How would you rate episode 307?

[jeffklm]

5/10. I've already posted most of my problems with this episode in the nitpicking thread.

On a second thought, 4/10. It was that bad.

[Bran's Legs]

It's clear from reading the majority of these posts how profoundly warped Hollywood has manipulated the general public into thinking they need action, action, action, explosions, death, blah, blah, blah, yada, yada, yada, etc...to move a plot. The character building in this dialogue-driven episode was magnificent. Bravo to GRRM, period. This was one of the best episodes of Game of Thrones yet. Why? It made us love, hate but most importantly understand the characters. To begin with, It's unfair and, frankly, asinine to create your expectations for Game of Thrones based upon the novels of GRRM and then criticize the episodes because not enough happens. Plenty happened, people. Have you read the books? GRRM does not write action! He creates characters. He writes hundreds of thousands of words creating characters. The action is secondary to character creation. I repeat. The action is SECONDARY and ancillary to character creation. Why do you think GRRM refused to write "Rains of the Castamere?" If I have to spell it out, then you're a lost soul. This was an important episode in the character developments of protagonists Jon Snow (loyal/lover/layered/confused/boss), Jaime Lannister (growing noble by losing everything/future hand to the king (Which king? Who knows? Just a prediction), Tyrion Lannister (trapped/cornered/weak/moral), Theon Greyjoy (broken to be rebuilt) and Robb Stark (pitfall king/father); and antagonists Daenerys Targaryen (mad queen), Margaery Tyrell (evil, manipulative ho), Joffrey Lannister (pawn king), Tyrion Lannister (puppet master/hypocrite) and Ramsay Snow (super psycho/genius/boss/Jon Snow's antithetical adversary).

[a free shadow]

I was not dissapointed with the bear pit scene. Not when I was watching it. It only came to me afterwards on how much better it could have been :D

The best thing about Jaime and Brienne was them talking about the promise to send Arya and Sansa back to Catelyn.

I also actually liked Locke and his straightforward admission that gold is not as important to him as those little moments of power he gets. That line seemed more than about just him.

Catelyn has (almost) no words for a lot of episodes now, but the actress is so good, that even her silent presence on screen means much. Unlike Blackfish or Talisa. Blackfish, who is nothing like in the books, and Talisa, who is fussing about the hair of the king as if he were a child, and in front of the people.

A golden chain for Shae made me believe that we will have her story end somewhat like in the books. But at the same time it is not the same as in the books. If she really can buy a ship with that chain than why stay, if not truly out of love for Tyrion? Book Shae never had that opportunity or she would have used it :ninja:

Sansa continues to be written awfully this season as well. Not a sign of her armour, she seems less capable of a smart thought than in season 1.

Arya's escape was unbelievable :D And this group of people is really planning to take on twenty armed Lannister men.

Ygritte (one of my favorite characters in the books) bores me, Jon bores me. Orell was very quick to cut Ygritee loose and let her die last episode, given that he loves (?) her this episode.

Tywin and Joffrey's scene was good to a point where Tywin leveled up with him and offered for him to be carried in the meetings. But then... not so much.

It felt like the scene was written in just to please people who hate Joffrey. (They seem to tink that nothing goes as far in pleasing a viewer as nude things, rough jokes and Joffrey hate :D)

Anyway, Tywin proceeds to be awful to Joffrey and cut him off, while Joffrey is actually showing some sign of interest to be a part of things one way or another. Tywin just seems... not that competent and incapable of seizing an opportunity.

I gave it a 7.

[Kienn]

8, several really good scenes for a low action episode.

[Alboin]

+

Ygritte/Jon. Finally their relationship is smth more then "a spy hooking up with the enemy girl" James Bond cliche...

Emilia Clarke is never been so good as at this season. I actually started to wait for her scenes (!!! can't even believe myself)

Osha showing her wildling side. Fury and sadness.

Tywin/Joffrey little sparring. Both actors are so good... I just can't wait when they have a chance to unleash on each other.

Naked Talisa ( as much as I hate this invented character... she's gorgeous)

-

Tormund and Orell being way more interested in sex/relationships stuff then their raid.

