[BOOK SPOILERS] Lady Talysa

[go joff go]

Haven't you ever heard of first impressions? Her first couple scenes where we meet her are what made me hate her to begin with. It's kind of hard to forget the vibe you get from someone after first being introduced to them. I wouldn't say she seduced Robb, and never have tried to say that, but she does in fact barge into his tent a couple times like she's allowed to do such things. This season? I agree she is a tiny bit less annoying, but still so because she takes up screen time that's better spent on Cat who's had hardly any, but I think it's a agree to disagree because the Lannister boys scene I thought she was a bitch. I know some people think she was being kind to them but I got the impression she was looking down on them. And tbh, I always got the impression she acted uppity since season two from the way she composed herself and the facial expressions the actress chose to make. But I think I'll just chalk that up to the prejudice 'highborns are normally snobby'.

Personally I find it annoying such a minor character gets more screen time than a pov character. Talisa's ass probably had about as much screen time as Cat did this season.

ETA; I don't think a lot of tv only viewers like Talisa either. From what I've read on this site it seems people's Unsullied friends don't care for her or Robb and their more interested in others story lines. Say what you may about how intelligent Robb looks in marrying Jeyne but you can't tell me tv only viewers don't think he's an idiot for marrying Talisa. I'm sure some will be sad for her death but just from who I know the general impression I've gotten is a lot of people don't care for her. But.. I'm sure seeing someone die will still be sad no matter how much you hate the character. (With the exception of Joffrey.)

There suppose to see him as a idiot for marrying her, not really different from seeing Ned as an idiot for his noble intentions. The reason people don't see that is b/c they see him through Cat's POV. But once we heard Bolton's side of the story, he didn't seem like such a great leader after all.

While I disagree with a lot of what King Tommen is saying I do agree with not really understanding why people are paiting book and show Jeyne as these wildly different characters. Except for Talisa's first scene she has basciallly been demure and clueless nurse (even if I think the clueless part is an act.) People just want it both ways. They want to capture the Robb arc that never really occured on page anyway, while omitting the Jeyne arc also never really happened. I agree that at times the pendulum has swung too far to focusing on the relationship, but if people are being honest they really wanted JEyne to pop in bat her eyes at Robb, Robb take her in a wild fit of lust, marry her, and then never see her again. Ya'll can argue that its the "depiction" of Jeyne that you don't like, but I don't believe it. Its book purism plain and simple.

[HopeForSpring]

I think Talisa will be a Dacey Mormont sub in this scene. They'll be dancing when the music stops. I think she has to die b/c she's pregnant and Jeyne Westerling wasn't, it seems. If she doesn't die, I think it lends credence to Jeyne Westerling was pregnant meme.

I don't know if I think we'll see a Robb Jr. though. It almost seems like the best thing if she lives is for Talisa to try to go on home to Volantis and not tell anyone who her Baby-Daddy is. Safer for them both. Live happily ever after in obscurity and avoid the Game of Thrones all together.

[Winter In My Heart]

While I disagree with a lot of what King Tommen is saying I do agree with not really understanding why people are paiting book and show Jeyne as these wildly different characters. Except for Talisa's first scene she has basciallly been demure and clueless nurse (even if I think the clueless part is an act.) People just want it both ways. They want to capture the Robb arc that never really occured on page anyway, while omitting the Jeyne arc also never really happened. I agree that at times the pendulum has swung too far to focusing on the relationship, but if people are being honest they really wanted JEyne to pop in bat her eyes at Robb, Robb take her in a wild fit of lust, marry her, and then never see her again. Ya'll can argue that its the "depiction" of Jeyne that you don't like, but I don't believe it. Its book purism plain and simple.

I find it very insulting that every time someone dislikes a change it is always said that its book purism. People not liking the Renly's peach thing, yeah that's a bit to far IMO. I like changes when they're good but this change just wasn't very good Talisa is more outspoken then Jeyne and I see her as more outgoing as well. Those two things are big personality differences. But book Jeyne I can't see barging into tents and questioning people every chance she gets, because women don't act like that in this time setting. (Granted there are a couple like Breenie and Dany, and Cersei but they're kind of exceptions because they have power and/or are warriors). This love story is way to modern and cliche for my taste but to say oh I'd rather a girl bat their lashes and Robb suddenly fall in love with them is about as ridiculous as it gets. If they hadn't made her so modern and annoying on top of cliche and it was actually good writing and a good change, I might have liked it.

So yes all of you tv apologists need to stop chalking up ever little nitpick as book purism. There's a lot of good changes but Talisa is just not one of them, at least as far as I'm concerned. D&D just aren't good writers when it comes to women that aren't 'badass' plain and simple. There's a difference between good adaptation and ones that aren't. For the most part the series is good but it does have it's flaws and to throw 'oh book purist' in people's faces for not liking Talisa? That's idiotic.

[Cersei of the Kingsguard]

definitely, they need to build something up for this episode. non-book readers don't even care about Robb.

thats not true i started reading after seson 2 (i dont read much and hate fantasy :P) and Robb was my favorite :) so yea after RW im kinda Arya/Jon/Tyrion

[silentwanderer]

I agree, I think Talisa should die also, not because I hate her, but I think it would just make the scene more powerful, ultimately.

