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Sansa's attitude


MizasterJ

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LOL. The true nature of a person. I believe you are talking about Tyrion, a guy who murders Symon without any guilt, let Tymett go unpunished for murder, is OK with organising the burning alive of thousands to keep an illegitimate psychopath on the throne and broke Marillion's fingers gleefully because he was singing sarcastic songs about him. He is a scumbag.

Tyrion is one of the most genuine characters in the Series, and he is FAR from a "ScumBag". You forgot to mention how he would not tell on Sansa during his Trial, because she was his wife and he swore to protect her, or how he burned thousands of people alive, to save the PEOPLE of Kings Landing from being Sacked, Raped, and Killed, NOT to keep Joffrey on the Throne. Tyrion shows Honor and unlike most characters, doesn't shroud himself around lies, as much as the truth hurts him.
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I am a little frightened by this thread - if possible, the OP should turn their attention to the amazing Rereading Sansa threads put together by brash, MiLady, and numerous other amazing posters.

If I was treated as kindly and fair as Tyrion treats Sansa I would at least be humane. I dont expect Sansa to be in love with Tyrion but stop being such a stone.

The problem I have with Sansa is that she can't understand the difference between those that mean to treat her poorly and those that earnestly care and want to help. I know it's not an easy thing to determine, but Tyrion is very cut and dry/ straight forward/ easy to relate to.

I have very little wish to go into extensive detail in this response, so I am going to skip the middle and shuttle you straight to the end of the logic: Tyrion, in Sansa's eyes, is as much of a perpetrator as any of the other Lannisters. From Sansa's point of view, Tyrion's crime isn't so much being a Lannister - a careful reread will reveal that her revulsion for him is much more marked after their wedding - as the fact that he is the one who cloaked her in Lannister crimson. Whether Tyrion was a willing party or not, it does not change the fact that, in Sansa's eyes, he is the one to rob her of the one thing she had left at KL - her identity as a Stark and her power to choose not to be a Lannister. Although Tyrion, to his credit, did not force himself upon Sansa, the marriage itself was already a rape in her eyes - a rape of her identity.

The fact that Sansa was shallow enough to believe as much its consistent with a teenage character who regards herself as a natural beauty, or at the very least, as prettier than her husband, but in no way determines Tyrion's feelings for her or rather the lack thereof.

I agree that the situation was quite uncomfortable for Tyrion as well - from his point of view, he was basically ordered to act as an aggressor towards Sansa when he had no wish to do so. But to call Sansa shallow is to ignore a lot of her character growth up to this point and her real motivations for being unhappy in the marriage - remember she was quite happy when she thought she was going to marry Willas, who is a cripple, simply because she saw the marriage as returning security and some measure of family and agency to her life. The marriage to Tyrion essentially robbed her of that hope while simultaneously taking away the one thing she had left in KL - her identity as a non-Lannister.

To the OP: I don't see Sansa acting in a particularly inhumane way to Tyrion - she is cold and reserved, but that is a very reasonable expression to the extent of her pain and sense of isolation. Does she attempt to make the situation more bearable for him? No, but there is no reason for either Tyrion, or the reader, to expect that of her.

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You do understand that sexual desire isn't love, right? Tyrion doesn't "love" Sansa any more than he "loves" the last whore he slept with.

He never had and he never will.

So Tyrion is not in love with Sansa, which means he hates being married to her, which means he is as much a victim as Sansa is. Is that what you're trying to say?

He's as trapped as she is, more so in fact because Sansa would never be Tysha nor Tyrion would ever see her that way.

Just because Sansa is young enough to confuse arousal for attraction or sexual desire for actual love doesn't mean the readers are too.

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Tyrion is one of the most genuine characters in the Series, and he is FAR from a "ScumBag". You forgot to mention how he would not tell on Sansa during his Trial, because she was his wife and he swore to protect her, or how he burned thousands of people alive, to save the PEOPLE of Kings Landing from being Sacked, Raped, and Killed, NOT to keep Joffrey on the Throne. Tyrion shows Honor and unlike most characters, doesn't shroud himself around lies, as much as the truth hurts him.

