Jump to content

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

PipPayne

[Book Spoilers] A Gendry Development

Recommended Posts

I'm calling trailer Red Herring, like that scene at the Sept of the Seven that people "knew" was a reference to PW this season and ended up being just a tease. This is going to end up being some ritual part of his sacrifice (maybe Mel needs to sleep with him before burning him idk something I'm sure HBO asked to add) before Stannis barges in and stops her. No more shadow babies, it just doesn't make any sense and would completely disregard the moral decision Stannis has to make which is how the showrunners have described his arc since day 1.

Yeah, maybe I really hope they don't sleep together pesonally.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This will only further fuel my dad's belief that Gendry will sit on the IT with Arya at his side.

I am glad to see him have more to do though as I like Gendry and the actor who plays him.

I know , I like Joe Dempsie, and he was about to disappear for almost a total of 2 books worth of narrative, and when he comes back , he gone again!

I think D&D made the decision to really start trying to solve the problem of Too Many Characters (even if you kill off a dozen!). But then if the Davos story is followed , we get a Gendrey story? That will have to be an invention. But ... it could be fitted with Arya's , tho I can't see him getting into FM loop.

We already have the Osha-Rickon story , which by now should of had those characters utterly vanish!

But then George is so taken with Natalia Tena that he wants too bring back and have more Osha.

I don't know what D&D have in mind.

I think they have to do something with Rickon in the visual narrative, by the end of ADwD he probably already has a beard!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My thoughts: 1) Gendry replaces Edric 2) He'll never go back to the BwB, they sold him. 3) there are three possibilities for Gendry: a) Go to the Wall with Stannis (yeah to Jon-Stannis-Gendry scenes) B) With Davos to White Harbor c) My personal prediction: Gendry is going to wind up in the Vale where he is somehow taking over the role of Mya Stone (One of my predictions for tWoW was that Gendry and other surviving members of the BwB would accompany Brienne to the Vale in search of Sansa; if the show already places him there that would confirm my prediction). I am almost 100% sure that they won't send him to Essos, I never thought that Edric would play a large part in the story and I simply don't see how going east could further his and other storylines. One positive note about this confusing change: we'll probably see Hot Pie again a lot sooner than we had anticipated. He'll take Gendry's place at the Inn with the orphans.

Boy, I really like your personal prediction because (1) I would like to see Gendry safe and having at least a substantial place in the story line, and, (2) because I would really, really like to see unCat's influence in the BWB eroded (i.e., Brienne would not be killed and also that Jaime, accompanying her, would not be killed, either. I'd like to see them rescue Sansa [she's got to reconnect with the Hound - maybe she'll take a much needed retreat on the Quiet Island] . . . but then, I'm getting ahead of myself and actually talking about what I hope happens in TWOW.

See this was one of my chief complaints about how they made Melisandre into a much more sexual figure role for Stannis than in the books. In the books most everything was loosely implied and there was no 'seduction' of any sort nor was the sex a specific part of their relationship like it's being done in the show. It's one of the few changes from books to show that I really disagree with because I think it has diminished both Stannis and Melisandre's characters in different ways. Melisandre had a very strange mystical aura about her in the book, but in the show she seems more like a seductress and less like a powerful priestess. Seducing Gendry for more shadowbinding magic is just more fabricated sex drama that doesn't come anywhere close to the way GRRM wrote really good sex drama already. Why they try to outdo what's already been written is beyond me with this one. It falls short.

:agree: Plus, the very hint of an idea that Mel would have sex with Gendry is just pure :ack:, :ack:, and more :ack:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He could easily end up on the Wall as well... They'll need a blacksmith soon.

And I'm sure Jon Snow would love to know how his sister is doing.

AKA no, he's not going to the wall unless the writers have jumped the shark.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why make another shadow baby? What would be the point? The shadow was used to kill Renly and Penrose in the books. Are you suggesting Gendry is going to birth three shadow babies to kill Robb, Balon, and Joffrey?

No, I'm not suggesting that, the clip and show are. Why does Melisandre have to seduce Gendry to burn him alive? She doesn't. Why does she have to seduce him to leech his blood? She doesn't. Why does she have to seduce him to glamour him? She doesn't. Why does she have to seduce him to make a shadow baby? Because that's shadow baby making mechanics 101. I didn't come up with the rules.

Can you think of any other logical reason she needs to seduce him?

In the books, she wanted to sacrifice Edric to "awake a stone dragon." Literally, awaken a stone dragon. As in, the dragon statues in Dragonstone come to life. Shadow babies have literally nothing to do with Mel's objective regarding Edric in the novel.

Shadow babies didn't have anything to do with Edric in the novels because he was too young, Gendry doesn't have that problem does he?

I'm glad you read the books, so did I. I'm sorry you're blinded by the facts that are in them and can't wrap your head around the fact that the show doesn't have the same facts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, I'm not suggesting that, the clip and show are. Why does Melisandre have to seduce Gendry to burn him alive? She doesn't. Why does she have to seduce him to leech his blood? She doesn't. Why does she have to seduce him to glamour him? She doesn't. Why does she have to seduce him to make a shadow baby? Because that's shadow baby making mechanics 101. I didn't come up with the rules.

Can you think of any other logical reason she needs to seduce him?

Gratuitous sex and a complete misinterpretation/misrepresentation of Melisandre's character, for one.

Shadow babies didn't have anything to do with Edric in the novels because he was too young, Gendry doesn't have that problem does he?

I'm glad you read the books, so did I. I'm sorry you're blinded by the facts that are in them and can't wrap your head around the fact that the show doesn't have the same facts.

It has nothing to do with me and facts. So far, there is nothing to suggest that she is going to make shadow babies with Gendry. You brought that point up. I was strictly speaking of having sex with Gendry, which could lead to a shadow baby, but I don't think it will come to that. I just think they're oversexualizing Mel's character. Why have sex with Gendry? Because she can. Maybe she wants information from him, so she seduces him. "Men like to talk about other men when they're happy." Or maybe she's bored. Or maybe she thinks he's hot. Who knows? They've oversexualized her in the show, and I don't particularly care for it because it makes her character more one-dimensional and "generic."

You said that the only reason she'll seduce Gendry is to make shadow babies, not me. And, again, there is no real reason to make any more. The leeches plot would work fine without the sex and that is literally what I'm saying. The sex scene just feels like a weird change. It doesn't make any sense to have more shadow babies because of the logistics of sending them to kill the 3 kings wouldn't make any god damn sense considering they're on the other side of the continent.

You seem to think that the only reason Mel will have sex with Gendry is to make shadow babies. I don't think that's true, and that is why this change confuses me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It could be an attempt to make shadow babies which fails and get Mel angry while providing the audience a reason to start doubting her powers. This plus her jealousy from Thoros's powers could get to to move to an extreme and suggest burning him alive. Regardless, there will be no more shadow babies except the one that kills Talisa during the RW.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So Mel bangs Gendry, but doesn't get pregnant, so she decides to burn him? Could work, but why would Gendry fuck the woman who abducted her?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So Mel bangs Gendry, but doesn't get pregnant, so she decides to burn him? Could work, but why would Gendry fuck the woman who abducted her?

Yeah that's one of the biggest problems I have with it. Makes Gendry seem very knieve,since it doesn't look like rape from the commercial but more of a seduction.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Assuming Mel sleeps with Gendry (BIG ASSUMPTION IMO, I still think its a Red Herring something about the angle of the shot makes me doubt what its inferring) let's believe that her intentions arn't nefarious but rather she sees Gendry as a valuable servent to Stannis and the Lord of Light, she seduces him with her stories of how he has powerful kingly blood and something about destiny and bam...seems to parallel another certain Baratheon doesn't it. Also, if this season really is about Stannis redemption could be a powerful contrast between Gendry's submission to Mel's influence and Stannis finally overcoming it.

Edit: can't emphasis enough how much I hope they don't have Mel sleep with Gendry, but if they are going to do it this is how I think it will play

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah that's one of the biggest problems I have with it. Makes Gendry seem very knieve,since it doesn't look like rape from the commercial but more of a seduction.

I don't even think it's seduction. I stand by my guess that she will tell him what they need from him, he will say he's just a bastard, and she will talk to him about what Thoros said to her and how it made her realize that R'hllor can use anyone to do his will and it has intensified her desire to serve him faithfully. Then Stannis finds out from her that it's his nephew and he doesn't want to do it, leading to his line about how everyone must do their duty. He will say it in a conversation with Davos perhaps, when Davos says it's wrong. Davos frees Gendry.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Assuming Mel sleeps with Gendry (BIG ASSUMPTION IMO, I still think its a Red Herring something about the angle of the shot makes me doubt what its inferring) let's believe that her intentions arn't nefarious but rather she sees Gendry as a valuable servent to Stannis and the Lord of Light, she seduces him with her stories of how he has powerful kingly blood and something about destiny and bam...seems to parallel another certain Baratheon doesn't it. Also, if this season really is about Stannis redemption could be a powerful contrast between Gendry's submission to Mel's influence and Stannis finally overcoming it.

Edit: can't emphasis enough how much I hope they don't have Mel sleep with Gendry, but if they are going to do it this is how I think it will play

there are many reasons D&D might put them together like that

if m seduces g to do something, whether it is a shadow baby or something else, it will be in line with how the show is writing her character arc. gendry might not want to, but she has powers other than her sexual attractiveness to back her up.

i think the seeming nakedness is a red herring myself.

gendry is going to be a fabulous warrior like robert.

for those of you who think he is in his mid 20s, no way. gendry is in his late teens, i'm almost positive.

m is going to try to turn g's head about his importance. that is her way. i doubt he will buy it, but he is probably going to be forced to do something he really doesn't want whether it is sex with M or something else involving her.

they may be interrupted by stannis and/or davos

one thing i am sure of, gendry was always meant to play some sort of key role, albeit secondary.