I think Talisa should die because the death of a pregnant noble woman from Volantis should force the Free Cities to rise against the Lannisters.

The "enemy of my enemy" would put them immediately on Daenerys's side.

[lunadangelo]

I think Talisa should die because the death of a pregnant noble woman from Volantis should force the Free Cities to rise against the Lannisters.

The "enemy of my enemy" would put them immediately on Daenerys's side.

Interesting thought. Having said that, Daenarys is killing their kind of people e.g. the slave traders and thus destroying their way of life. Nonetheless, I like the notion that either way her death would have some repercussions.

[silentwanderer]

Remember: All the slaves of Volantis are still waiting for Daenerys on the books. The last thing they told Tyrion to tell her was to hurry up.

Not to mention, the slave owners and the slave traders are not necessarily the same thing, nor should be their reasons to join Daenerys's cause on the show.

[lunadangelo]

I do remember the conversation Tyrion had with the old Lady in Volantis and have often thought about how the support of the slaves from Volantis and particularly this Lady, who seems quite powerful and influential, may play out in the future.

Whilst I agree that there is a difference between slave owners and slave traders, both exploit slaves. I would suggest that from a slaves point of view the distinction between professions makes little if any difference and nor does it seem to Dany. If I recall correctly, Dany told the Unsullied to kill slave owners in Astapor (I may be wrong) . Similarly, both those owning slaves as well as those trading, one would imagine, depend on slaves for their livelihoods. So that both would equally loathe Dany's actions and fear her.

Now a possiblity would be that Talisa's parents are abolitionists, but if so why did she run away to Westoros.

As I said, I like your idea, just thinking about the possibilities.

PS: I can't remember the history of the tigers and the elephants. Talisa's last name is the same as one of the Triachs, I think. I will read up on it. That may be of some significance.

PS: Just checked, and it would appear that one of the Triachs is called Maegyr, also Talis's last name. he is a Tiger ...... and here is the link to him

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Malaquo

and one about tigers in general

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Triarch_of_Volantis#The_Tiger_party

Both would seem to suggest that if indeed Talisa is related, she comes from a family that strongly believes in slavery and has been practising it for a long time.

[HTN02]

check the intro at 0:40:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJgKy_0VDb4

Oona Chaplin has 2 tigers in front of her name.

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Malaquo_Maegyr

indicates he is of the tiger party. i would asume that the 2 tigers make a very fitting familycrest for them both.

[lunadangelo]

check the intro at 0:40:

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=nJgKy_0VDb4

Oona Chaplin has 2 tigers in front of her name.

I can't actually see that but if you are right It could imply all sort of things.

[Shadow on the Wall]

Interview with Oona Chaplin. If she's a spy, she's an INCREDIBLE liar.

From the interview: I reckon Talisa dies.

[Jon Icefyre]

I'd prefer it if Talysa dies with the rest of them other than Edmure and Blackfish, I just feel like her storyline has run its course at this point.......

[flinn]

I think Jeyne is pregnant. I think the mother made a move for power and didn't think it through. When she finds out that Jeyne is pregnant, she then has to protect her by saying she is not. Jeyne will have the baby (stay alive) and then the Westerlings have a bargaining chip.

[Tori Targaryen]

I think Talisa should die because the death of a pregnant noble woman from Volantis should force the Free Cities to rise against the Lannisters.

The "enemy of my enemy" would put them immediately on Daenerys's side.

Interesting idea

[Conchobar]

Maybe they will do something awful to her like have her raped before they kill her? I dunno if that would work at all on screen tbh, I think it would be better if she just died.

[ExBruinsFan]

I think Jeyne is pregnant. I think the mother made a move for power and didn't think it through. When she finds out that Jeyne is pregnant, she then has to protect her by saying she is not. Jeyne will have the baby (stay alive) and then the Westerlings have a bargaining chip.

I don't think Tywin would take a chance on her being pregnant - she dies.

[Conchobar]

I can't actually see that but if you are right It could imply all sort of things.

Like what? I am genuinely interested, because I haven't a clue myself :)

[lunadangelo]

You got me. Okay, so for instance IF Talisa survives and IF is the daughter of this Triach and ran away from her family, then she may be of value to Tywin. Not only could he get money for her but he could ransom her for the promise of support from Volantis against Dany. This could lead to a revolution in Volantis. Or as IF she dies it could lead Volantis to consider some kind of retribution. May be (although I realise this is very far fetched.) the Triachs of Volantis have some kind of pact with Tywin. Unfortunately my imagination is not all that.

In any case, I do think that having two fighting tigers in front of her name in the credits does have some kind of significance. What that may be is anybody's guess.

[ugashep]

check the intro at 0:40:

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=nJgKy_0VDb4

Oona Chaplin has 2 tigers in front of her name.

I just looked, I do think you are right.

[ugashep]

Interview with Oona Chaplin. If she's a spy, she's an INCREDIBLE liar.

Incredible liars do exist and they aren't nearly as rare as wargs in Westeros, she is an actress don't forget, from a family very famous for their chops.