Will Bran ever return from North of the Wall?

[sarah.jenice]

I don't like the idea of Bran evolving into a tree, I don't care how cool it is, how much he can see, and I can't shake this vibe that in the long run, it is not a good idea for him to stay there too long.

Granted, I think him being there does serve a purpose right now, for the story, and for us as readers, too. His connections to the Weirwood Net can show us so much more, we've only had a taste. I can see how his warging abilities to animals and trees may be very useful in the fight. It's clear that Bloodraven has been up and down, isn't it? I still get this sinking sensation that somehow, though, this is some kind of permanent trap that is being set for Bran. I think in the long run, he needs to break his ass out of there. At least I hope so.

I do remember Ned saying how Bran would never hold his own son in his arms, I take that as a true observation about Bran's paralysis. I also remember Ned discussing all the things that Bran could become, but as we know, Bran always wanted to be a knight and KG. My suspicion is that either CotF or BR are using those dreams of Bran's, his dreams of knighthood and being a hero against him, somehow. Yes, they have given him a way to be a hero through the Weirwood Net, to fight in perhaps a knightly fashion from his weirwood, but still, I have this nagging feeling it is a trap.

I fear he is being setup to never get out of that cave, but hope he will.

The chapters definitely had a dark, ominous feel to them.

I don't think the CotF or BR plan to do Bran himself harm, but I think they are operating in a mindset of whatever means are necessary to meet the end they want. They have a goal that they need Bran to achieve, and I don't think they care about the sacrifices Bran or his companions will have to make in the process.

[Stann]

The interesting part here, though, is the CoTF themselves. Nobody south of the wall thinks they exist and haven't for many many years. Bloodraven obviously didn't leave once he found them. Either nobody else has encountered them, or anyone who has hasn't come out of that cave. And by anybody, I mean anybody with ties south of the wall. Though I don't remember any of the wildlings talking about the CoTF like they were a current thing either.

[Ashur]

Didn't Bloodraven lead a full life before he ended up as a tree? I don't see why Bran would happily stay in the cave for the rest of his life. He'll definitely leave, the question is, does he go North or South?

I think he might go looking for Benjem. I bet the children of the forest know what he's up to.

That is very interesting. Did Bloodraven knows about the cave from his early times in the wall (or even before!), or just discovered it as a ranger, and lingered there in his throne? Anyway, it seems to me that Brynden's plans for Bran won't include any possibility of Bran leaving. Anyway, i'm not sure about Bloodraven's goals, but everything around greenseers seems to be very obscure... maybe too obscure. I don't take for granted that Children of the Forest and Others are such different in their goals. So its not like Bran being a defender of the realm.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Great catch! That makes it sadder to me that his fate may literally be tied to a tree.

I need to reread the cave chapters, but I agree that there's some disquieting going on here. I don't know that Bran and the Reeds should trust the Children. I also don't like that Bran is separate from Summer. Nothing good ever happens when the Stark kids are separated from their direwolves.

Exactly, add in the separations from Summer and that just adds to my disquiet. I wish I could put my finger on it, other than to say, GRRM is perhaps showing his skill at writing horror, too and it is a vibe I can't shake.

I've looked into ordering the D&E series, I suppose that will help with insight into BR (other than the reading about the stories I've done around the net), but it will just probably leave me with more questions anyway, and that lingering feeling of DOOM DOOM DOOM (but, a much quieter DOOM and BOOM than Cat's chapters) that I get everytime I read it.

I'm trying to also remember Bran awakening from the fall from the Tower, the flight and visions with the TEC, and how in the end it led him to naming his direwolf Summer. Perhaps there is something there, other than the fight for Spring and Summer itself. Maybe it means, come Summer, Bran will have a chance for a future outside of that cave?

ETA: That is a great catch above about Bran's initial feelings about the weirwood at Winterfell.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Didn't Bloodraven lead a full life before he ended up as a tree? I don't see why Bran would happily stay in the cave for the rest of his life. He'll definitely leave, the question is, does he go North or South?

I think he might go looking for Benjem. I bet the children of the forest know what he's up to.

My main worry about the differences with BR situation and Bran's is that....part of Blood Raven's life seems to be about the prep for what is going on now, while Bran's life, right now, seems to be about the war, or wars, coming and how his powers could play into it. While there may be a way for Bran to fight the good fight from that tree, it doesn't mean he'd have to be doomed there forever, and it doesn't mean that BR or CotF are looking necessarily beyond their needs, and are all three, BR, CotF, and Bran himself....wanting the same thing for the world, the same fate, anyway. I just do fear that Bran's desire to be a hero could be used against him. There could be a wildcard situation here, and even if there isn't, I don't see why if Bran is the only one left who can sit on a Weirwood throne, that he should have to sit there every minute of his life, even after the War that is expected around the Wall and the North, involving the Others.

I'm just hopeful naming his wolf Summer when he awoke meant that they can continue their own destiny, come Summer, after the war. That cave setting just oozes uncertainty and disquiet to me, it seems one of the more ominous, hard to figure out settings and the vibe flowing from it is strange. JMO, and all of this is just still in progress thoughts in my mind, that I turn round and round, but I just can't shake the bad vibe I get from it.

