Small Questions v 10016

[PromisedPrince694]

1). Why are the oldest Kings of the North buried further down in Winterfell's crypts and the latest kings/lords near the surface? Don't they run out of space eventually?

2). Why is Jaime's horn named "Horn of Herrock" in AFFC? Is it different from other horns and what does the name mean?

To answer 1) because they built the crypts and started filling them in from the back.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

1. All the Tywin heirs have the 'Ty-' prefix to their names - Tywin, Tybolt, Tytos and (Old) Tyrion. If Tywin wanted Jamie to be his heir, why did he not name him with a 'Ty-' to go with the family heritage? Did he have a prophecy that his second son (not necessarily dwarf son) be his true heir?

2. After the Battle of the Trident, Ned rushes to King's Landing not knowing Tywin's true intentions and hoping to cut him off. Once he sees Jamie on the Iron Throne, he knows it's over for all the Targaryen loyalists. Then why he does not rush to the Tower of Joy to free Lyanna, instead heading out to Storm's End to break the siege? The siege master there is actually Mace Tyrell and you don't need an expert to tell you that guy has won nothing (followed Tarly's van once) and would yield almost immediately when news reaches him of Aerys' death. Did Ned know that Lyanna was not harmed by Rhaegar?

1) Not everything is done based on a prophecy :) By the way, Tytos, Tywin's father, was a third son himself, so I doubt that he was expected to inherit Casterly Rock when they named him. Of course, we don't know what happened to Tytos' brothers.

Also, on Joanna's side of the family people were not usually named with Ty- for as far as I can see. It is not at all strange for Joanna to have had a say in naming her children.

2) Ned had no idea where Lyanna was to be found. Rhaegar's closer friends (Myles Mooton for example) were killed on the Trident. The three KG Knights who were closest to Rhaegar were no where to be found. Storm's End was Robert's seat, however, and as we have learned, a King without his seat is no true King at all. Breaking the siege of Storms End would not be very difficult, since there was no true battle force in command (Mace Tyrell wasn't very impressive). And with all the other Targaryen loyalists defeated (the dornish were defeated in great numbers on the Trident as well, and most other loyalists of the Targaryens had already flocked to Robert). With Tywin now on Roberts side, the Tyrells had no other choise but to surrender, and Ned knew this.

Ned probably did not know yet if Rhaegar had hated Lyanna. For as far as we know, Lyanna hadn't sent any message that had gotten through to any of the Starks (because if it had, it would have changed the course of the war probably). Ned's first contact with Lyanna since her disappearance was at the Tower of Joy.

1). Why are the oldest Kings of the North buried further down in Winterfell's crypts and the latest kings/lords near the surface? Don't they run out of space eventually?

2). Why is Jaime's horn named "Horn of Herrock" in AFFC? Is it different from other horns and what does the name mean?

1) Perhaps, because you can never know how big the crypts would have to be when you build them, the crypts are expanded once in a specific period of time. Lyanna, Brandon and Rickard are at the back now, but perhaps, if the Starks rule Winterfell for another 300 years, the end will appear to be further away, since the crypts have been expanded in size.

2) Perhaps it's just a name. But it might be interesting to know that the last name Herrick is a German name. In German, is means army leader.

[Robin the Mighty]

My apologies if this has already been asked, but I really didn't want to skim through over 100 pages to see.

Does anyone have any clue who finished Barristan's pages in the White Book? It mentions how he was dismissed by Joff, but I can't see Selmy going and finishing his pages right after killing two gold cloaks. Any clue?

1). Why are the oldest Kings of the North buried further down in Winterfell's crypts and the latest kings/lords near the surface? Don't they run out of space eventually?

2). Why is Jaime's horn named "Horn of Herrock" in AFFC? Is it different from other horns and what does the name mean?

1) the did the crypts so that a few hundreds of lords (kings) will have place

2) not mentioned

[ser_basil]

1) Not everything is done based on a prophecy :) By the way, Tytos, Tywin's father, was a third son himself, so I doubt that he was expected to inherit Casterly Rock when they named him. Of course, we don't know what happened to Tytos' brothers.

