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Bakker - "You worship suffering."


lokisnow

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Interesting reading. Basically Inrau feels the suffering is towards a point, while Aurang just sees it as suffering for the sake of suffering. Suffering for fun.

But Aurang is mocking him right? Aurax I could see genuinely not understanding the difference, but Aurang seems like he's assimilated enough to know.

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Have we accepted that Valrissa’s violator is Aurax? I’m not so sure.

No, we don't know that, but it seems reasonable to assume it.

Theoretically it could be Aurang, if he is capable of handling a Synthese in Carascand while touring Akksersia. Or the air-speed velocity of an unladen Inchoroi is very high.

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When Esmi wakes up, after having been posessed by Aurang, she recollects the burning question, “Who are the Dunyain?” (presumably, she recalls “being” Aurang, powerful sexual drive included, in her dream.)

This proves nothing, but it’s exactly the phrase repeated over and over by Valrissa’s bane.

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No, we don't know that, but it seems reasonable to assume it.

Theoretically it could be Aurang, if he is capable of handling a Synthese in Carascand while touring Akksersia. Or the air-speed velocity of an unladen Inchoroi is very high.

Hmmm, you raise an interesting question about Synthese mechanics. Does Aurang have to be in the bird the whole time?

If so then it's definitely Aurax in TWP.

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Hmmm, you raise an interesting question about Synthese mechanics. Does Aurang have to be in the bird the whole time?

If so then it's definitely Aurax in TWP.

So then, who is the weird dude blowing black semen in book 1? Aurang in his conversation with Sarcellus-shell indicates that he's that dude. From which I've always presumed that Aurang can inhabit different shells, and the bird is the most convenient to get around and see all events from afar. But then, I think of that image of Aurang's "real" body being surrounded by muttering Consult in Golgotterah, and how it seemed implied that his soul was locked in the synthese.

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We don't actually know that that quote (by Kellhus) is even true, and if true, whether or not Kellhus is referring to the added sorceries required for Esmenet's Compulsion specifically, or the sorceries required to work sorcery through the Synthese and at such distances generally.

I'm of the opinion that Aurang remains Inchoroi and the Bird-Synthese is simply one of a number of specialized units.

However, the real trick is how Aurang visits Esmenet in TDTCB and TTT. Do Glamours allow for the creating and molding of substance/matter/corporeal form? In both cases, would those affected by Glamours see a man when there's just a bird or does the sorcery physically change form (for instance, the Barricades are made up of "nimil and light")?

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Having thought about this for a long time, I am not confident that Esmi has intercourse with the Synthese. (She believes the shape to be different.)

1. In particular, we hear the flutter of wings when he/it leaves.

2. Esmi was “stoked by the Old Father” as the Thing called Sarcellus puts it, so she didn’t have sex with another Consult creation (say, a skin spy).

3. Aurang could of course possess a good-looking human, just as he later possessed Esmi. Maybe such a possessed!human would still “count” in “Sarcellus’s” mind as “stoked by the Old Father.” But then why would the seed be black?

4. I do not believe that the Synthese changes its form. It would be much easier to magick Esmi in to believing she has sex with a beautiful man instead of a weird bird. That would seem like basic Inchoroi magic, just the kind of thing they’re good at. (They probably magick themselves into believing they are humping Cleopatra while actually using an inflatable doll.)

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We assume that Aurang himself is not there but why else the black seed? Does the Synthese have a large, unmentioned phallus?

Does it need to be large though? Aurang could have just rubbed himself against Esmi's genitals or even just her legs or stomach, and then ejaculated.

Meanwhile Esmi thinks there was someone there.

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Does it need to be large though? Aurang could have just rubbed himself against Esmi's genitals or even just her legs or stomach, and then ejaculated.

Meanwhile Esmi thinks there was someone there.

doesn't bird just touch the skinspies and they come off? maybe that's not a spy-function, but a bird-function, applicable to anyone.

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Maybe it's a sign of Inchie possession? But that's confusing because the possession part is presumably sorcery that Aurang learned from the Mangaecca.

I think A possessed a person, but I don't feel too strongly about it. That scene has always been confusing. I think the sythese was there as the vessel for Aurang to be near enough, and he can pull off a possession from the synthese.

My first time through I really didn't think about it at all. Its so early in the book that you don't know WTF is going on with the bird thing that shows up to kill Inrau and some dude with black spooge. It was only after reading discussion here and then having a re-read that I realized how awkward the scene was.

Is there any chance that it is just the foibles of an inexperienced author? Could it be that RSB had not fully fleshed out the capabilities of the Inchies at that point?

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