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Mark Antony

[Book Spoilers] Joffrey and Ser Mandon Moore

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What's everyone's thoughts about the Tyrion/Cersei scene where we are pretty much straight up told that Joffrey was the one who ordered Ser Mandon to kill Tyrion during the Battle of the Blackwater? I kinda liked the theory that Littlefinger orchestrated it. :dunno:

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Well, actually, she didn't answer and Tyrion jumped to that conclusion. Like he said, only two can order them Cersei or Joffrey, she knew she didn't so it must have been Joffrey. Still could have been Littlefinger pulling the strings.

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I liked it. It totally changes the dynamic between siblings, though. Weird to see Cersei and Tyrion get along for real.

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Still could have been Littlefinger pulling the strings.

Touche and i wouldn't doubt him whispering in Joffreys ear, Interesting how in the same episode they show Littlefinger giving Ros to his "friend" Joffrey.

I also think he nudged Joffrey into having Ned executed lol maybe i just am giving LF to much credit and underestimating Joffrey.

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In the books....wanst it a foregone conclusion that it was Cersei....especially after the dreams to ashes scene and wanting Geoffrey to fight in the battle.....and ...shipping Mayrcella off to Dorne.....I think Cersei lets Tyrion conclude that it was Geoffrey as to take the blame off her

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This is the stand in for Tyrion figuring out that Joffrey hired the cutthroat to kill Bran and it gives Tyrion motive for the purple wedding.

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In the books, it was actually sort of ambiguous as to who ordered the attempt on Tyrion. Naturally, he suspected Cersei, but he never found a shred of proof that it was actually her. It's an enduring mystery. The scene in this episode actually brought some ambiguity back into it because the past episodes seemed to pin in unambiguously on Cersei.

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"I mean he could have poisoned me and no one would have been the wiser"..... Way to go Tyrion... just give them all the ideas they need....

Cersei pretty much disqualified the notion of having him killed by saying nothing would happen as long as their father was in town

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Well in the books she ordered the bastards killed, instead of Joff giving the order. So we were likely to believe she ordered the attack on Tyron.

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The reason it had to be Cersei is because Jeoffrey is too arrogant and foolish to believe Tyrion can be a threat to him.....thus he would never have him killed....Cercei had the whole whole turn your dreams to ashes scense with him and had her daughter shipped to Dorne.....it was definately a conclusion that it was Cersei who gave the order.

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"I mean he could have poisoned me and no one would have been the wiser"..... Way to go Tyrion... just give them all the ideas they need....

Gotta comment, this is funny considering how Joff croaks :-P

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Why would Cersei give ammo to Tyrion to use against her son? If she truly believes Tyrion wants power and to destroy her and the Lanister name, why basically arm him with that kind of information? She could have admitted to it and tried to apologize for it, or throw Littlefinger or Varys under the bus, etc. It could always be that both or all of them planned it together.

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Actually, this is the second time they do it. Back in Season 2, when the culling of Robert's bastards went down, Tyrion confronted Cersei and it went the exact same way: Cersei's silent and looking ashamed, and then Tyrion understands that means "Joff".

It's almost as if they're trying to make Cersei a more sympathetic character who's more of another victim of her son than a murderous psychopath of her own.

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In the books....wanst it a foregone conclusion that it was Cersei....especially after the dreams to ashes scene and wanting Geoffrey to fight in the battle.....and ...shipping Mayrcella off to Dorne.....I think Cersei lets Tyrion conclude that it was Geoffrey as to take the blame off her

It was never a forgone conclusion, although its a popular choice on the boards. Personally I always thought it was Joffrey as it fits the MO he established with Bran.

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Cersei and Tyrion get along way too well on the tv show (they had a similar scene like this in S2), but you know, I kind of like it.

It's almost as if they're trying to make Cersei a more sympathetic character who's more of another victim of her son than a murderous psychopath of her own.

You know she's like that in the books as well, right? Well, mostly.

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I thought it was a great scene, I loved that Cersei gave Tyrion credit for the Wildphyre trick. I love that Tyrion asked her if she ordered him killed and I loved the look she had, it seemed to me like she wanted to say something but she held her tongue.

I loved the fact that Tyrion realized that Jaime would probably kill Loras when he gets back and that Tyrion couldn't be helped by his big brother in his situation.

I also loved the scene because Tyrion doesn't love Sansa and he knows that Sansa will never love a Lannister because of what Joffrey did to her.

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