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[Book Spoilers] EP308 Discussion

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Well, it's highly suspect because this story is from yesterday, when Ros had already been dead for two weeks and filming had ended months ago, and it speaks about how an actress on the show has refused to do future topless scenes. I concede that it isn't impossible, but I dont think that was why she was written out of the show even if it is true.$

To Mafalda, sorry if it came off as petty. I'm not targeting you, it's just coincidence.

It could be Leda, she just had a baby and from her commentary on season 2 she has issues with herself, called herself horse-face. She could have read the books and knows about the Walk of Shame.

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Lena wasn't nude at all though, ever. Can't be her.

It has to be Esme Bianco. It can't be Emilia because she wasn't even nude in season 2. Can't be Carice, Natalie, or Oona because they weren't present at all in season 1 and obviously Carice is pretty comfortable with being nude and so is Oona.

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Does anyone else think that they might really go through with the Loras and Cersei wedding? I'm starting to realize it wouldn't really change the plot that much and would even give extra impetus for Jaime's resentment of Cersei as well as an even bigger reason for Cersei sending Loras to Dragonstone.

I have been wondering about this for some time now. The producers have shown that they don't mind changing the plot around a bit, and as far as I can remember Loras' plot, having them marry wouldn't be any larger of a change than the current Mel + Gendry plot (I'm sure that there are book purists that will say this is incorrect, but anyways). I honestly think it could go either way. Most book readers are assuming they won't be married because it doesn't happen in the books, but I wouldn't put it past them to go through with the wedding just to shock book readers.

So yeah, I think it's a possibility.

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She does that, yet he still doesn't trust her and is tense. She offers him wine, bathes him, gives him nice clothes. How long do you want this scene to be, 4 days so that she can build up a friendship with him? The quickest and most effective way of getting his guard down was to seduce him. The boy was just betrayed by people who he believed he could trust, for God's sake. Of course they like to show nudity -- because the viewers demand it as a majority. But this wasn't a case of inexplicable and tasteless nudity. You're in denial that your prejudice for anything being different from show to book causes you to come up with frivolous and poorly reasoned arguments.

My arguments, unlike yours, are not frivolous and poorly reasoned. I just don`t see the need for nudity. I like several changes from the books made for TV, not all of them, but some are rather fine by me. Don`t put me in the box of `book purists`, for I am not one of them. And my arguments are not based of what majority thinks, I have my own brain and am capable of having my individual opinion. Sometimes it`s alligned with majority, and sometimes it`s not. Pure and simple.

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Because poisoning the blood you want to be as perfect as possible for a ritual is a good idea?

Also, Mel getting Gendry's member hard is one way to quickly get a significant blood supply to the leech she places down there...

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will other countries have to wait 2 weeks too?

You think they're going to allow other countries to see the Red Wedding before the U.S.? Not bloody likely!

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Also, Mel getting Gendry's member hard is one way to quickly get a significant blood supply to the leech she places down there...

Also a lot of spells (voodoo/witchcraft/vampirism) have to do with sex and eroticism so it wouldn't surprise me at all--and it goes with the general occult theme around Melisandre--if she deemed blood from an engorged member (as I stated earlier) to have special powers, as it represents King Robert's virility. Similarly, certain witchcraft spells in the real world specifically involve menstrual blood. I totally bought it. And I'm in love with Carice van Houten anyway.

Edited by Khal Pono

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I have been wondering about this for some time now. The producers have shown that they don't mind changing the plot around a bit, and as far as I can remember Loras' plot, having them marry wouldn't be any larger of a change than the current Mel + Gendry plot (I'm sure that there are book purists that will say this is incorrect, but anyways). I honestly think it could go either way. Most book readers are assuming they won't be married because it doesn't happen in the books, but I wouldn't put it past them to go through with the wedding just to shock book readers.

So yeah, I think it's a possibility.

Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I realize it serves the ends of the show. Jaime will be devastated once he finds out his sister is married again, which could serve as the trigger for his growing resentment of her. And Cersei will be anxious to send Loras to his death in Dragonstone.

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I am not avoiding it. I think he was completely right about that. If any show gave us so many unneccessary nudity, it`s Spartacus. When you cut down battle scenes and sex scenes, well, the show could have much less episodes. Although I do admit that battle scenes are done grotesquely beautiful and I like them, but for the sake of artistical part fo the show or even its plot, half the dozen sex scenes could have been cut off. And I see the same thing in GoT every once and a while.

It still doesn't make sense to say that if you want to see nudity you'll watch Spartacus. How can someone not expect nudity from this show by now? That's why it wasn't just an nonconstructive, snide remark, it was downright nonsensical.

Me neither, but it seems that there is a great bunch of people who are so fond of those scenes that you could say that use these scene for masturbation (I am so sorry for stipulating the thread with discussion about it). The argument everyone here told me was that Carice Van Houten is hot, and none spoke of relevance of her nudity.

I couldn't care about if other people use those scenes for that even if I tried. I don't see how that can effect me.

I don't really see why someone that thinks it's fine that the scene contained her nudity would bring up the relevance of it. That's a point for those that have a problem with it, as I see it. You don't ever have to show any nudity or violence, you could just cut away every time. People do want to see such things though, as well as the rest.