Also, on Joanna's side of the family people were not usually named with Ty- for as far as I can see. It is not at all strange for Joanna to have had a say in naming her children.

2) Ned had no idea where Lyanna was to be found. Rhaegar's closer friends (Myles Mooton for example) were killed on the Trident. The three KG Knights who were closest to Rhaegar were no where to be found. Storm's End was Robert's seat, however, and as we have learned, a King without his seat is no true King at all. Breaking the siege of Storms End would not be very difficult, since there was no true battle force in command (Mace Tyrell wasn't very impressive). And with all the other Targaryen loyalists defeated (the dornish were defeated in great numbers on the Trident as well, and most other loyalists of the Targaryens had already flocked to Robert). With Tywin now on Roberts side, the Tyrells had no other choise but to surrender, and Ned knew this.

Ned probably did not know yet if Rhaegar had hated Lyanna. For as far as we know, Lyanna hadn't sent any message that had gotten through to any of the Starks (because if it had, it would have changed the course of the war probably). Ned's first contact with Lyanna since her disappearance was at the Tower of Joy.

1) Perhaps, because you can never know how big the crypts would have to be when you build them, the crypts are expanded once in a specific period of time. Lyanna, Brandon and Rickard are at the back now, but perhaps, if the Starks rule Winterfell for another 300 years, the end will appear to be further away, since the crypts have been expanded in size.

2) Perhaps it's just a name. But it might be interesting to know that the last name Herrick is a German name. In German, is means army leader.

Great points Rhaenys. I did not remember that Tytos himself was a third son. I still think there is something more to Tyrion that Tywin knew, but I can't put my finger on it. Heck, it could very well have been "you think he is a curse on me? watch me make him a learned guy and spite you all" :-D.

I agree on Ned's intentions, but I am still surprised the he didn't send one of his bannermen (or even one of the Storm Lords) to Storm's End knowing it is just Mace Tyrell (_after_ Aerys' death). I am guessing there is more to it than what we know.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

Great points Rhaenys. I did not remember that Tytos himself was a third son. I still think there is something more to Tyrion that Tywin knew, but I can't put my finger on it. Heck, it could very well have been "you think he is a curse on me? watch me make him a learned guy and spite you all" :-D.

I agree on Ned's intentions, but I am still surprised the he didn't send one of his bannermen (or even one of the Storm Lords) to Storm's End knowing it is just Mace Tyrell (_after_ Aerys' death). I am guessing there is more to it than what we know.

Thanks! :)

On why Ned didn't send one of his bannermen: He was extremely angry at Robert, because Robert wasn't angry at all with Tywin for having killed three or four yeard old Rhaenys and one year old Aegon. Even Jon Arryn couldn't settle the argument between the two. This was a break between Ned and Robert, and only their shared hurt over Lyanna's death could bring them together.

So when Ned left KL, he was extremely pissed, and still no closer to finding his sister. Yet, he remaind an honourable guy, and since his honour made his obey his new king, he went down to Storms End with his army to relieve the siege. Seeing as how he left with only a small group of people from Storms End to the Tower of Joy, I'm guessing he let one of his bannermen handle the details at Storms End once Mace Tyrell had surrendered.

[SunspearsPrincess]

Who is the lord protector / ruler of the Stormlands since Renly's death?

[The Crow's Third Eye]

Who is the lord protector / ruler of the Stormlands since Renly's death?

Interesting question. Trying to think of powerful houses of the Stormlands....I am not sure who the Crown would name; House Swann may be a possibility, as Balon is part of the Kingsguard and it is a good political move (not sure if Marcher Lords are part of the Stormlands though?) Estermont is a definite NO as they declared for Stannis I believe.. Could The Evenstar of Tarth be lord protector? Possibly? Those are the only notable houses I can think of, I will do a wiki and get back to it

[Lost Melnibonean]

OK, in AGOT when Bob and Ned are chilling on the countryside and Bob tells Ned about Jaime being Warden of the East, Ned says that it shouldn't happen cause eventually Jaime will become Warden of the West as well. Are Warden titles inheritable if you're in the Kingsguard? Or is Ned assuming Tywin will figure out a way for Jaime to get out of his vows??

