EstEst Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Right, nice quote. The word slavers is in that quote, what part of that word makes you think they were not indeed slavers being killed? What part of my UPPERCASE POST ABOVE makes you think that I tend to separate killing slavers from killing non-slavers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Guapo Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Right, nice quote. The word slavers is in that quote, what part of that word makes you think they were not indeed slavers being killed?If that quote said "slavers and innocent Tokar wearers ran..." then it might back you up. Unreliable narrator. Apparently Dany confused a bunch of farmers for being slaveowners or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoamingRonin Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 So, there are farmers in Astapor that don't rely on slave labor. I just... lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EstEst Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Unreliable narrator. Apparently Dany confused a bunch of farmers for being slaveowners or something. No, DaarioKnowsBest is trying to convince me that no-one at all was killed that day. He failed so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Guapo Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 So, there are farmers in Astapor that don't rely on slave labor. I just... lol. You are right bad example. They were actually plumbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaarioKnowsBest Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 What part of my UPPERCASE POST ABOVE makes you think that I tend to separate killing slavers from killing non-slavers?Then you are defending shitbag astapori slavers and what they did to the Unsullied as far as I'm concerned if you think they deserve the same treatment as non slavers. You are certainly entitled to defend the slavers if you wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EstEst Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 I defend justice. For everyone. Including shitbag astapori slavers. And, as I posted upthread (which you didn't read), slavers as criminals may be of very different categories. Only 8 noble families of 100 were involved in training Unsullied and baby killings. The rest were other slave traders, and other slave owners. Which is not an equal crime to baby killings. I think somehow that it should be obvious. Every gradation of this stuff has to be judged fairly. In Dany's case, as we know from the books, some Masters involved in training (i.e. worst criminals by any human scale) escaped, which is not very justice-like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaarioKnowsBest Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 I defend justice. For everyone. Including shitbag astapori slavers. And, as I posted upthread (which you didn't read), slavers as criminals may be of very different categories. Only 8 noble families of 100 were involved in training Unsullied and baby killings. The rest were other slave traders, and other slave owners. Which is not an equal crime to baby killings. I think somehow that it should be obvious. Every gradation of this stuff has to be judged fairly. In Dany's case, as we know from the books, some Masters involved in training (i.e. worst criminals by any human scale) escaped, which is not very justice-like.Justice was given to the Astapori slavers IMO.They weren't killing babies so they were the cool kind of slavers is a pretty stupid defense IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jory Cassel Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 I defend justice. For everyone. Including shitbag astapori slavers. And, as I posted upthread (which you didn't read), slavers as criminals may be of very different categories. Only 8 noble families of 100 were involved in training Unsullied and baby killings. The rest were other slave traders, and other slave owners. Which is not an equal crime to baby killings. I think somehow that it should be obvious. Every gradation of this stuff has to be judged fairly. In Dany's case, as we know from the books, some Masters involved in training (i.e. worst criminals by any human scale) escaped, which is not very justice-like. Pray tell, what would be a "justice-like" punishment for scum who sell and buy people like cattle? What mitigation of punishment is to be applied in their cases, or alternatively, in which way should the baby-killing faction's punishment be more draconic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EstEst Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Not "cool kind of slavers", but "not guilty in baby killing kind of slavers". Even in Westeros punishment is different for slave trading (exhile) and murder (execution). Why do you think that execution of every slaver, including slave owners, is just? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoamingRonin Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Not "cool kind of slavers", but "not guilty in baby killing kind of slavers". Even in Westeros punishment is different for slave trading (exhile) and murder (execution). Why do you think that execution of every slaver, including slave owners, is just? Ser Jorah was going to be executed for slave trading. He wasn't exiled... he fled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kungsmurfen Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Pray tell, what would be a "justice-like" punishment for scum who sell and buy people like cattle? What mitigation of punishment is to be applied in their cases, or alternatively, in which way should the baby-killing faction's punishment be more draconic? Youre forgetting that slavery is legal in this city so they've done nothing wrong. Dany simply executes them all because she dosn't want to pay for her slaves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaarioKnowsBest