wolf or elsewhere. Bran's contribution could be to help guide Jon home, as Lord Brynden did for Bran. It's also very likely that Melisandre, as a POV character will do something to help him along his way, a la Thoros of Myr. If only death can pay for life, I'm sure she will find somebody to slaughter for the extra power. My worry is that Melisandre, when she does finally encounter Bran, Brynden and the Singers, will interpret them as "creatures of darkness" in her simplistic creed and target them as enemies rather than embrace them as the most important allies the South can have against the Others.

[Lady Blue Rose]

IMO Jon will come back, im not to clear on the details yet, but I know their wasn't all this build up of his character for nothing. I think Jon will be our main Hero. I think his end will come in the last book (sadly :crying:) he will do some grand selfless gesture to sacrifice him self for his family and for the realm. I was sure for a while that all the remaining starks will get back together after thinking more into the whole, in the winter the lone wolf dies but the pack survives thing, also Jojens dreams what the wolves will rise again, as well as the face the last book was originally going to be called "A Time For Wolves" reading into that what you will. but now im starting to think Jon might be the lone wolf that dies, I mean Ghost was excluded from the pack when they found the, could this be a foreboding omen, his family may all get back together aside from him. this is sad but im thinking GRRM wont be giving us a very happy ending especially for Jon Snow, who seems almost destined to have the burden of a dark sad fate crushing down on him. poor Jon

Yeah, it does seem like sometimes Jon is carrying the weight of the world on his shoulders- he would be the type to sacrifice himself to prove his honor or loyalty to his family or something.

I also felt that Sansa's wolf being killed could be representative of something along these lines, since the wolves seem to be intrinsically linked to the children's feelings and well being. All the children have a wolf into which they can warg and continue living once their human life is over, except for her. I felt like in a way this might have been a foretelling of her being separated from the pack or her life being cut short. Maybe that's just me.

[Ghost's Shadow]

Yes, in that way it's Sansa who is the lone wolf, not Arya.

Though perhaps that's more wishful thinking on my part, as I like Arya more than Sansa. There is that dream Jon had about sometimes looking for Arya, too, and the others from that dream are already dead.

Please not Arya. :(

[jarl the climber]

I tend to think that Mel will revive him with shadow magic. In other words she will use a spell similar to the one used on Khal Drogo. Another neat possibility is that Jon will be in Ghost after his body dies and Mel revives his body with fire. So we will have the the real Jon in Ghost and a psuedo fire zombie Jon being controled by Mel.

[DaveSnow House Stark]

I believe he will have to be born of ice somehow. Dany was born of fire because she walked out of the funeral pyre unscathed. Jon should then walk out of the ice cells unscathed and be born of ice. A song of fire and ice. Both reborn, one from each. Otherwise, why ever mention the ice cells in the first place? They may place him there thinking he is dead and not knowing what to do with him.

[Little and Less]

Loved your post Lady Arya's Song - I remember thinking about the Last Supper too when Jon left the Shield Hall. Well thought out. Maybe Mel can be seen as the "Mary Magdalene" to Jon.

From Wikipedia - "Mary Magdalene traveled with Jesus as one of his followers. She was present at Jesus' two most important moments: the crucifixion and the resurrection...The Gospel references describe her as a courageous servant leader, brave enough to stand by Jesus in his hours of suffering, death and beyond." (Mel did stay with Jon at the Wall instead of going with Stannis) "Mary was most prominent during Jesus' last days. When Jesus was crucified by the Romans, Mary Magdalene was there supporting him in his final terrifying moments and mourning his death. She stayed with him at the cross after the male disciples had fled....She was the first to realize that Jesus had risen and she is known as the first person to see Jesus after his Resurrection. She was there at the "beginning of a movement that was going to transform the West".

Funny also - but Mary Magdalene and Mel are also connected as both may have been prostitutes before they found religion.

Although I would hate this, I could see Mel being present when Jon is resurrected - but I can also see her saying that R'hllor "resurrected Jon" to gain people's favor to the Lord of Light, when in truth, Jon was resurrected/awaken from his coma by some other means. **Cough**Bran**Cough**

Or Jon will be resurrected using both Ice (Bran/BR) and Fire (Mel), I could see both forces unknowingly working together.

Too many possibilities

[OldGod]

Having read through the replies to my original post I've come up with a more detailed end to make the theory more plausible. First, here are the things I've changed my mind about:

• While I previously skimmed over it, I agree that Jon's death will cause all hell to break loose at the wall. Thinking more about it, I also agree that the remainder of the night's watch (no matter how well they planned the assassination) will ultimately be overwhelmed by the wildlings, lead by Tormund Giantsbane.
  
• Mel should have something to do with it (I didn't think of the christian parallels before but they are too compelling to ignore). The thing with this though is that Mary Magdalene may have stayed with Jesus when the others abandoned him and been the first to see him resurrected, but she didn't do the resurrecting.
  
• The method of resurrection which I proposed does not have enough to do with ice.
  

So here is my expanded version:

The wildlings defeat the night's watch and take the wall but not in time to save Jon. Jon's body is not burnt. Burning dead bodies would be standard procedure so this is a hurdle, but somehow this is avoided. Mel and Ghost (now featuring Jon's spirit) start hanging out together and because of Mel's ability to communicate with ghost, she has some level of communication with Jon. At this point Mel might look into her flames and finally realise that Jon, not Stannis, is Azor Ahai (maybe she sees the resurrection) and from this vision she decides that Jon must go north for his resurrection to occur. So Mel, Ghost, Jon's body and maybe an escort of wildlings go north and eventually make camp in the weirwood grove. Mel lights a fire (lots of smoke) and just as they are settling down, Jon's body rises as a wight*. Then Theon's head rolls. The wight becomes fixated with the trees, Ghost moves to its side. Bran performs the blood (salty) ritual and Jon is reborn from ice amongst smoke and salt.

*In my mind this would provide the ice from which Jon can be reborn, having him walk out of a glorified fridge just isn't that satisfying to me. Also the only reason dead people were ever put in there instead of being burnt straight up was because Jon felt like experimenting. I don't there's anyone left on the wall who'd feel the need to add another test subject.

Alternatively the fact that they're north of the wall and everything is frozen could be enough for him to be reborn from ice.

For me personally the smoke and salt part isn't as important since Dany has already met every requirement for Azor Ahai. So whether Jon is The Prince that was Promised or just another awesome dude, he doesn't need the smoke or salt or any stone dragons since that's just for Azor Ahai. But for those who believe that Jon could be Azor Ahai, I think the smoke and salt suggestion I included above should be sufficient for them to go on believing. Also the important thing for this theory is that Mel believes Jon is Azor Ahai and since she thinks that Azor Ahai and The Prince that was Promised are the same person, I think this still works.

Also just another reason why I think that the resurrection should be brought about by the old gods: Of all the POV characters, Jon is the most related to that religion, Ghost even looks like a weirwood.

[RobbOrJon]

Hi all, new to this forum. I would normally discuss the books with my friends but being abroad has left me missing my weekly dose of ASOIAF, hence me stumbling on this website.

As everyone, I'm particularly interested in the faith of Jon. I for one was pretty much hooked on the Mel-revives-Jon-Thoros-style-Theory; this post has opened my eyes to different possible futures.

So here's a silly one. I remember from when I was first reading the series, the notion of "the lone wolf perishes where the pack survives" particularly struck me. So how about Jon's body (only blood can pay for life) is used to revive Robb Stark?

This probably won't happen because:

- Robb was pretty much done with when he died, having lost some of hist most loyal men.

- He also turned out to be more driven by vengeance than by honour. Robb wasn't particularly keen on going north after Theon sacked Winterfell. In my view, this put him on par with the Brotherhood without Banners (yet with a considerably larger host): no place to call home.

- The Stark heir has not played any significant role since he was murdered, making him an unlikely victim to be resurrected; in contrast with Ned Stark, Benjen (him likely being Coldhands, technically makes him a dead man, no?), Mance Rayder (who was never dead), or, say, Elia of Dorne's legacy. Now THEY have been remembered.

So, Robb Stark won't be resurrected. Just wanted to put a new idea forward. We would have a true King of Winter, as Robb could both rally the wildlings (loyalty/gratefulness to Jon) and the traditional 'Northern' bannermen

[Mr Ser]

I'll hop on the bandwagon and say that he lives somehow, but isn't quite the same. He will lead the fight with the Others by either sticking to The Wall or taking over the North somehow with Stan the Man.

His fate? No idea. Lets just hope it isn't some cliche hero ending or getting with Dany or whatever. I think he'll be killed off by the end. We can predict all we want, but who knows what GRRM will pull.

Or maybe he'll become a wight and fight for the Others.

[IronEmmett]

This thread prompted some theories that I haven't thought before and I had to create an account to weigh in. I apologize in advance if I'm rehashing ideas, I've looked and haven't found much concerning some of these points.

First off, I don't think we can put too much faith in the certainty of Mel's prediction. Last time she warned Jon of the daggers in the dark it was right after she said admitted to herself being mortal and able to err regarding the Arya/Alys mix up. I just re-read that part and it struck me as GRRM's way of a hint.

Second off, I think Bran is going to play a big part in the outcome of Jon. I didn't pick up on his consciousness transferring to ghost, but that makes total sense. And I agree that Bran would be able to help him go back into his body.

Third off, I don't think he'll be resurrected via the Mel/the red god. I have no reason to back this up but what if his body comes back as a wight and his consciousness goes back to his body and be ends up like Cold Hands. That would definitely be some ice to Dany's fire.

[Frey family reunion]

My guess is that Jon warged into Ghost right before the fourth dagger thrust and Melisandre will resurrect him in flame. For a time at least Jon's soul will be literally broken in two.

I think a foreshadowing of this occurred during the blood ritual which resulted in the death of Daenery's son Rhaego.

Inside the tent the shapes were dancing, circling the brazier and the bloody bath, dark against the sandsilk, and some did not look human. She glimpsed the shadow of a great wolf, and another like a man wreathed in flames.

[Gendels Children]

there is also the theory that Jon will be resurrected my Lady Stoneheart, if the Great Northern Conspiracy as any truth to it. its possible LS is heading north right now to crown Jon, she arrives finding him dead, she gives her 'life' up for him. in a cheesy sort of way it would be kind of good, like she is trying to make amends for the harsh way she treated him his whole life, it may take her turning into a monster to see him as a mother... or something like that :P

[Lady Arya's Song]

Wow some great theories posted here. I just have no clue other than my first post about Jon's future. Lately while doing rereads of chapters I have discovered alot of parallels between characters in Essos and characters of the Night's Watch, Yunkai masters, Stannis and some of his main knights, Queen Selyse's knights at the Wall. Even a reread of the details about the fall of Astapore bring up associations with Moletown and the battles previously fought at the Wall. I keep rereading these details to see if George has slipped in those chapters clues regarding Jon's fate on the Wall. He normally does have parallel characters in the south of Westeros, the north and across the narrow sea. For an example of what I am speaking of. Notice the names the Windblown sellswords give to the Yunkai masters. The Perfumed Hero, Satin who combs scent in his beard, The ClankerLords, notice how often Asha in her irons clanks, The Beastmater, defintely reminds me of Ramsey Bolton and his men and dogs...etc.etc..the Tattered Prince is a huge interesting character who at times sounds like Stannis, Roose Bolton, and Mance Rayder. There is doublecrossing going on in Essos and there is for sure double crossing going on at the Wall and with Stannis outside of Winterfell.

The idea of Melisandre as Mary of Mag..was a new thought..kudos to the person who brought that up. I had never considered it..however, I have to say that I personally would hate it if Mel has anything to do with Jon's healing. I so prefer that the old gods, Val as an old god priestess helps Jon but hey that is my personal preference..and its worth nothing. I just dislike the whole red god burning people and her words about the Wildlings as a people being a doomed race..I hate all of her zealotry.

Anyways, Old Gods thanks for opening an intriguing thread and welcome to the forum.

I like Kissed -by-Fires idea of Lady Stoneheart somehow coming to a realization that Jon was never a threat to her children and somehow helping Jon and finally gaining a peaceful death. Have no clue how Martin could write that in..but I like the idea.

[stu1987]

I don't think Jon will be back exactly like he was before. I think for his 'death' to mean something then he will have to experience some negative after effects, maybe similar to Coldhands. Otherwise if he is brought back to life and is exactly as he was before, this might lessen the impact of character deaths in the series.

[Farian]

What if Melisandre binds Jon Snow and Ghost's lifes together , resulting in Jon's hair becoming white and his eyes becoming red ( that would be cool ).Rules of the magic is something along the lines if one of them dies other dies as well. Since he would finally become one with his direwolf this could mean killing the boy and letting the man be born.

[Gendels Children]

I don't think Jon will be back exactly like he was before. I think for his 'death' to mean something then he will have to experience some negative after effects, maybe similar to Coldhands. Otherwise if he is brought back to life and is exactly as he was before, this might lessen the impact of character deaths in the series.

yeah I tent to agree with this kind of theory. when Jon comes back he will certainly be different, not only will he no longer be the boy but the man, but IMO I think he may take a darker turn in his characters personality, he would be an undead force to be reckoned with. I have seen the idea been floating around this forum a few time that he could turn to the side of the Others, now im not totally convinced of this my self but it offers the room to pave some interesting ideas. I personally don't want Jon to change too much but a darker version of him could be interesting. and the idea above of him and Ghost being merged into one being and Jon taking of some of Ghosts features is pretty cool, im not sure how likely it is, but that would be awesome!

[Ghost's Shadow]

I think that means there's just a few people around who are desperate for *someone* to turn on the 'good guys' and become bad, really. :lol:

I hope he'll keep doing what needs to be done, whatever that is.

[Draxus]

I think Jon Snow is the Great Other and main antag of ASoIaF. He'll be leading the Others as the Second Night's King. It will be the most satisfying twist in the story as Jon will obviously be the most bad ass villain from any story ever.