Hodor = Great Other

[KingMaekarWasHere]

Hodor is a descendant of Dunk, so to me it would be very sad if he was the great other. But then again Brienne is a descendant of Dunk (confirmed), and I have a hunch that the Glegane brothers were too. So Dunk sure did leave "variety" in his legacy, but then again we are not our ancestors and our descendants aren't us either. After all the Brightflame was a grandson of Daeron the Good, and look at what a difference you had there.

[Ludd]

Their are so many topics it is hard to find the right one

So do not be so abusive to newbies

Perhaps less closing down of threads and a little more organization would be good

[J. Stargaryen]

Rather dickish, ain't it?

Out of this whole thread, that is what strikes you as "dickish"?

Their are so many topics it is hard to find the right one

So do not be so abusive to newbies

Perhaps less closing down of threads and a little more organization would be good

But remember, the OP is not new around here, and he knows as much as anybody when it comes to R+L=J and ASoIaF. Just ask him.

Nice attempt at trolling but I'm not new. I know as much about RLJ, and ASoIaF in general, as anyone else around here. You're narrow minded but I don't hold that against you.

[Rhymes with Weak]

Out of this whole thread, that is what strikes you as "dickish"?

Yeah

[IamMe90]

Out of this whole thread, that is what strikes you as "dickish"?

But remember, the OP is not new around here, and he knows as much as anybody when it comes to R+L=J and ASoIaF. Just ask him.

Well, yeah. You came in here and told the OP that he was "way off," then called his views "nonsense" and "superfluous" because you disagreed with them. If you don't want to appear unwelcoming to new users, then you could drop the condescension.

[J. Stargaryen]

Yeah

Frankly, I have a hard time believing that. And, after 1,500+ posts with 0 warning points, I think I have a decent handle on how to conduct myself around here.

Well, yeah. You came in here and told the OP that he was "way off," then called his views "nonsense" and "superfluous" because you disagreed with them. If you don't want to appear unwelcoming to new users, then you could drop the condescension.

Uh, check again. I told him he was "Not even close." on one particular statement that had nothing to do with his theory. I then complimented him by saying he was on to something with his OP, tried to be helpful by linking him to probably the most in depth version of this idea, and finished by welcoming him to the forums.

Wow, I'm such an ass. :rolleyes:

[Rhymes with Weak]

Not even close. What you're really telling us with a statement like that is you don't know much about R+L=J. And if you don't know much about R+L=J, you probably don't know that much about ASoIaF. Which is fine, btw. You don't have to be an expert to participate here, or add something of value. Otoh, waving your ignorance around like a flaming sword isn't the best way to get people to take you seriously.

Rather dickish, ain't it?

[IamMe90]

Frankly, I have a hard time believing that. And, after 1,500+ posts with 0 warning points, I think I have a decent handle on how to conduct myself around here.

Uh, check again. I told him he was "Not even close." on one particular statement that had nothing to do with his theory. I then complimented him by saying he was on to something with his OP, tried to be helpful by linking him to probably the most in depth version of this idea, and finished by welcoming him to the forums.

Wow, I'm such an ass. :rolleyes:

Nope, you told him that what he was really telling us is that he doesn't know anything about one of the most popular fan theories on the forums, and that because of that he probably doesn't know much about ASoIaF as a whole, and that that's OKAY, but he shouldn't "wave his ignorance around like a flaming sword." And THEN you kindly welcomed him to the forums.

but if you really don't see the condescension in that, then... well, there's nothing to talk about.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Looking back on the thread, I do want to say, maybe I was wrong about saying the OP just wanted to argue, rereading, it is hard to tell where the tone went wrong first in here and on whose part.

I do apologize if I read something wrong, on anyone, especially the OP at this point, as I perhaps missed where it seemed it got touchy in here at first.

Sometimes, readers of a post or a book put tone into things that aren't there, or weren't intended, and all can make mistakes at times. It's a shame we can never know all the time exactly how something is meant.

I do wish I had thought more first, before I typed. I did mean what I said about how it seems, often, newbies such as myself (although it hasn't happened to me, per se) are directed to read.........what, years of thread before we post something, I think that's unreasonable, and sometimes, a fan old or new, just wants to talk about something they enjoy. That's all, I'd hope we can all give each other a fair chance.

Again, I apologize to the OP, too.

[J. Stargaryen]

Rather dickish, ain't it?

No. And if you think that any form of criticism is "dickish" then you're being over sensitive. Selectively so, I might add.

Btw, for the sake of context, the "Not even close." comment was in reply to him saying that his idea makes as much sense as R+L=J. It had nothing to do with the OP's theory. Let's take a look:

How exactly alike do they have to be for you? Sheesh, you want GRRM to copy the Prose Edda word for word?

There's the names being the same, the cold/dark aspects, that the name shan't be spoken and Hodor's name is not used in any other way. It makes as much sense as all the Rhaegar and Lyanna equal Jon talk, which I mostly agree with although it is largely speculative.

You're dismissive of what I posted because, you didn't think of it? Cause it doesn't fit the narrative you're expecting?

Also I don't know why you summarized the Loki/Hod/Baldur thing for me, I'm the one that brought it up, I'm familiar with it. Hel I even played the part of Loki in a college mythology class when we acted out some Norse dramas, damn near broke the plant that hid the mistletoe twig.

Not even close. What you're really telling us with a statement like that is you don't know much about R+L=J. And if you don't know much about R+L=J, you probably don't know that much about ASoIaF. Which is fine, btw. You don't have to be an expert to participate here, or add something of value. Otoh, waving your ignorance around like a flaming sword isn't the best way to get people to take you seriously.

Back to the topic at hand, the Hodor-Norse connection has been made before, on more than one occasion, so you're probably on to something. Here is something that might be of interest to you.

Enjoy, and welcome to the forums. :cheers:

So yeah, I did offer up some criticism, which is pretty normal behavior on forums. But I also complimented the OP, tried to be helpful with a link and welcomed him to the forums.

So, according to you, being critical + complimentary + helpful + kind = "rather dickish." But the OP's consistently rude behavior is acceptable because why?

Nope, you told him that what he was really telling us is that he doesn't know anything about one of the most popular fan theories on the forums, and that because of that he probably doesn't know much about ASoIaF as a whole, and that that's OKAY, but he shouldn't "wave his ignorance around like a flaming sword." And THEN you kindly welcomed him to the forums.

but if you really don't see the condescension in that, then... well, there's nothing to talk about.

I stand by my original statement 100%. If you can't understand why I would say what I said, then I agree that we have nothing to talk about. The comment I was responding to was ludicrous.

[Schlacko]

You know, I talk usually talk about this stuff on IMDB... can be a cesspool I know, but I'm just more used to that place. Anyways, when I found this forum, I recommended it on the IMDB forums because there were seemingly dozens of spoiler trolls over there and the moderation was poor, whereas this place is very organized when it comes to spoiler and nonspoiler areas.

You know what those users said about this place? That it was loaded with snobs, stuck up jerks and generally clique-y. And I'm talking about the polite users there. They find IMDB users more friendly and welcoming than the users here...hmmm...

That "Enjoy, and welcome to the forums" felt rather sarcastic and condescending given what preceded it. Also, I'm not even new so...

You'll be happy to know I'll probably stick to IMDB, it may be an unmoderated cesspool, but at least it doesn't have people that feel like they own the place. I'll take that 'Discerningly-tasty' guy over 'J-Stargaryen' anyday.

The thing where you bring up old topics saying we should go there before making a new one... it's really Scylla and Charybdis. I can make a new thread and someone inevitably chastises me for making a topic that's been covered. Or I can find an old thread and if I want to add to it, someone inevitably chastises me for bumping an old thread. so... pft.

[Rhymes with Weak]

I stand by my original statement 100%. If you can't understand why I would say what I said, then I agree that we have nothing to talk about. The comment I was responding to was ludicrous.

I don't like it when people disagree with my point of view, you're right. Twas "ludicrous".

[Foothill]

Otoh, waving your ignorance around like a flaming sword isn't the best way to get people to take you seriously.

Made my day.

[Aerys Ahai Reborn]

Isn't Hodor (Walder) supposedly the great grand child of Old Nan? Unless somehow she is a servant of the Great Other, I am not going to believe Hodor is either. And if the great Other has any sort of foresight, surely he'd command his servants at Wintefell to kill Jon Snow before he leaves for the Night's Watch (even if not AAR, he has strengthened the defense of the Wall against the true enemy).

As to the the dickishness going on in this thread, it has made for a bit of a laugh at everyone evolved, though I do seem to side with what J. Stargaryen has said.

[Jon of the Dead]

I can understand the OP, most people in here are very nice and welcoming, but there are a few users (not pointing names, it isn't anyone in this thread) that kinda make me feel second-hand embarrasement because of their snobbishness and bloated egos.

Now, regarding the topic, I like it. I read the pretty well-known theory of Ragnarok-asoiaf, and it said Bloodraven was the equivalent of Loki. If this is true, and based on the myths, I think it could be very likely for Bloodraven to control/manipulate/glamor Hodor to use him for his plans.

I don't see how that is too far fetched, since Mel uses some kind of glamor to seemingly control Mance. We know BR has similar powers (he glamored into Maynard Plumm), so maybe BR can pull a similar stunt on poor Hodor.

[IamMe90]

I stand by my original statement 100%. If you can't understand why I would say what I said, then I agree that we have nothing to talk about. The comment I was responding to was ludicrous.

Haha... I can understand your reasons for disagreeing with the premise of the OP... I disagree too. What I can't understand is why you need to express your disagreement with terms like "superfluous," "nonsense," and, essentially, [try not to wave] your ignorance like a flaming sword." That's over the top and arrogant. If you disagree with someone, why don't you just tell them you disagree with them and express the reasons why you disagree with them? You could do without the exaggerated/negative language ("nonsense" and "superfluous"), the over-the-top condescending metaphor, and basically saying (paraphrased) "well ur view is ridiculous so u must be new and u must know hardly anything about the song of ice and fire."

don't bullshit, after your "not even close" statement, you further deduced that: 1) he didn't know about R+L=J (even though he clearly did, even if he had a different opinion; but let's put that aside.) Then you further deduced that, because of this, he knew "hardly anything" about asoiaf. Then you told him that "it's okay" that he's new to the forum [and basically knows nothing]; then you said that, despite that it's okay that he "hardly knows anything about asoiaf" that he shouldn't be "waving around his ignorance like a flaming sword." Yeah, on top of all of that, you're telling a new poster that their wrongness and ignorance is SO blatant and offense that it's akin to a flaming sword. Yeah, as far as I can tell, that's a great way to get new people to post their ideas. You know, telling them that they're way off base, that the fact that they're way off base can only be due to the fact that they're new, don't know anything about ASoIaF, and that they're ignorant to the point that their ignorance is a flaming sword. Yeah, no one could ever take the slightest offense to such treatment of their first topic. Nah, brah, you're totally being a kind guy by following all of that with some links and a "welcome to the forums." :cool4:

[J. Stargaryen]

Haha... I can understand your reasons for disagreeing with the premise of the OP... I disagree too. What I can't understand is why you need to express your disagreement with terms like "superfluous," "nonsense," and, essentially, [try not to wave] your ignorance like a flaming sword." That's over the top and arrogant. If you disagree with someone, why don't you just tell them you disagree with them and express the reasons why you disagree with them? You could do without the exaggerated/negative language ("nonsense" and "superfluous"), the over-the-top condescending metaphor, and basically saying (paraphrased) "well ur view is ridiculous so u must be new and u must know hardly anything about the song of ice and fire."

don't bullshit, after your "not even close" statement, you further deduced that: 1) he didn't know about R+L=J (even though he clearly did, even if he had a different opinion; but let's put that aside.) Then you further deduced that, because of this, he knew "hardly anything" about asoiaf. Then you told him that "it's okay" that he's new to the forum [and basically knows nothing]; then you said that, despite that it's okay that he "hardly knows anything about asoiaf" that he shouldn't be "waving around his ignorance like a flaming sword." Yeah, on top of all of that, you're telling a new poster that their wrongness and ignorance is SO blatant and offense that it's akin to a flaming sword. Yeah, as far as I can tell, that's a great way to get new people to post their ideas. You know, telling them that they're way off base, that the fact that they're way off base can only be due to the fact that they're new, don't know anything about ASoIaF, and that they're ignorant to the point that their ignorance is a flaming sword. Yeah, no one could ever take the slightest offense to such treatment of their first topic. Nah, brah, you're totally being a kind guy by following all of that with some links and a "welcome to the forums." :cool4:

I didn't disagree with the premise of the OP.

[IamMe90]

I didn't disagree with the premise of the OP.

That's a great way to selectively respond to my post. Doesn't change the fact that you were being a condescending dick, though.

edit: When I said "the premise of the OP" though, I meant that "hodor=the great other." Which, you know, was the entire point of the topic, and which you did disagree with. Sorry, I can get technical, you didn't disagree with every premise, you just disagreed with the conclusion of the premises, which was obviously what I was talking about...

[J. Stargaryen]

That's a great way to selectively respond to my post. Doesn't change the fact that you were being a condescending dick, though.

Says the person who resorts to name calling.

edit: When I said "the premise of the OP" though, I meant that "hodor=the great other." Which, you know, was the entire point of the topic, and which you did disagree with. Sorry, I can get technical, you didn't disagree with every premise, you just disagreed with the conclusion of the premises, which was obviously what I was talking about...

No, I did not disagree with the premise that Hodor is the Great Other. That is simply not true.

[Sam with Hooters]

I agree with Jon of the Dead. Hodr was Loki's dupe; in the same way Hodor will be a warg's dupe. (It's not a big stretch to believe that Hodor is on the way to be "broken to warg-reins").

The big question is, who's Loki and who's Baldr? Bloodraven has too much Odin imagery going on, what with the one eye and the ravens...