LGBTQI Thread - An Ode to Bisexuals

[karaddin]

So today is apparently bisexuality day in the US and I discovered that both Anna Paquin and Drew Barrymore are out bisexuals, along with others I either am not particularly familiar with or don't care about in quite the same way :P

Brook decided that I should pen an ode to my bisexual girlfriend to start this thread off on a positive note, unfortunately for her I can't write poetry for shit!

It was a warm summer day when I met you in the sun,

How would I know you were bi if not for your love of pun?

On the ferry to Manly Pax assured Neal was having fun,

If I had known what I was getting into I surely would have run!

And on that note I must depart from rhyme,

For all I have left is the ferry was covered in slime.

While waiting for Horza you subtlely gauged my age,

In discussing Perth and Fat Cat we were on the same page.

As the evening unfolded I discovered with cautious glee,

The myriad common interests were plain for me to see.

On that most important question, the love of The Princess Bride

You passed with flying colours and I'm sure my smile was wide.

Towards the end of the evening you rest your head on me,

Together we gazed out over the beautiful night time sea.

On parting at the station I hoped you'd beg me stay,

Unfortunately for me your reluctance got in the way.

So home to North Sydney and wait a respectable hour,

To wait a minute longer was not within my power.

A direct and clear message was the approach that I took,

A Ranland private message to the username of Brook.

Despite initial reluctance we agreed upon a date,

Then discarded when you were stood up by a mate!

By spontaneous rescheduling we skipped a lot fear,

Yet tentatively in Newtown I told you transition was near.

Although you already knew I thought this would be the end,

I thought the most I could expect of you was to be a friend.

The following week you asked me out completely and truly,

And so that Friday you got to meet the real Natalie.

You drew me out despite my fear, pale shoulders in the sun,

But were there people staring? I could see none.

That night you taught me the beauty of bisexuality,

And since that night my heart no longer resides in me.

Ok that's enough terribleness, I hope the sappy sentiment at least makes people smile :P

[Robin Of House Hill]

Terribleness? That was delightful. Thank you.

[brook]

omg I didn't think you'd actually do it. Amazing girl.

[Seli]

:)

I'm yet to have coffee, so the words are a blur but the emotion and sentiment shines :)

[karaddin]

I don't think that's the lack of coffee, the words just are a blur :P the emotion and sentiment were the important parts.

Anyway back to other matters, and other good news for Robin. I had previously observed (I think in the feminism thread) that while TERF seems popular more amongst academic feminism that trans inclusivity (along with intersectionality in general) seems to be much more the norm in online activist feminism. In the last week especially, but the last few in general, since that statement started circulating I've been seeing more efforts at inclusivity from some of these sites. In particular I think I've seen at least a couple of things on Jezebel etc. There has also been the transh4ck event for trans coders to get together, and in general pretty robust support for trans folk from the feminists in the tech sector (see also that panel I linked from PAX Prime in the Women and Minorities in Geek Culture thread).

I really do think things are shifting here, which is also why people like Cathy Brennan are getting even more vocal, the tide has turned against them and they know it. They will continue to be loud and vocal on twitter, and bully their way into having debates that seem valid, but it's just a matter of time know. The women actually fighting for equality today know we are woman and include us in the fight.

[Robin Of House Hill]

There is a trans inclusive feminist site that I joined, but I'm on my phone now and don't have a link.

Wow, I just realized the bulk of my life is online.

[karaddin]

So is mine, online is so much easier to manage as a huge introvert. I keep meaning to try get more involved in Sydney but actually talking to people is draining!

[Robin Of House Hill]

I've got no problem talking to people, but I have no real life friends. With the exception of the time some of the folks my better half worked with, came over, no one has been to our home and we haven't been to anyone's.

[Lyanna Stark]

:bowdown: :bowdown: @ karaddin. That was amazing!! :D

So is mine, online is so much easier to manage as a huge introvert. I keep meaning to try get more involved in Sydney but actually talking to people is draining!

Online also seems a bit easier to me since you have the benefit of a bit of anonymity, which at least to me is interesting since I live in the arse end of redneckville and frankly I think people around these parts are more interested in soap operas, the local football team and our local version of country music than any sort of political action. However, like you I have thought of becoming "official" and joining some sort of RL organisation (it's weird to have that dichotomy) but I am uncertain which one and I guess I am worried about feeling like a small, country side UFO among the long timers etc. Perhaps that's a silly way of looking at it, I dunno. I'd like to do more in RL.

FWIW, reading about Robin's and other people's evolution and bravery in these threads have inspired me to gather my resolve and stop being a wuss! Your struggles are far more significant than mine so I should just "man up", I think. :)

[Robin Of House Hill]

Just a note that the effort to send messages of encouragement to Cassidy Campbell, resulted in over 800 messages being sent in the first day.

They were trying to get to 1000,the last I heard.

[TerraPrime]

Re: Robin

Awesome job. :)

Re: Genisenu

Don't you think using the term transgender creates a sort of segregation of people that had a gender change ? Wouldn't it be better if trans people could just identify as a female/male rather than a trans female/male ?

I think that's a fair question to ask, but not just to trans* people, but to all sorts of minority groups. For instance, it's the same question as "Why do we need 'African American' and 'Asian American'? Why not just American?"

While I don't think that sort of question contains any malice, although sometimes depending on the context it might, I think it belies a certain unawareness of the history of how minority groups often came to be. The creation and the adoption of a minority identity, e.g. transgender woman or African American, are attempts to reclaim an identity that has been buried and subsumed by the dominant culture. In some cases, the minority was defined by the majority and the creation of a new label attempts to return the power of self-identity to the minority group, as in the case of African Americans choosing that identity over, say, "coloreds" or "Negros" or for LBG people choosing our identity over "faggots" or "fairies" (1). In denying the majority group the right to define us there is an empowerment of our selves.

A second reason why these labels are useful is that it calls attention to issues that are often deliberately neglected for the sake of the majority's convenience. I think that's more the case of the trans* idnetity, since it is an issue that has been largely invisible to the mainstream, and even in the LBG community (2). By using a label that distinguishes itself from the LBG label, people are asserting that there are unique and separate set of issues that they face apart and in addition to the issues they may face for being LBG. There are, obviously, large sections of overlap between LBG and T, but so are there between LBGT and straight people, e.g. lesbian women face sexism against women just as much, so we might also ask why don't we do away with the label "lesbian" altogether? And the answer to the question about the "lesbian" label is the same that applies to the trans* woman label, which is that lesbians face issues that are in addition to what they face as women, just as trans* women face issues that are in addition to what they face as women. For instance, all women face issues of workplace discrimination such as glass ceilings or hostile work environments, but trans* women may also have to deal with issues specific to them, such as issues over the use of sex-segregated bathrooms or locker rooms, i.e. cisgender women will not have their right to use the "correct" bathroom questioned.

Ultimately, while I can see the good intent behind such questions of "why don't we all do away with labels and treat everyone as the same," we are, after all, all humans, the reality is that people are NOT treated the same no matter how strongly we'd wish otherwise. Recognizing this inequality via adopting appropriate labels and identities is not the same as supporting the existing disparity, and it should definitely not be taken as an endorsement of the discrimination aimed at minority groups. These labels serve to both empower the members of the minority groups (when the identity originates from these groups and are not imposed upon them) and highlight the ongoing struggles that set them apart from members of the mainstream communities. So I think they're very useful.

(1) Some groups, e.g. The Radical Fairies and the Queer Nation, have accepted these very negative labels by conscious decision to subvert them. How successful they are in twisting the labels around varies and is probably up for debate. The reclaiming of the label "Queer" is now slightly more accepted than it was just 15 or 20 years ago. I still know a lot of LBGT people who cannot stomach the label "queer" no matter how many groups use it in a positive light.

(2) I think there's a story to be told from the trans* perspective on how the mainstreaming of LBGT people in the 80s through the early 2000s managed to sideline trans* activitism and minimize the contributions of trans* acitivists within the LBGT community. In the 60s and early 70s, it seems that trans* people were less invisible amongst the LBGT community, but as the success of mainstreaming took flight, we seemed to have left the trans* section of our community behind, perhaps for fear that our acceptance will slow down or ever reverse course if we were to ask the mainstream people to accept not just LBG people, but also trans* people. I wonder if my perception of history has any merits to it? Anyone knows of some good scholarly work on LBGT history on this issue?

[Gillio]

So today is apparently bisexuality day in the US and I discovered that both Anna Paquin and Drew Barrymore are out bisexuals, along with others I either am not particularly familiar with or don't care about in quite the same way :P

Brook decided that I should pen an ode to my bisexual girlfriend to start this thread off on a positive note, unfortunately for her I can't write poetry for shit!

It was a warm summer day when I met you in the sun,

How would I know you were bi if not for your love of pun?

On the ferry to Manly Pax assured Neal was having fun,

If I had known what I was getting into I surely would have run!

And on that note I must depart from rhyme,

For all I have left is the ferry was covered in slime.

While waiting for Horza you subtlely gauged my age,

In discussing Perth and Fat Cat we were on the same page.

As the evening unfolded I discovered with cautious glee,

The myriad common interests were plain for me to see.

On that most important question, the love of The Princess Bride

You passed with flying colours and I'm sure my smile was wide.

Towards the end of the evening you rest your head on me,

Together we gazed out over the beautiful night time sea.

On parting at the station I hoped you'd beg me stay,

Unfortunately for me your reluctance got in the way.

So home to North Sydney and wait a respectable hour,

To wait a minute longer was not within my power.

A direct and clear message was the approach that I took,

A Ranland private message to the username of Brook.

Despite initial reluctance we agreed upon a date,

Then discarded when you were stood up by a mate!

By spontaneous rescheduling we skipped a lot fear,

Yet tentatively in Newtown I told you transition was near.

Although you already knew I thought this would be the end,

I thought the most I could expect of you was to be a friend.

The following week you asked me out completely and truly,

And so that Friday you got to meet the real Natalie.

You drew me out despite my fear, pale shoulders in the sun,

But were there people staring? I could see none.

That night you taught me the beauty of bisexuality,

And since that night my heart no longer resides in me.

Ok that's enough terribleness, I hope the sappy sentiment at least makes people smile :P

Beautiful, you have a way with words!!!

Just a note that the effort to send messages of encouragement to Cassidy Campbell, resulted in over 800 messages being sent in the first day.

They were trying to get to 1000,the last I heard.

Spoke to a couple of my customers who I thought would be interested, they'll be adding their names!

[Robin Of House Hill]

TP,

I agree that it is a fair question to ask. My answer will probably be as confusing as hell. The label, "trans", is much more practical than referring to, "non-normative dissonance between genetic/physical and mental/emotional". I probably am at odds with a lot of people as to whether trans is properly a noun or adjective. My take is that as a noun, the label sets me apart from other women, while as an adjective, it is just a descriptor as to how I arrived where I am.

As to the use of the term, "queer", intellectually, I realize that reclaiming the term to remove the hate from it and thereby, making it not useful to those who hate, makes sense. Emotionally, I can't call anyone, that.

I do have reservations about, "cisgender", but those are based solely on a discomfort about labeling others.

I have reversed my position (obviously) on news coverage of transgender-related issues. If we don't get into the mainstream consciousness, acceptance won't happen and the bigots won't be shamed away. That may make my living stealth a bit more difficult, but I'll probably survive it.

Gillio,

Thank you very much. "Saving starfish", is a worthy endeavor.

[Quoth]

So today is apparently bisexuality day in the US and I discovered that both Anna Paquin and Drew Barrymore are out bisexuals, along with others I either am not particularly familiar with or don't care about in quite the same way :P

Brook decided that I should pen an ode to my bisexual girlfriend to start this thread off on a positive note, unfortunately for her I can't write poetry for shit!

It was a warm summer day when I met you in the sun,

How would I know you were bi if not for your love of pun?

On the ferry to Manly Pax assured Neal was having fun,

If I had known what I was getting into I surely would have run!

And on that note I must depart from rhyme,

For all I have left is the ferry was covered in slime.

While waiting for Horza you subtlely gauged my age,

In discussing Perth and Fat Cat we were on the same page.

As the evening unfolded I discovered with cautious glee,

The myriad common interests were plain for me to see.

On that most important question, the love of The Princess Bride

You passed with flying colours and I'm sure my smile was wide.

Towards the end of the evening you rest your head on me,

Together we gazed out over the beautiful night time sea.

On parting at the station I hoped you'd beg me stay,

Unfortunately for me your reluctance got in the way.

So home to North Sydney and wait a respectable hour,

To wait a minute longer was not within my power.

A direct and clear message was the approach that I took,

A Ranland private message to the username of Brook.

Despite initial reluctance we agreed upon a date,

Then discarded when you were stood up by a mate!

By spontaneous rescheduling we skipped a lot fear,

Yet tentatively in Newtown I told you transition was near.

Although you already knew I thought this would be the end,

I thought the most I could expect of you was to be a friend.

The following week you asked me out completely and truly,

And so that Friday you got to meet the real Natalie.

You drew me out despite my fear, pale shoulders in the sun,

But were there people staring? I could see none.

That night you taught me the beauty of bisexuality,

And since that night my heart no longer resides in me.

Ok that's enough terribleness, I hope the sappy sentiment at least makes people smile :P

Wow! Well done. :)

[Sci-2]

Nice rhymes Karaddin.

Really gotta get that Genchat rap battle going....need to talk to Ran...

[Seli]

Denmark apparently is (likely to go ahead) going to make it easier to change registered gender. The discussion of that post elsewhere at the moment makes me appreciate what we are able to do here even more. And that is with a trans* person patiently explaining things over and over again there.

Thanks everyone.

[Elder Sister]

I loved your poem, karaddin...awesomeness!

Anyone who loves The Princess Bride is totally deserving of a lovely poem. :)

[Sci-2]

I loved your poem, karaddin...awesomeness!

Anyone who loves The Princess Bride is totally deserving of a lovely poem. :)

I don't know, I hold loving Princess Bride as the bare minimum standard for being considered human. ;-)

That said, Brook is indeed worthy of many poems. As LGBT Town's Cultural Minister, I'm calling for more Brook related poetry!

[karaddin]

I don't know, I hold loving Princess Bride as the bare minimum standard for being considered human. ;-)

That said, Brook is indeed worthy of many poems. As LGBT Town's Cultural Minister, I'm calling for more Brook related poetry!

Well that's it for me, I was accused of talking about sex in those last 2 lines and making her sound easy! I think her interpreting it that way says more about her than me tbh, but just to be clear the beauty of bisexuality was in seeing and liking me regardless of how I looked!

[Robin Of House Hill]

First, I didn't take those lines that way.

Second, even if I did, I wouldn't have reached that conclusion.