Is that what Ned said or wwas he concered about both offices being held by house Lannister?

[Lost Melnibonean]

1). Why are the oldest Kings of the North buried further down in Winterfell's crypts and the latest kings/lords near the surface? Don't they run out of space eventually?

2). Why is Jaime's horn named "Horn of Herrock" in AFFC? Is it different from other horns and what does the name mean?

I believe the older kings are on a lower level. The more recent Starks are burried at the end of the current chamber, no?

[Robin the Mighty]

Who is the lord protector / ruler of the Stormlands since Renly's death?

Interesting question. Trying to think of powerful houses of the Stormlands....I am not sure who the Crown would name; House Swann may be a possibility, as Balon is part of the Kingsguard and it is a good political move (not sure if Marcher Lords are part of the Stormlands though?) Estermont is a definite NO as they declared for Stannis I believe.. Could The Evenstar of Tarth be lord protector? Possibly? Those are the only notable houses I can think of, I will do a wiki and get back to it

Nobody rules the stormlands right now, the war there is still going on, until storms end, although tommen is the rightful lord of storms end...

[Lost Melnibonean]

Who is the lord protector / ruler of the Stormlands since Renly's death?

Was Renly granted Storm's end in perpetuity? If not it would revert to the crown. It would revert to the croen if Renly wae attainted and not restored posthumously in a deal with Tyrell. If it was grsnted in perpetuity and Renly wasn't attainted isn't Renly's recognized heir Tommen?

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

Nobody rules the stormlands right now, the war there is still going on, until storms end, although tommen is the rightful lord of storms end...

Was Renly granted Storm's end in perpetuity? If not it would revert to the crown. It would revert to the croen if Renly wae attainted and not restored posthumously in a deal with Tyrell. If it was grsnted in perpetuity and Renly wasn't attainted isn't Renly's recognized heir Tommen?

I think Tommen rules the Stormlands now, as he is the last "Baratheon" who isn't dead or declared a traitor to the realm. Tommens eldest son will eventually gain the Iron Throne, but any child that comes after could receive Storms End, and probably also Dragonstone, since Stannis has been declared a traitor, and traitors usually don't get to keep their castles and lands.

Untul such time that Tommen has children of his own, the castle and lands that come along with it will be property of the crown, though a castellan will be needed. I have no idea who will be the castellan for Storm's End when the siege is finally broken.

[Lost Melnibonean]

I think Tommen rules the Stormlands now, as he is the last "Baratheon" who isn't dead or declared a traitor to the realm. Tommens eldest son will eventually gain the Iron Throne, but any child that comes after could receive Storms End, and probably also Dragonstone, since Stannis has been declared a traitor, and traitors usually don't get to keep their castles and lands.

Untul such time that Tommen has children of his own, the castle and lands that come along with it will be property of the crown, though a castellan will be needed. I have no idea who will be the castellan for Storm's End when the siege is finally broken.

In theory I'm pretty sure Tommen could keep storm's End all to himself and name a castellan. Or he could give it to someone for life, or he could give it to someone in perpetuity. As King he could strip Storm's End of its paramount position and raise up some other estate. Whether he would do any of that is certainly open for debate. But it doesn't matter cause Maggy said Tommen was gonna die.

[Marwi]

I am reading through ASOS right now.

I was convinced Craster killed his babies - or gave his babies to WW to being killed, but right after Lord Mormont dies, Gilly and her sisters ask Sam to help her and her son because otherwise his brothers (craster's sons) would have come to take him.

Now, this means that they haven't been killed as they were children as I expected.. for blood or flesh or evil deeds. Because dead people don't grow up and babies don't come and fetch a newborn (wouldn't it be ridiculous?). So it must be that WW raised up these children to join their own armies.

Has this been deeply discussed on this forum before?

Do we have 3 categories (WW, recruited humans and undeads) or just 2? How can such recruited humans survive the killing cold surrounding WW? Do WW perform queer magic to transform them into ice beings? Is most of the WW army composed of recruited humans or original WW beings or undeads? Why are these children so important? Why WW prefer to recruit alive children than killing the entire of craster's family and gather more undeads? Are recruited humans more powerful? Or are only craster's son more powerful, since they have crow's blood in their flesh? Maybe they can open the gates under the wall?