Bear scene being told from Jaime's POV. Despite what's in the novel, I always wanted to see it through Brienne's eyes.

Rushed feeling of Arya's escape. Something has been missed there. Either some groundwork or development of Arya's attitude towards BwB or just the screen time...

Margaery being a sex expert. Even not taking in mind butterfly effect being caused to the book 4, all Tyrells as they are shown are starting to annoy way too much.

Edited May 13, 2013 by Alboin

[cbus20122]

Lots of bad reviews for this episode. I liked it a lot more than the last, my only major contention is that they spend more time on Shae than I care about.

I have it a 7, as I really liked the characterization that was provided (outside Shae) and they're really doing justice to Daenarys and Jon recently, which is a good thing since a lot of people complained about how they were handled prior to this.

The good

-Tormund showing his humorous side and talking about sex

• Daenarys actually acting like a queen, and being an overall badass
  
• Jon showing that he cares at least somewhat about the wildlings, and showing an intelligent likeable side
  
• Roose Bolton getting more time, and preluding to the RW and his betrayal
  
• Jamie and Pycell's conversation was awesome
  

The average

• Ramsay and Theon. I know most people hate how much time this has received, but to me, the Winterfell arc in Dance of Dragons is my favorite arc in the books, so I love seeing Ramsay being evil, even if it's a bit much at this point.
  
• The Bear Fight. It was short, but what WAS there was actually pretty good. I never realized people were so passionate about this part of the books, I never really cared about it that much to be honest.
  
• Tywin and Joffrey. It wasn't a bad discussion, but I don't feel like it served a whole lot of purpose outside possibly hyping Daenarys. I was expecting Joffrey to be a douche more than he was to be honest.
  

The Bad

• Shae. I get they're trying to set up some stuff in the next season, but they spend too much time on this storyline which is really unimportant in the grand scheme of things.
  
• Sansa's scenes. I don't think they're written terribly, but I every time I watch Sansa and Margaery this season, I feel like the girl playing Margaery is out-acting Sansa so much it ruins the scene. I don't feel the fear and sense of isolation that I should from the girl playing Sansa. I partly blame writing here, but I still don't think it's really been shown (at least in a believable way) how scared Sansa is of the politics going on in King's landing.
  

[Eggy]

Character driven show. I liked the episode, some good setups for next week.

Mediocre. A one.

Seriously. Some people are either trolls or joking.

Edited May 13, 2013 by Eggy

[Shadow on the Wall]

Yes, the opposite is true, and they were roundly praised in all corners for determining to make such a focused episode, last I recall. While, you know, getting rightfully pilloried for insisting on showing as much nudity as possible while they were at it, too.

It's David and Dan's show. When stuff is good, they deserve a good deal of the credit (as does GRRM for providing them the world). When it's bad, they deserve a good deal of the blame, as generally it's bad because of their choices rather than through any fault in the source material, I suppose. I think writers deserve the most praise when it comes down to dialog -- they may be told that they need a scene consisting of characters X, Y, and Z discusing topic A, B, and C, but it's the writer of the episode who actually decides how they go about it.

Agreed for the most part but that will change for Season 5 and onwards.

Not seen this episode yet but my expectations are now tempered. Disappointed that the bear scene isn't as epic as I thought it would be.

[DrRobotnik]

GRRM was rushed. He has a lot of monkeys on his back.

[rmholt]

David and Dan decide the order scenes go in, so that's largely their choice. We know for a fact that there has been some significant shuffling around in George's episode. His Eyrie scene has disappeared from this episode, while the bear pit is from David and Dan's episode. I suspect some other stuff may have been written by them as well. I assume this means some of GRRM's material has ended up in episode 8 instead.

As to the "foisting" thing, the other writers are all present at the outlining sessions and deeply involved, but GRRM isn't. He literally is given the outline that they have created for him without any direct input into the outlining process on his part, so I think it's fair to say that he has a unique position as a writer on the show, one where he is much more clearly not a part of the creative process than Benioff, Weiss, Cogman, and Taylor are.

All very interesting and helpful - thanks!

[rmholt]

How come Ygritte didn't know what fainting means, but she knew what silk is?

