I rather have Jon die than....

[Queen Whore]

1. Jon is saved by Tormund

I see it now. Tormund unveils his giant member and slaps the attackers to the ground with it.

[ARYa_Nym]

I think even if he isn't an UnJon he is not going to be the same. I don't think an UnJon would be king of anything btw except for a possible king of the Others or a Night's King.

[The Wolves]

I don't mind if Jon dies but I really don't mind about the possible resurrection and a unJon. I don't think it'll be that bad if he comes back undead.

But I rather he healed from his wounds the normal way, but I'll wait and see what GRRM does before I start complaining.

[Petite Psycophant]

Going off what you were saying about cop outs here is my rank of most preferred to least preferred options:

7. I lose my job, my girlfriend dumps me, and I get paralyzed from the waste down in a car accident with a Prius

8. Jon is revived into UnJon

Also for all of you Theon haters, I hate him as well but he isn't going to die any time soon unless his death serves some big purpose. He has already had his comeuppance and his death would just be kind of whatever at this point.

ROFLMAO! That's exactly how I feel about it! I declare you King of Thread and Beauty... or something...

As for Theon, I feel the same way. If he did die I wouldn't miss but what would be the poitn now. All my hate for Theon is gone. Besides Jaime redeemed himself pretty quickly for a similar crime.

Is there really going to be a good way for this to end? Jon dying sucks, Jon being resurrected as unJon sucks, and Jon recovering without magical interference is unbelievable.

Exactly!!! This is why I hate the entire Jon gets shived scenario. Ugh!

I see it now. Tormund unveils his giant member and slaps the attackers to the ground with it.

LMAO! That would be a SIGHT.

[TalalOfDorne]

I think any resurrection after Cat would be cheep.

And if its at the expense of Theon then Ill go finish Marshs job myself.

[The Wolves]

Theon?

Boring?!

Umph... I wouldn't expect anything more, coming from a Jon fan...

~Kanye shrug~ He is to me. And it's only because I have no emotional attachment(besides hatred)to Theon. His story isn't anything new and he was repetitive throughout ADWD(so were other characters).

But I get why he has fans and why people think his story and character is so interesting

[Florina Laufeyson]

I see it now. Tormund unveils his giant member and slaps the attackers to the ground with it.

HAR! "Want to see my sword, boys? Me member be me greatsword! FEEL ITS WEIGHT AND TREMBLE!" I love me some Tormund.

7. I lose my job, my girlfriend dumps me, and I get paralyzed from the waste down in a car accident with a Prius

:lmao:

I do like the idea of a secret plot with Mel and Tormund but...who knows.

[TalalOfDorne]

I do like the idea of a secret plot with Mel and Tormund but...who knows.

Mel: Ive seen his member in the flames (It didnt catch fire by the way :cool4: ). This is Azor Ahar! reborn!

[Florina Laufeyson]

Mel: Ive seen his member in the flames (It didnt catch fire by the way :cool4: ). This is Azor Ahar! reborn!

:cheers:

ME MEMBER BE LIGHTBRINGER!

If thats so then whoever gets impaled by his member is Nissa Nissa.....*shot*

[Myrish Swamp Thing]

Remember to invite me to the conditional book BBQ. I too want to join.

I've been thinking about this for a while now, and I wanted to start a new thread but I might as well post it here. Here's how Jon gets out of my "characters I dislike" list: First of all, he's just wounded, no dead Jon means no UnJon. And when he recovers he pretty much says "fuck the Night's Watch, I'm going north to take care of business on my own". With maybe a few other Watchmen/Wildlings joining him.

In short: less Harry Potter or Luke Skywalker, more Ripley or John McClane.

[Asha Greyjoy:Feminist Icon]

He has, I just don't care about his suffering. And he doesn't need to be sacrificed for Jon or anybody he just needs to hurry up and die, he's boring and gross.

Different strokes and all but...boring? Theon Turncloak Reek Greyjoy? I just can't understand that, personally. I found his ACOK arc to be second only to Tyrion's (and even then a close second) and the Theon stuff in ADWD was easily the strongest, most well-written prose in the book. What makes him a standout in both these books is the fact that he is more than just a view-to-a-world character that is often too frequent, especially in later books. He is an active participant in what he recognizes are frequently bad decisions and he, above all other characters I think, has the fastest consequences for his actions. Even in ACOK, he seldom made a move without immediate repercussion - from familial humiliation/rejection to mockery and armed resistance around Winterfell to being outsmarted and outplayed by Osha. And the escalating series of awful choices to cover the ones before was both relatable (on a theoretical level, obvs) and meticulously detailed. Theon's increasing awareness of his own fucked-ness grows each chapter and he struggles to remain in control of his guilt and doubt as his usual methods of mental self-defense fail him over and over.

And his ADWD arc is pretty much perfect. So much brutality, horror and fear permeate the environment around this broken man who lives out a microcosm of these events inside his own psychological struggle. The Prince of Winterfell is just the most hauntingly beautiful chapter due to the way Theon alternates between searching for serenity (in the godswood, in his fleeting identities, in fantasies of heroism) and the shattering reality of his current captivity*. I was fucking riveted - but I take it maybe this wasn't everyone's cup of tea?

* Meanwhile, Jon Snow's character...

...wants to be a soldier in Robb's army; kinda struggles with guilt over a vow he made.