[Lost Melnibonean]

I am reading through ASOS right now.

I was convinced Craster killed his babies - or gave his babies to WW to being killed, but right after Lord Mormont dies, Gilly and her sisters ask Sam to help her and her son because otherwise his brothers (craster's sons) would have come to take him.

Now, this means that they haven't been killed as they were children as I expected.. for blood or flesh or evil deeds. Because dead people don't grow up and babies don't come and fetch a newborn (wouldn't it be ridiculous?). So it must be that WW raised up these children to join their own armies.

Has this been deeply discussed on this forum before?

Do we have 3 categories (WW, recruited humans and undeads) or just 2? How can such recruited humans survive the killing cold surrounding WW? Do WW perform queer magic to transform them into ice beings? Is most of the WW army composed of recruited humans or original WW beings or undeads? Why are these children so important? Why WW prefer to recruit alive children than killing the entire of craster's family and gather more undeads? Are recruited humans more powerful? Or are only craster's son more powerful, since they have crow's blood in their flesh? Maybe they can open the gates under the wall?

Didn't Old Nan say something about breeding Others with humans?

[Lady Gwynhyfvar]

I am reading through ASOS right now.

I was convinced Craster killed his babies - or gave his babies to WW to being killed, but right after Lord Mormont dies, Gilly and her sisters ask Sam to help her and her son because otherwise his brothers (craster's sons) would have come to take him.

Now, this means that they haven't been killed as they were children as I expected.. for blood or flesh or evil deeds. Because dead people don't grow up and babies don't come and fetch a newborn (wouldn't it be ridiculous?). So it must be that WW raised up these children to join their own armies.

Has this been deeply discussed on this forum before?

Do we have 3 categories (WW, recruited humans and undeads) or just 2? How can such recruited humans survive the killing cold surrounding WW? Do WW perform queer magic to transform them into ice beings? Is most of the WW army composed of recruited humans or original WW beings or undeads? Why are these children so important? Why WW prefer to recruit alive children than killing the entire of craster's family and gather more undeads? Are recruited humans more powerful? Or are only craster's son more powerful, since they have crow's blood in their flesh? Maybe they can open the gates under the wall?

You may want to check out the Heresy threads in the ADwD sub-forum. Here is the current version.

[WeaselPie]

Where might I find a fairly clear timeline of Robert's Rebellion? Not specific dates but months and weeks...

[mindchap]

Where might I find a fairly clear timeline of Robert's Rebellion? Not specific dates but months and weeks...

Here's one, but you should know going in that the dates around that time are, I think, intentionally vague. Just google "robert's rebellion timeline" for more.

[WeaselPie]

Here's one, but you should know going in that the dates around that time are, I think, intentionally vague. Just google "robert's rebellion timeline" for more.

thanks, very helpful

[Joe Pine]

I am reading through ASOS right now.I was convinced Craster killed his babies - or gave his babies to WW to being killed, but right after Lord Mormont dies, Gilly and her sisters ask Sam to help her and her son because otherwise his brothers (craster's sons) would have come to take him.Now, this means that they haven't been killed as they were children as I expected.. for blood or flesh or evil deeds. Because dead people don't grow up and babies don't come and fetch a newborn (wouldn't it be ridiculous?). So it must be that WW raised up these children to join their own armies.Has this been deeply discussed on this forum before?Do we have 3 categories (WW, recruited humans and undeads) or just 2? How can such recruited humans survive the killing cold surrounding WW? Do WW perform queer magic to transform them into ice beings? Is most of the WW army composed of recruited humans or original WW beings or undeads? Why are these children so important? Why WW prefer to recruit alive children than killing the entire of craster's family and gather more undeads? Are recruited humans more powerful? Or are only craster's son more powerful, since they have crow's blood in their flesh? Maybe they can open the gates under the wall?

Covered in the last 4 or 5 heresy threads. To be honest I'm not sure all your questions were answered, but Craster's Boys have quite a bit of discussion.