The only reason that Stannis's army/navy is attempting to beseige/sack King's Landing is how Tyrion is holding it for Joffrey against Stannis. Thus, if Tyrion bent the knee to Stannis and opened the gates then Stannis would ensure the people of Kings Landing wouldn't be Sacked, Raped, and Killed.

He's as trapped as she is, more so in fact because Sansa would never be Tysha nor Tyrion would ever see her that way.

Just because Sansa is young enough to confuse arousal for attraction or sexual desire for actual love doesn't mean the readers are too.

Tyrion repeatedly thinks to himself during their marriage about how he wants her to love him back by mentioning how he wants to share her desires, sorrows, and joys. Furthermore, he thinks about he desires her physically a number of times from wanting to kiss her to all the way to wanting to bed her. Honestly, I don't see how you are getting this idea that it is only Sansa that thinks he loves her or wants her to love him. In how I don't even recall her ever thinking about him and love in any major context.

Moreover, Tyrion only resorts back to wanting Tysha and Tysha only after she has escaped his grasps and he finds out the truth about Tysha.

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He's as trapped as she is, more so in fact because Sansa would never be Tysha nor Tyrion would ever see her that way.

Just because Sansa is young enough to confuse arousal for attraction or sexual desire for actual love doesn't mean the readers are too.

Huh? At this point, Tyrion is more focused to Shae than Tysha, which comes to show that his past didn't stop him being attracted to other women. He's not in love with Sansa, true, nor does Sansa think he is. Lack of love was the least of their problems; with arranged marriage, love is luxury not prerequisite.

However, to say that Tyrion is as trapped as Sansa is unfair to both of them. Sansa had absolutely no choice in her marriage: she found out at the last minute and Cersei made it clear she would be dragged to the sept kicking and screaming if necessary. Tyrion had much better chance to actually refuse the match: he had much more power, allies, support, etc. If he really hated the idea, I dare say he's clever enough to find a way to get himself out of marrying Sansa.

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He's as trapped as she is, more so in fact because Sansa would never be Tysha nor Tyrion would ever see her that way.

Just because Sansa is young enough to confuse arousal for attraction or sexual desire for actual love doesn't mean the readers are too.

Tyrion repeatedly thinks to himself during their marriage about how he wants her to love him back by mentioning how he wants to share her desires, sorrows, and joys.

He wants her to want him back: he swore to never have sex with her unless she does.

Tyrion is just trying to 'share her sorrows' the same way Jayne Westerling shared Robb's back when his brothers 'died', not falling in love with her.

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He wants her to want him back: he swore to never have sex with her unless she does.

Tyrion is just trying to 'share her sorrows' the same way Jayne Westerling shared Robb's back when his brothers 'died', not falling in love with her.

You have not yet provided a single textual proof for your statements that Tyrion only wanted sex and didn't desire her in anyway. Instead, you keep repeating some mantra about how he doesn't want her love but only wants sex while ignoring actual textual proof disproving this assertion.

Additionally, you have gone off on some weird mantra about how it is only Sansa's "shallowness" that she believes that he loves her only because she is pretty. Yet, again you have provided nothing proving this argument at all besides you just repeating it.

Simply, your assertion that Tyrion didn't desire the marriage even more then Sansa is factually incorrect. As seen in how he freely agreed to the marriage without physical coercion while she was forced into under threat of physical coercion.

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In response to someone's earlier notion that Sansa has stockholm syndrome she does not. If you want to see a character with Stockholm read on to see what happens to Theon that is a true case of Stockholm Syndrome..

The issue isn't that Sansa has Stockholm Syndrome, as she obviously doesn't. However, considering the circumstances of her marriage to Tyrion, it would be very difficult for them to have a close relationship without painting 'Stockholm' all over it in big red letters. Hence my freakout that some people would consider such desirable, or despise Sansa for not opening up to The Cool Funny Dwarf from the word go.

Don't get me wrong, I like Tyrion... though I'm not sure I would want him as a friend. It's just that the whole idea of this marriage with 12-year-old hostage is incredibly creepy and I'm pretty sure that's intentional by author. Kudos to Tyrion for not going along with the flow and refraining from bedding her.

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In response to someone's earlier notion that Sansa has stockholm syndrome she does not. If you want to see a character with Stockholm read on to see what happens to Theon that is a true case of Stockholm Syndrome..

I've got to agree, Theon is the one true case of a character with Stockholm Syndrome

Reek doesn't even want to leave Ramsay because he could forget "his name"

in the saga.

He wants to be a Stark because he lost his identity during captivity, he takes over Winterfell because he perceives it as his despite he was never more than a hostage, and his rational mind has completely forgotten the fact that Ned would have beheaded him, without hesitation, should Balon Greyjoy have done what he did by a Storm of Swords.

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I I am up to page 793 in the book and in small amounts I am beginning to like Sansa just a tad. She is lerning to open her eyes and realize the world is not all pink roses, but I fear she is still vulnerable to be taken advantage of in the likes of LF. I find it interesting that Tywin is banking Sansa as rights to be now Lady of Winterfell and heir and her marriage to Tyrion will grant a son to win the North. The Lannisters will never have the North especially now for all what they did. Tywin is a fool to think if Sansa were to have a son the North would welcome Ned Stark's grandchild with open arms. He is a big fool in my opinion on that notion. Even if Sansa were to have a son the child would be a Lannister (innocent that may be), but would probably be reviled by the Northmen as being part of a family that tore apart the Starks and the North. The Lannisters see things in wanting power, but do not see things in a whole picture and the consequences of actions and inactions. Tyrion looks to the marriage after awhile as being able to have power through Winterfell and does not do much than try and be nice to Sansa. Tyrion could use his skills to get her out of KL and back home and he could have done so many things than just benice to her. I can understand Sansa's attitude towards Tyrion because his family has robbed her of her identity, freedom, family, home and what does Tyrion do? He complains about not bedding her and just be nice to her and sort of helps protect her from Joffrey. If Tyrion really wanted to help Sansa and have Sansa look at him differently than give her freedom... He does not because he has grown accustomed to being Lord of Winterfell in name. In my opinion no child with blood of a Lannister (even if the mother is a Stark) would be welcomed nor the North raise/rejoice for the child. The child would forever be a Lannister, so in my opinion Sansa's attitude is justified and using Tyrion as a scapegoat for all the wrong that has be done to her. I do not see Tyrion making much effort asie from being nice. I can also see Sansa is trying to still be the perfect lady...

I will say this that Sansa is suffering from emotional abuse (which in some cases is worse that physical abuse), because physical pain can heal and one learns to fight and the mindset abe to change. Yet emotional/psychological abuse if harder to heal from because one loses self confidence etc.. That I can say Sansa has endured under Joffrey, Cersei and the Kingsguard (ex: calling her stupid etc..). In this set a person could be vulnerable to becoming another's slave.

Be back with more later...

Side note: Tywin is a coward and a fool and could be scared. He thinks he has Sansa(last heir) and if geting rid of her brother makes her heir to Winterfell and he is a fool to think the North would praise/rise for the child of Sansa (if Tyrion were to get her with child). He thinks by finding a cheaper way to assasinate a king by scheming with the likes of Boltons/Freys would win favor and expects things will fall into place is wrong. I have more thoughts on that front and this thread later...

Sparing Sansa the gory details is not helping her any more than being nice to her.

Tyrion has benefitted from the marriage. He hates his father, but he still looks to his father for things and that is annoying.

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I I am up to page 793 in the book and in small amounts I am beginning to like Sansa just a tad. She is lerning to open her eyes and realize the world is not all pink roses, but I fear she is still vulnerable to be taken advantage of in the likes of LF. I find it interesting that Tywin is banking Sansa as rights to be now Lady of Winterfell and heir and her marriage to Tyrion will grant a son to win the North. The Lannisters will never have the North especially now for all what they did. Tywin is a fool to think if Sansa were to have a son the North would welcome Ned Stark's grandchild with open arms. He is a big fool in my opinion on that notion. Even if Sansa were to have a son the child would be a Lannister (innocent that may be), but would probably be reviled by the Northmen as being part of a family that tore apart the Starks and the North. The Lannisters see things in wanting power, but do not see things in a whole picture and the consequences of actions and inactions. Tyrion looks to the marriage after awhile as being able to have power through Winterfell and does not do much than try and be nice to Sansa. Tyrion could use his skills to get her out of KL and back home and he could have done so many things than just benice to her. I can understand Sansa's attitude towards Tyrion because his family has robbed her of her identity, freedom, family, home and what does Tyrion do? He complains about not bedding her and just be nice to her and sort of helps protect her from Joffrey. If Tyrion really wanted to help Sansa and have Sansa look at him differently than give her freedom... He does not because he has grown accustomed to being Lord of Winterfell in name. In my opinion no child with blood of a Lannister (even if the mother is a Stark) would be welcomed nor the North raise/rejoice for the child. The child would forever be a Lannister, so in my opinion Sansa's attitude is justified and using Tyrion as a scapegoat for all the wrong that has be done to her. I do not see Tyrion making much effort asie from being nice. I can also see Sansa is trying to still be the perfect lady...

I will say this that Sansa is suffering from emotional abuse (which in some cases is worse that physical abuse), because physical pain can heal and one learns to fight and the mindset abe to change. Yet emotional/psychological abuse if harder to heal from because one loses self confidence etc.. That I can say Sansa has endured under Joffrey, Cersei and the Kingsguard (ex: calling her stupid etc..). In this set a person could be vulnerable to becoming another's slave.

Be back with more later...

Side note: Tywin is a coward and a fool and could be scared. He thinks he has Sansa(last heir) and if geting rid of her brother akes her heir to Winterfell and he is a fool to think the North would praise/rise for the child of Sansa (if Tyrion were to get her with child). He thinks by finding a cheaper way to assasinate a king by scheming with the likes of Boltons/Freys would win favor and expects things will fall into place is wrong. I have more thoughts on that front and this thread later...

Sparing Sansa the gory details is not helping her any more than being nice to her.

Tyrion has benefitted from the marriage. He hates his father, but he still looks to his father for things and that is annoying.

cont...

His wife is still watched and Tyrion brings in Shae as a hand maid. How is that not disturbing and disrrepectful? It is not like Tyrion is wanting as he has Shae who is just as selfish as Tyrion.

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I think it's particularly frustrating as a reader because you get to see both sides of the wedding, you get to see Tyrion not wanting the marriage and you get to see Sansa not wanting the marriage. In the end it's really easy to judge the other based on which of them you like better so, of course, if you prefer Tyrion you're going to think that Sansa is a cold, mean bitch for this, even though she isn't. What she is is completely justified in her hatred for the Lannisters, including Tyrion. Sansa doesn't get the insight that we get into Tyrion's mind. She thinks that this is all a trap to get the Lannister's to control Winterfell (WHICH IT IS), she thinks that it's all a joke and that the Lannisters are just taking away more of her freedom. She has every right to hate Tyrion even if they are married. We know that he's not the same kind of asshole that every other Lannister is but she doesn't.

That all being said, she could have been nicer to him at some point in their marriage, but you can't really blame her for not wanting to. She's a broken teenage girl, no older than thirteen, and her dreams have been crushed, her family taken away. She literally thinks that she's the only one left since Ned, Catelyn, and Robb are dead and she thinks that Bran and Rickon and probably Arya are dead as well. The first thing she's going to do isn't jump into Tyrion's arms and look to him for comfort because whenever she sees Tyrion after their she's wedding she thinks of the fact that being held prisoner, the fact that she literally has no control over her life anymore.

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I think it's particularly frustrating as a reader because you get to see both sides of the wedding, you get to see Tyrion not wanting the marriage and you get to see Sansa not wanting the marriage. In the end it's really easy to judge the other based on which of them you like better...

Personally, I judge the characters based on other characters's behavior in the exact same situation in the books. Sadly for Sansa, the only character in the exact same situation as her was Tyrion, so she ends up looking bad because her attitude was worse than his.

He had every right to mistrust her because of of her role in Ned's beheading, despise her because of Catelyn role in his own imprisonment and treat her as badly as she treated him for Tyrion was wronged by the Starks as much as Sansa was wronged by the Lannisters, only the thing is: he didn't. She did.

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Personally, I judge the characters based on other characters's behavior in the exact same situation in the books. Sadly for Sansa, the only character in the exact same situation as her was Tyrion, so she ends up looking bad because her attitude was worse than his.