those who are accusing us of shipping arya/gendry, it really is there in the books. i'm more concerned about what is happening to arya's soul through all of this. it may be that her feelings for gendry whatever they may be are one thing that bring her back from the brink.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The leeches plot would work fine without the sex and that is literally what I'm saying.

and that litterally makes no sense given how much trouble she had to go through to get Gendry to do a stupid magic trick with leeches.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think that on the show's arc it's still possible for Gendry to return to the bwb. When Beric dies for good and UnCat takes control we might see him as one of her lieutenants. I say this bc Cat like Gendry is only seen twice and briefly at that since the Red Wedding. They might feel the need to create storylines for her and could lump Gendry in with her and the brotherhood. This allows them to limit storylines and avoid having to create two new ones.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

and that litterally makes no sense given how much trouble she had to go through to get Gendry to do a stupid magic trick with leeches.

She doesn't want to do the trick with leeches. She wants to burn him. Stannis doesn't want to, and then they do the leeches because it's less severe. Then, later, they plan to burn him and Davos smuggles him out of Dragonstone.

AND WHAT THE HELL DOES ANY OF THIS HAVE TO DO WITH HAVING SEX WITH HIM?!

I can't even argue this anymore. I don't even know what point you're trying to prove.

If Gendry is taking the place of Edric, then Mel doesn't need to have sex with him in any context. Just because Gendry is older than Edric was doesn't mean he has to have sex with Mel.

Mel abducts/buys Gendry because he has king's blood from Robert. She wants to sacrifice him to the fire to awaken stone dragons. Stannis is like "lol no. leeches." Leeches happen. 3 kings die. Mel is like "LOL NEED MOAR DRAGONZZ!" and Stannis is like "aight, fine bitch. but you better be right or you're dead as dead." Then, Davos is like "lol no chance, let's bail kid." Gendry is saved.

The point being that Mel and Gendry sleeping together is an insult to both Mel and Gendry's characters because it makes no sense in any context.

You just keep talking about shadow babies for... no real reason that I can find tbh.

I think that on the show's arc it's still possible for Gendry to return to the bwb. When Beric dies for good and UnCat takes control we might see him as one of her lieutenants. I say this bc Cat like Gendry is only seen twice and briefly at that since the Red Wedding. They might feel the need to create storylines for her and could lump Gendry in with her and the brotherhood. This allows them to limit storylines and avoid having to create two new ones.

Nah, I don't think so. He got sold to some random witch by these guys who told them they were "brothers." I think he'll go to Essos.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You said that the only reason she'll seduce Gendry is to make shadow babies, not me. And, again, there is no real reason to make any more. The leeches plot would work fine without the sex

I don't understand why he wasn't leeched in the BWB cave... No need to have him hate on the brotherhood, or make them look like that money hungry.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Boy, I really like your personal prediction because (1) I would like to see Gendry safe and having at least a substantial place in the story line, and, (2) because I would really, really like to see unCat's influence in the BWB eroded (i.e., Brienne would not be killed and also that Jaime, accompanying her, would not be killed, either. I'd like to see them rescue Sansa [she's got to reconnect with the Hound - maybe she'll take a much needed retreat on the Quiet Island] . . . but then, I'm getting ahead of myself and actually talking about what I hope happens in TWOW.

I think that would erode a lot of Feast itself. Take away Cat from BWB and Brienne's chapters in Feast become very pointless.

I actually hope Jaime and Brienne both die at the hands of her and that Hound dies (for real).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't understand why he wasn't leeched in the BWB cave... No need to have him hate on the brotherhood, or make them look like that money hungry.

Because Mel doesn't want to leech him. She wants to burn him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Because Mel doesn't want to leech him. She wants to burn him.

I know, but for the sake of time/energy/plot confusion, they could have skipped that and gotten the blood for three kings.

Once she showed up with the cage, it made sense that they have more important use for him long enough, I can see either Essos or the Eyrie.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I actually take all this to mean that Gendry's role in the series isn't very important.

The show made the choice not to introduce the three children at Dragonstone - Edric Storm, Shireen and Devan - at the same time as they introduced Stannis and his court, presumably in an effort to keep the number of new castmembers down.

They now need a king's bastard that Mellisandre threatens to burn, because Davos needs to free him and give Stannis a speech about his royal obligations to get Stannis up to the Wall to defeat Mance.

If Gendry can replace Edric for that purpose, that suggests that whatever narrative purpose Gendry was serving in the books as smith for the BwB isn't relevant to any major plot point.

This.

Especially because Gendry surely wouldn't want to go back to the brotherhood after they sold him down the river?

I can only assume that once Davos rescues him instead of going across the narrow sea, he finds his way back to his AFFC plot point but without the connection the brotherhood, ie just looking after some orphans at the the inn?

With nothing on where Edric storm actually went its difficult to speculate if he'll affect the plot at all.

Is it possible Mel may burn him-instead of the Florent to get to the wall? Hmmm..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×