She was pulling his chain.

[The Drunkard]

Good

- Jaime and Qyburn.

- Jaime and Brienne.

- Tormund (he finally HAR'd).

- Most of Jon's stuff (I'm iffy on Orell).

Bad

- Theon's scene. Wanting the castration is fine, but the nudity wasn't done too well.

- Catelyn. Why is Jeyne more important than her again?

- Some of Sansa's lines seemed pretty poor. Not sure if it's the actors or the writers.

[Mr Hodor]

hard to believe that this was a martin episode

[Ser Skuall the Wolfheart]

Great episode! Rated 8.

Melisandre and Gendry PoV was a nice surprise. I don't recall that occurring in the books!

Dany is stepping up her game. Drogon's ferociousness made me jump!

Robb Stark confirmed to have a son!? Woah!

Poor Theon... he should have stayed soft :frown5:

"You know nothing, Jon Snow"

Seriously looking forward to these final episodes!!!

[Holdfast]

6/10

I'm now officially over the nude scenes this season. Theon's being tortured, we get it: far too much screen time has been spent on explaining just how bad his torture is at the expense of getting other characters right such as the Blackfish and Loras, and the storyline dvelopment for Bran which has been so weak. Also, the writing for Sansa this season has been woeful. Disappointed as I'd really looked forward to this episode, knowing GRRM had written it. I'd better stop right now.

On the positive side, Nicolas Coster-Waldau and Charles Dance continue to shine.

[John of Mowsley]

sadly, its probably the slowest and least eventful episode of this series (possible of the show). Even Tywin and Dany verbally battering their opposition ( two absolute pr*cks) it still couldn't save itself from feeling like filler for episode 8

[WardenOfTheNerds]

It's clear from reading the majority of these posts how profoundly warped Hollywood has manipulated the general public into thinking they need action, action, action, explosions, death, blah, blah, blah, yada, yada, yada, etc...to move a plot. The character building in this dialogue-driven episode was magnificent.

Please say you're trolling. The dialogues in this episodes were as bad as it can get. It's hard to believe after reading ASOIAF that this was GRRM. Gave it a 5, don't know why that high though.

[The Anti-Targ]

Would have been an 8, but minus a point for another boring, tiresome Theon scene. It's an amazing feat to make a scene with both nudity, dry humping and torture into a total bore. I swear it feels like Theon's had more screen time than anyone else to absolutely no point or purpose. It's as if the book is so devoid of decent material that they had to fill it with stupid Theon torture crap.

I ended up giving the episode a 7 because I'm feeling charitable to George, but it probably deserves a 6.

[Lord Snide]

7/10 too many dreary moments :

i am starting to find shae too annoying a character shae in the last ep where she refuses to leave the room after being requested by Tyrion to do so made me wonder but maybe there is something to the notion that gets aired

ie Tyrions character is being whitewashed.

Talisa says she is pregnant , but IS SHE????

Tywin v Joffrey was on the verge of being something great but it pulled back ... remember a few eps back when Tywin was having a chat with Cersei about Joffrey ... Cersei dared Tywin do something about Joffrey : the tone in Tywin's voice when he spits back " I will" seemed very interesting. Just what would he plan to do to get the little creep back in line ... maybe a severe lesson like a little dose of death?

Dialogue between Beric and Arya too arch, felt contrived. nice that she is now out of his orbit.

Discussion between Jaime and Quyburn and Jaime really good.

Sansa is my least favourite book major character and her scenes, generally, i can do without.

Sorry , y haveta show the destruction of Theon , yup it is unpleasant but this will make his eventual redemption down the track so much more dramatic.

Goodbye Osha Goodbye Rickon

I am just a little blinking candle in the firmament and GRRM is , in my estimation , a masterful story teller but he should cease his involvement in this series soon and not write any further eps and concentrate on the main game

and we know what that is dont we??? Then again he is free to do whatever he wants, i know.

Sigh only three more eps this season then the long wait begins again....

[TheDarkOne]

Fairly poor, I gave it a two. The scenes with Ramsey were outstanding but the rest of the episode dragged on forever. Very boring.