He had every right to mistrust her because of of her role in Ned's beheading, despise her because of Catelyn role in his own imprisonment and treat her as badly as she treated him for Tyrion was wronged by the Starks as much as Sansa was wronged by the Lannisters, only the thing is: he didn't. She did.

There's an enormous difference between Tyrion's situation and Sansa's situation. Brash or any of the lovely PtP-ers can do a much better job, but I'll do my best to break it down for you:

1. Choice

  • Sansa had very little if any agency over the situation - she could have chosen death, certainly, but there was very little else she could have done to "refuse" the marriage. The marriage was also a surprise to her, she did not know it was occurring until the day of
    • When the moonstones hung from Sansa’s ears and about her neck, the queen nodded. “Yes. The gods have been kind to you, Sansa. You are a lovely girl. It seems almost obscene to squander such sweet innocence on that gargoyle.”
      “What gargoyle?” Sansa did not understand. Did she mean Willas? How could she know? No one knew, but her and Margaery and the Queen of Thorns... oh, and Dontos, but he didn’t count.
      Cersei Lannister ignored the question. “The cloak,” she commanded, and the women brought it out: a long cloak of white velvet heavy with pearls. A fierce direwolf was embroidered upon it in silver thread. Sansa looked at it with sudden dread. “Your father’s colors,” said Cersei, as they fastened it about her neck with a slender silver chain.
      A maiden’s cloak. Sansa’s hand went to her throat. She would have torn the thing away if she had dared.
    • My claim, she thought, sickened. Dontos the Fool was not so foolish after all; he had seen the truth of it. Sansa backed away from the queen. “I won’t.” I’m to marry Willas, I’m to be the lady of Highgarden, please...
      “I understand your reluctance. Cry if you must. In your place, I would likely rip my hair out. He’s a loathsome little imp, no doubt of it, but marry him you shall.
      You can’t make me.
      Of course we can. You may come along quietly and say your vows as befits a lady, or you may struggle and scream and make a spectacle for the stableboys to titter over, but you will end up wedded and bedded all the same.”

    [*]Tyrion could have refused the marriage if he wanted to. He was also made aware of the marriage beforehand and - whether he was extremely happy about it or not - Tyrion was asked for his consent and gave it

    • Lord Tywin’s look was scornful. “Send her to Riverrun and her mother will match her with a Blackwood or a Mallister to shore up her son’s alliances along the Trident. Send her north, and she will be wed to some Manderly or Umber before the moon turns. Yet she is no less dangerous here at court, as this business with the Tyrells should prove. She must marry a Lannister, and soon.”
      “The man who weds Sansa Stark can claim Winterfell in her name,” his uncle Kevan put in. “Had that not occurred to you?”
      “If you will not have the girl, we shall give her to one of your cousins,” said his father. “Kevan, is Lancel strong enough to wed, do you think?”
      Ser Kevan hesitated. “If we bring the girl to his bedside, he could say the words... but to consummate, no... I would suggest one of the twins, but the Starks

2. Perception of their spouse

  • From Sansa's point of view, whether Tyrion is a big lion or a little lion, a kind lion or a cruel one - he is still a lion. Physical deformity and whoring reputation aside, Tyrion is a Lannister and belongs to the very family that murdered her father and are trying to destroy her brother and mother.
    • “My lady, this is no way to bring you to your wedding. I am sorry for that. And for making this so sudden, and so secret. My lord father felt it necessary, for reasons of state. Else I would have come to you sooner, as I wished.” He waddled closer. “You did not ask for this marriage, I know. No more than I did. If I had refused you, however, they would have wed you to my cousin Lancel. Perhaps you would prefer that. He is nearer your age, and fairer to look upon. If that is your wish, say so, and I will end this farce.”
      I don’t want any Lannister, she wanted to say.

    [*]You assert that Tyrion thinks that Sansa is treacherous because of her naivety in trusting Cersei (need I point out Ned made the same mistake and much more grievously). These are his actual thoughts regarding the match: Sansa is too young, I have Shae, Sansa won't want me, Sansa is a pretty girl who loves songs. Nowhere does he ever reflect that Sansa is an untrustworthy or dishonest person - instead his thoughts focus on "I'd rather have a wife who wants me in her bed"

    • Sansa Stark, he mused. Soft-spoken sweet-smelling Sansa, who loved silks, songs, chivalry and tall gallant knights with handsome faces. He felt as though he was back on the bridge of boats, the deck shifting beneath his feet.
    • “Then open your eyes. The Stark girl is young, nubile, tractable, of the highest birth, and still a maid. She is not uncomely. Why would you hesitate?”
      Why indeed? “A quirk of mine. Strange to say, I would prefer a wife who wants me in her bed.”