[joluoto]

Yeah, I do think he will become a tree eventually. But probably not time for that yet. Bran still has things to do North of the Wall. But his destiny is probably set, and he will never return south.

[Queen‍‍‍‍‍‍ Alysanne‍‍™]

I don't like the idea of Bran evolving into a tree, I don't care how cool it is, how much he can see, and I can't shake this vibe that in the long run, it is not a good idea for him to stay there too long.

Granted, I think him being there does serve a purpose right now, for the story, and for us as readers, too. His connections to the Weirwood Net can show us so much more, we've only had a taste. I can see how his warging abilities to animals and trees may be very useful in the fight. It's clear that Bloodraven has been up and down, isn't it? I still get this sinking sensation that somehow, though, this is some kind of permanent trap that is being set for Bran. I think in the long run, he needs to break his ass out of there. At least I hope so.

I do remember Ned saying how Bran would never hold his own son in his arms, I take that as a true observation about Bran's paralysis. I also remember Ned discussing all the things that Bran could become, but as we know, Bran always wanted to be a knight and KG. My suspicion is that either CotF or BR are using those dreams of Bran's, his dreams of knighthood and being a hero against him, somehow. Yes, they have given him a way to be a hero through the Weirwood Net, to fight in perhaps a knightly fashion from his weirwood, but still, I have this nagging feeling it is a trap.

I fear he is being setup to never get out of that cave, but hope he will.

Amazing post, I also don't trust BR.

What also interests me is that Bran, Arya and Sansa have parallel stories in a way, that is all are under some sort of training, and I think all of them are in some sort of trap and will have to get out, LF wants to use Sansa as a pawn, FM I don;t know what they want from Arya, but I am suspicious they want to use her cause she is a warg and I believe the CotF and BR just want to use Bran as an instrument due to his abilities.

[Illyrio Mo'Parties]

I think it'd be pretty boring for Bran to spend the next two novels stuck underground watching the rest of the story through a bunch of fucking trees. I'd like to see him remain an active participant in events.

Having that said, I think he's going to die. There's a very tragic tone to Bran's story of late, and I can't see a happy ending for him.

But what do I know, I thought Harry Potter was going to die. (Spoiler alert: he doesn't)

[bloodsteel bitterraven]

I think Bran will be the Lord of Winterfell and maybe King of Westeros. I think he is the true hero of the story, not Jon.

[Petyr Patter]

Martin likes to keep his characters moving. Jaime showed up in King's Landing just in time to be sent back to the Riverlands. I suspect Jaime will end up back in Winterfell before the series is over.

Bran will not stay in the cave. How he leaves, which direction he goes, and who goes with him are the questions to ask, but sitting in a cave is not a story, it is a tragic end.

Fun Theory: Bran wargs a dragon, "flies" in truth, shows up at some important battle and wins it for the North.

[Winter King]

Since Bran went north of the wall, I sort of though that was it for him, at least with regards to him becoming King in the North or Lord of Winterfell. However, I feel his warging ability may be tied with the dragons in some way, so we shall see :dunno:

[Tristifer Mudd]

This is how Bran will get back !

Gorne's Way is a mythical route through the caves near the Wall that pass beneath the Wall and come out beyond it

[Not Dead Just Broken]

I don't think he stays in the cave. I'd have to check the timelines as to where Bran's story is in time but he has spent months down there and his training is basically complete. I'm not sure why you would show the passage of time unless he is going to have some sort of interaction with events outside of the cave again. The continued survival of Hodor, I think also bodes well. It gives Bran a mode of transit. By the end of his ADWD chapters Meera is getting pretty eager to leave. Even if the Jojen paste theory is true, I don't see GRRM killing Meera off in a cave. I think as long as Meera and Hodor are around, there's a good chance Bran will leave the cave when they do.

I also agree that Bran has too much overall significance to stay in the cave. There' s a reason he has the first non-prologue chapter in AGOT. The entire thing could have been from Jon or Ned's perspective but we got Bran instead.

[antipattern]

Bran is never leaving that cave.

[JonnSnow]

Why do people think that Bran is stuck in the cave north of wall.

He is developing great ability to be anywhere he like through power of warging and power of godwoods,

He is everwhere he wants to be and he can even go back and forth in time. He has the greatest power there ever can be.

So yes he will def leave the cave and come down south of the wall. That may not be in the physical form but he is beyond that now..

[Veltigar]

My guess:

1) The cave of the children is located right on top of the entrance to Gorne's way

2) The Others have not yet attacked the Wall because they want to take out the last greenseer and CotF (no enemy in the back and all that) and use Gorne's way to bypass the Walls defenses.

3) After some further lessons and exhibitions us readers get through Bran's eyes the Others launch their attack on the cave and break through.

4) Hodor and Meera take Bran of his throne. Jojen takes Brans place to fool the Others into thinking that they have taken out the Last Greenseers.

5) Bran, Hodor and Meera flee through tunnels. At the same time BR and Jojen are killed off by the Others.