One thing I can say for nudity is that I can appreciate it for going against the deeply rooted problem with it that our society has gotten through the plague of Christianity. It's a shame that we should still be so affected by something that was really just a reaction to the Roman Empire (the stance on sex and nudity, not Christianity itself).

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Ok, first off, why are you in here, if you truly haven't read the books? It's clearly marked book spoilers!

Liked the episode, the nudity doesn't bother me as much as some of the sex talk. The Titans bastard really let it fly, holy crap! IDK, I just had a hard time believing a Khaleesi would sit back and be disrespected like that. I know it shows she has restraint but still. And why would they meet the three best swordsman from a company of sellswords and not have the dragons there for protection? She could have easily been killed.

Poor Arya, she actually seemed happy, for the first time since season 1, after hearing where they were going.

Sansa/Tyrion wedding, eh, ok

Sam the Slayer, just fine, nice to see him not be a coward.

leaving the dragons out was probably a dollar decision, but i felt it was just wrong. on the other hand, dario would not have come off so sexy if he had to dodge dragons in dany's bedroom.

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I have been wondering about this for some time now. The producers have shown that they don't mind changing the plot around a bit, and as far as I can remember Loras' plot, having them marry wouldn't be any larger of a change than the current Mel + Gendry plot (I'm sure that there are book purists that will say this is incorrect, but anyways). I honestly think it could go either way. Most book readers are assuming they won't be married because it doesn't happen in the books, but I wouldn't put it past them to go through with the wedding just to shock book readers.

So yeah, I think it's a possibility.

But in the books Cersei was expected to remarry, too. However at the end Tywin had trouble forcing her, with that nasty crossbow bolt in his stomach (I hope they don't skip that!). So far the only change is the name of the man Cersei won't marry.

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Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I realize it serves the ends of the show. Jaime will be devastated once he finds out his sister is married again, which could serve as the trigger for his growing resentment of her. And Cersei will be anxious to send Loras to his death in Dragonstone.

That seems reasonable. I've seen people suggest Cersei will appoint Loras to the Kingsguard to avoid marrying him, but this creates a plothole because Loras is apparently the only heir to Highgarden in show canon. This is what initially made me think that they might just go through with the wedding and avoid the whole conflict.

ETA:

But in the books Cersei was expected to remarry, too. However at the end Tywin had trouble forcing her, with that nasty crossbow bolt in his stomach (I hope they don't skip that!). So far the only change is the name of the man Cersei won't marry.

Ah, yes, I did remember that Cersei was expected to remarry in the books, but I didn't recall how she eventually got out of it. Perhaps it will play out the same way, then. Maybe they'll just skip over Loras being appointed to the Kingsguard?

Forgive me, I'm currently rereading the books for the first time and don't recall too much. :P

Edited by Summerfell

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That seems reasonable. I've seen people suggest Cersei will appoint Loras to the Kingsguard to avoid marrying him, but this creates a plothole because Loras is apparently the only heir to Highgarden in show canon. This is what initially made me think that they might just go through with the wedding and avoid the whole conflict.

Would they really postpone the wedding that long? In order for Cersei to get Tommen to appoint Loras to the Kingsguard, this will have to occur after Tywin is dead, which is a long way off.

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But in the books Cersei was expected to remarry, too. However at the end Tywin had trouble forcing her, with that nasty crossbow bolt in his stomach (I hope they don't skip that!). So far the only change is the name of the man Cersei won't marry.

No, actually, there has already been a substantial change. In the books, the Tyrells simply refused to marry Cersei to Willas, and that was that. In the television series, not only have the Tyrells accepted the marriage, they were forced into it.

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Oh, my goodness, people, some of you give me a headache. Complaining that an HBO show includes nudity is like complaining that a soccer game includes grass or that a statue includes marble. Get over it. Consider it the price you pay for not having the plot determined by a focus group. (Yeah, the focus group decided Tyrion should be taller. Can you put Peter in heels?)

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I actually think this episode needed more nudity, come on HBO. The Mel scene should have been another ten minutes before she tied him up.

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there was NO NEED to distract him. It's just HBO wasting precious show minutes with sex and nudity.

:agree:

It made no sense. Some people (not me) complain when they throw in gratuitous sex scenes in brothels, but at least those scenes make sense, because those people have a reason for doing what they're doing.

And putting a leech on his dick? What was that about?

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I was disappointed they showed Stannis naming the three names with the leeches. I think it's going to be obvious to the part of the audience that pays attention what it means.

oh well.

But we also got that info in the books pre-RW didn't we?

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Loved this episode, I think that the sansa kneeling definitely had to be in there considering how much average viewers already dislike her. But I thought the QOT scene was a bit out of place and awkward. And i feel like loras marrying Cersei is kinda a throw away plot (at least to us bc D&D wouldnt make up plot lines with those two married). That and I imagine Cersei being more conniving than telling Margery that she'll kill her if she calls her sister again. I mean isn't the entire show about playing the game and acting like someone else with your true intentions clouded? By having her come out and say how she feels (in the middle of court no less) the writers made the scene feel very lazy. I loved everything that came after, especially Tyrion!

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I think the complaints are for the abuse of sex scenes in the series in general, not just that Gendry/Melisandre scene (which is not as gratuitous as people are saying). We're fed up, more or less.

I mean, if they spared us Ramsay's bitches for example last week, I'm sure the G/M scene wouldn't have provoked the same reactions.

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