3. Perception of the marriage

  • The marriage to Tyrion means a few things to Sansa. Most notably, it means that the Lannisters have effectively "raped" her identity as a Stark and daughter of Winterfell. It is a final act of aggression and robbery that Sansa can neither accept nor forgive. By marrying her to Tyrion (or any Lannister, for Sansa it was irrelevant which Lannister it was) they forced Sansa to become one of her enemies. This action has certain overtones of what is commonly known as "genocide by rape" in which certain cultures will rape the women of those they wish to eliminate in order to forcibly take ownership of any potential offspring and prevent the women from providing descendants for the other ethnicity. It also means the destruction of the light at the end of the tunnel that Sansa saw in the Tyrell offer of Willas. It's important to note the distinction between the Tyrells and Lannisters in this scenario. While it is true that both houses are fighting a war against Robb, the Tyrells are not responsible for beheading Ned, nor are the responsible for Sansa's abuse at the hands of Joffrey. Rather, with the arrival of Margaery, Sansa saw a marked improvement in her life at the RK - she no longer needed to be affianced to Joffrey, and Margaery's presence provided some measure of female companionship. More importantly, by marrying Willas Sansa would be free of the Red Keep. The Tyrells (though motivated by their own interests) were effectively offering Sansa a safe, easy escape route. The marriage to Tyrion not only destroyed this dream of freedom, but also condemned Sansa to a life of imprisonment with the Lannisters. It is understandable then that Sansa would look upon the marriage with anger and distaste.
  • For Tyrion, the marriage was more along the lines of a distasteful duty he had to take part in for his family. Distasteful why? Not because he found Sansa repulsive, but because Tyrion's own natural morality (to his credit) recoiled from inflicting the marriage on Sansa. Tyrion was reluctant to marry Sansa because he did not want to be his father's instrument of cruelty to the girl and because he knew it would hurt Shae. While this is certainly an uncomfortable situation for Tyrion, it is hardly an antipathy towards the marriage of the same scale as Sansa is experiencing.

I hope this puts the differences in their situations in much better perspective for you.

Finally, to qualify Cat's abduction of Tyrion and the subsequent trial as something that is on the same scale as the beheading of Sansa's father and her abuse/imprisonment in the RK is to grossly misread and misrepresent the two situations. In fact, even Tyrion understands that Cat did what she did out of love and that she was not intentionally persecuting him.

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There's an enormous difference between Tyrion's situation and Sansa's situation.

No, there isn't: Catelyn and Lysa treated Tyrion exactly like Cersei treated Sansa and Tyrion had every right not to trust Sansa after Ned since he didn't know what really happened, so I can't justify her when it's obvious that the better person was someone else.

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Personally, I judge the characters based on other characters's behavior in the exact same situation in the books. Sadly for Sansa, the only character in the exact same situation as her was Tyrion, so she ends up looking bad because her attitude was worse than his.

He had every right to mistrust her because of of her role in Ned's beheading, despise her because of Catelyn role in his own imprisonment and treat her as badly as she treated him for Tyrion was wronged by the Starks as much as Sansa was wronged by the Lannisters, only the thing is: he didn't. She did.

No, there isn't: Catelyn and Lysa treated Tyrion exactly like Cersei treated Sansa and Tyrion had every right not to trust Sansa after Ned since he didn't know what really happened, so I can't justify her when it's obvious that the better person was someone else.

Their situation was not the same as Tyrion chose the marriage because he desired Sansa and Winterfell, while Sansa was forced into the marriage under threat of receiving punishment if she declined.

Moreover, the Starks treatment of Tyrion is no where comparable to the Lannister/"Baratheon" treatment of Sansa. At worst Tyrion found himself arrested by Catelyn because she was informed that he had attempted to assassinate her son. Other then that they generally treated him some level of hospitality with Catelyn even defending him from Lysa's mistreatment.