6) Bran leads his crew out of the caves into a corridor were Coldhands is waiting for them

[Northernmonkey]

Why do people think that Bran is stuck in the cave north of wall.

He is developing great ability to be anywhere he like through power of warging and power of godwoods,

He is everwhere he wants to be and he can even go back and forth in time. He has the greatest power there ever can be.

So yes he will def leave the cave and come down south of the wall. That may not be in the physical form but he is beyond that now..

I think you're massively overestimating the extent of Bran's powers. Can't he only see things through the weirwoods? It's not like he can be anywhere.

I've also read people on this forum suggesting that Bran could essentially warg anyone or anything on the planet. Surely he needs to be near someone or to have met them before to warg them?

Bran's not going to become some sort of omnipotent godlike figure who can do anything. He'll still need to go out into the world and physically do stuff.

[Melpomene]

Well, I certainly hope not. Sadly, I didn't find his chapters in ADWD that interesting....and overall, just doesn't seem like an ideal/appealing fate. It would be more intriguing if he somehow broke away from it all. He just seems to be less and less himself, less Stark and branching more and more away from the overall story. Part of me also wanted the CoTF would remain discreet/a mystery, instead of showing themselves. We already have every other mystical creature come out again after so many years. I know there is suppose to be some sort of dominoe-effect-magic-comeback going on, but still.

I just don't want to keep reading his chapters of him doing nothing but visiting everywhere else, if it comes to that. In the long run, no matter how powerful he is, it could be very depressing. Seeing is not the same as physically being there, and constantly going through that sentiment might drive someone nuts. Especially at such a young age, Bran has barely been through any life experiences. A first kiss, travelling and seeing the world, new friendships, books, clothes, armour, foods and art, more horsebackriding, playing with Summer, weddings and children, nieces and nephews, festivals, nameday celebrations, overall being able to actual talk, smell and touch things for what they really are. Even paralyzed he could still do these things, since it would be better than being paralyzed and severely isolated for a number of long years in a cold far away place.

With all my good old personal desires being said...mmmm, I'm not sure where he will end up. He might actually break away afterall at the very last minute. He might get word that his remaining family members are alive, perhaps he will have a final revelation that no, he won't do this, he isn't going to back down, turn his back on his own kin and duties. He might want to finally have a choice in his own destiny and take control of his life - everything was decided for him: his disability, his princely title and being made head of Winterfell, losing his dream of being a knight in the meantime, the fate of his friends and family, and now destined to be some sort of great greenseer. Enough is enough, perhaps? Additionally, he is often yearning for his old home, seeing sights of Winterfell throughout the ages, even calling out to his younger father.

In many ways, his situation is close to Arya's, who is also going through decisions and training towards a very serious position. Both are longing, and Arya is already starting to keep hold of her Stark identity despite insistance that she let's it go permanently.

Or maybe I'm just dipping into my hopefulness again :lol:

[Lady Fevre Dream]

Amazing post, I also don't trust BR.

What also interests me is that Bran, Arya and Sansa have parallel stories in a way, that is all are under some sort of training, and I think all of them are in some sort of trap and will have to get out, LF wants to use Sansa as a pawn, FM I don;t know what they want from Arya, but I am suspicious they want to use her cause she is a warg and I believe the CotF and BR just want to use Bran as an instrument due to his abilities.

Thank you very much for the kind words on the post. The analogy of the three Stark kids and their training is very thought provoking, too. It does seem there is a chance that each of them will have to faces choices about breaking away from the training, or their trainers. Their fates could be determined by how and when each of them try to make the move back to their own fates, maybe?

I do feel that BR and the CotF are using Bran for their own ends, and those ends may even match some of the things that are best for humanity, for Bran, etc. Even IF that should be true, I still think the long con they are running on Bran is not in his own interests. I can see him fighting for something important from that weirwood throne, but should the fight be won, I don't see a reason he needs to stay there. That is where I fear the competing interests in that cave diverge.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

My guess:

1) The cave of the children is located right on top of the entrance to Gorne's way

2) The Others have not yet attacked the Wall because they want to take out the last greenseer and CotF (no enemy in the back and all that) and use Gorne's way to bypass the Walls defenses.

3) After some further lessons and exhibitions us readers get through Bran's eyes the Others launch their attack on the cave and break through.

4) Hodor and Meera take Bran of his throne. Jojen takes Brans place to fool the Others into thinking that they have taken out the Last Greenseers.

5) Bran, Hodor and Meera flee through tunnels. At the same time BR and Jojen are killed off by the Others.

6) Bran leads his crew out of the caves into a corridor were Coldhands is waiting for them

I really, really LOVE number 4. That is a very interesting idea, and could be a distinct possibility. Maybe that is why Jojen has been so meloncholy, knowing that is time is coming and how. I like that much better than Jojen paste, LOL We do have tons of wights circling the cave opening as I recall, and while I love your number 4, I do think you've laid out a very good scenario all around. This idea of Gorne's way being the escape hatch that they all may need, Bran and friends, and/or Others and their wights, could be the key.