...wanders around The NorthNorth with fellow black brothers/loyal direwolf, encounters hot redheaded "enemy" he's supposed to kill; kinda struggles with guilt over a vow he made. (Also, the most awesomest of all Rangers totally dies so that Jon "Wait, WHAT?" Snow may live. And then he...)

...falls in love with the hot redhead and has much much sexytimes; kinda struggles with guilt over a vow he made. (Also, shoots so so many arrows off self-defending wall. Bestie Sam runs Jon Snow for LC! Campaign and wins.)

...is LC of Wall, falls in love with Stannis (though, to be fair, who wouldn't ) and slowly begins to root for and push toward a Stannis victory; kinda struggles with guilt over a vow he made. (Gets stabbed a lot, but probably to facilitate his rebirth as the Single-Handed Savior of the Entire Fucking Planet, Also King of Thrones of All Composition.)

I don't dislike Jon Snow and I actively hope to see something good come his way someday. But to literally sacrifice a character as narratively, psychologically and strategically interesting as Theon is (and has always been) in service of one of the more bland personalities we have available would be such a huge loss. That trade-off would have to result in Jon rising as the black-ice-covered King of the Goddamn Others leading an Undead army against all humanity (in a complete and utter reversal of all prophetic expectations...and most of the fandom's.) And even then, NegaJon would have to really bring the awesome to soften that blow.

IMO, of course. :halo:

[Myrish Swamp Thing]

I don't dislike Jon Snow and I actively hope to see something good come his way someday. But to literally sacrifice a character as narratively, psychologically and strategically interesting as Theon is (and has always been) in service of one of the more bland personalities we have available would be such a huge loss. That trade-off would have to result in Jon rising as the black-ice-covered King of the Goddamn Others leading an Undead army against all humanity (in a complete and utter reversal of all prophetic expectations...and most of the fandom's.) And even then, NegaJon would have to really bring the awesome to soften that blow.

IMO, of course. :halo:

Okay... Apropos of nothing, I just thought of Evil UnJon voiced by Norio Wakamoto. That would be AWESOME!

[The Wolves]

Different strokes and all but...boring? Theon Turncloak Reek Greyjoy? I just can't understand that, personally.

You would be surprised who I find boring in this series.

And I mentioned above that I just can't connect with Theon as a character or person and I hate him to much to pity him so I have no interest in him and therefore he's boring. He's surrounded by cartoons like Ramsey and Roose. I don't care about what's going on in Winterfell because I just don't. He's not surrounded by interesting people just the same backstabbing, plotting side characters we saw in Kingslanding. And ADWD as a whole was ugh.

And I can't see how Theon would be sacrificed for Jon, Jon is like miles away from a heart tree so I don't know where this theory came from, I doubt it happens though.

[Jon of the Dead]

You would be surprised who I find boring in this series.

And I mentioned above that I just can't connect with Theon as a character or person and I hate him to much to pity him so I have no interest in him and therefore he's boring. He's surrounded by cartoons like Ramsey and Roose. I don't care about what's going on in Winterfell because I just don't. He's not surrounded by interesting people just the same backstabbing, plotting side characters we saw in Kingslanding. And ADWD as a whole was ugh.

And I can't see how Theon would be sacrificed for Jon, Jon is like miles away from a heart tree so I don't know where this theory came from, I doubt it happens though.

Agree with every single thing you said, literally...except this line :P

I thought Theon was the one saving grace of aDwD

[Florina Laufeyson]

I find a lot of characters boring.

Im having a lot of trouble seeing what there is left for Theon to do. He does have some Crowning Moment Of Awesome left and it could be some sort of stroke against the Boltons, but after that? Death would be a mercy.

He's surrounded by cartoons like Ramsey and Roose.

Ill give you Ramsay, but Roose isnt cartoony at all.

Great Other Jon would be kinda awesome to be honest.

[The Wolves]

Agree with every single thing you said, literally...except this line :P

I thought Theon was the one saving grace of aDwD

He wasn't bad in ADWD and I do think Theon is a fascinating character if I could just care about him but I just can't relate to someone like Theon and in a book that has so many great characters there's not many I can relate to.

[Raven in Winter]

:cheers:

ME MEMBER BE LIGHTBRINGER!

If thats so then whoever gets impaled by his member is Nissa Nissa.....*shot*

Lol Nice!!!!!!!

I am so looking forward to seeing how Mr. Martin resolves this. Though it is a bit scary.

[Petite Psycophant]

Guys I rather this not become a Jon vs Theon thread. If someone would be so kind to start such a thread though I would happily join in. Other than that please carry on. I don't mind a little bit of off-topicness, I think it's just the natural flow of a conversation to go somewhere else but let's try not to make this into a contest between characters. We're all ASOIAF fans, we're the Fandom of many Banners, now let's all huddle up near the fire, share some meat and mead and sing A Bear and the Maiden Fair (the sexy kumbaya of Westeros).

[jentario]

I disagree about Catelyn. I think bringing her back was a stroke for genius. It demonstrates what loss can do to a person, Brienne meeting her was horror masterpiece and the dramatic buildup for the confrontation with Brienne and Jaime is phenomenal. Really one of the best uses of fantastical elements to enhance a narrative I've come across. So my hopes are up for Jon.

This, but I do think GRRM is overdoing the fake death scenes lately. It seemed to happen in every other chapter in ADWD. It makes you think that characters DO have plot armor and that the series isn't as brutal and unpredictable as it used to be. Hopefully TWOW changes that (and I do think it will).

[jentario]

double post