Meanwhile, the Lannister/"Baratheon"s have attempted to murder Bran, again attempted to murder Bran, attacked her sister, killed her direwolf, killed her father's entire household, likely in her mind killed her sister, killed her father, repeatedly physically beaten her, repeatedly emotionally abused her, repeatedly verbally abused her, sexually abused her, forced her into a forced marriage against her will, killed her mother, and killed her older brother. All of this only occurring either to further their power or just for their own sick amusement thus holding no noble reasoning to it.

Finally, Sansa hardly mistreated Tyrion in any actual matter. Simply, at worst she was emotionally closed off to him and refused to have sex with him. Neither of which does she owe Tyrion as she has sole autonomy of her body(especially sexually) and emotions. Hell, she probably would have preferred if Tyrion left her alone rather then his making quibbles all the time at her in his lame attempts to build a relationship.

Tyrion wasn't the better person in how he was one of the instigators of the farce of the marriage because of his own ambitions, while Sansa was completely the victim in the relationship.

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I think it's particularly frustrating as a reader because you get to see both sides of the wedding, you get to see Tyrion not wanting the marriage and you get to see Sansa not wanting the marriage. In the end it's really easy to judge the other based on which of them you like better so, of course, if you prefer Tyrion you're going to think that Sansa is a cold, mean bitch for this, even though she isn't. What she is is completely justified in her hatred for the Lannisters, including Tyrion. Sansa doesn't get the insight that we get into Tyrion's mind. She thinks that this is all a trap to get the Lannister's to control Winterfell (WHICH IT IS), she thinks that it's all a joke and that the Lannisters are just taking away more of her freedom. She has every right to hate Tyrion even if they are married. We know that he's not the same kind of asshole that every other Lannister is but she doesn't.

That all being said, she could have been nicer to him at some point in their marriage, but you can't really blame her for not wanting to. She's a broken teenage girl, no older than thirteen, and her dreams have been crushed, her family taken away. She literally thinks that she's the only one left since Ned, Catelyn, and Robb are dead and she thinks that Bran and Rickon and probably Arya are dead as well. The first thing she's going to do isn't jump into Tyrion's arms and look to him for comfort because whenever she sees Tyrion after their she's wedding she thinks of the fact that being held prisoner, the fact that she literally has no control over her life anymore.

Very well stated. I agree she is held prisoner and has less control and of course reminded everyday about what the Lannisters have done to her and her family. I will give Tyrion credit and that he did not bed her until she wanted, but it went away when he was flabbergasted at the thought when she stated she would never ask/want to. Then he goes on mumbling/complaining and did not seem to grasp her side of the situation at times.

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It's also not the same because Tyrion isn't a prisoner in Kings landing for most of SoS. Sansa has more reason to not trust Tyrion than Tyrion has to not trust Sansa.

What I'm saying is that as readers we know that Tyrion doesn't want to hurt Sansa. We know that he feels bad about the wedding, he still thinks of her as a child and he doesn't want to hurt her.

Then you look at it from Sansa's point of view and suddenly Tyrion is this monster, she doesn't know that Tyrion doesn't want to hurt her. All that she really knows about Tyrion was that he saved her when Joffrey was having her beaten, that's the only instance of niceness that Tyrion had shown her at that point in the series. Other than that all she's hears about him is awful, everyone thinks that he's the worst of the Lannisters and no one likes him. It's not Sansa's fault that she doesn't trust him and you can't really expect a thirteen year old girl to be hopping up and down in excitement over marrying Tyrion Lannister.

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What I'm saying is that as readers we know that Tyrion doesn't want to hurt Sansa. We know that he feels bad about the wedding, he still thinks of her as a child and he doesn't want to hurt her.

Yet as readers we are also well aware that Tyrion is wary about his wife, that she is Catelyn's daughter and Catelyn imprisoned and almost killed him for a crime Tyrion didn't commit.

What does Tyrion when Sansa, apparentely, frames him for a crime he didn't commit? He takes the heat for Joffrey's murder, puts his faith in a trial by combat and doesn't allow himself a single stray thought against Sansa despite the fact she flee the scene of the crime.

Not to mention the fact that, as readers, we actually know how mistaken he was for she actually carried the poison in her hairnet.

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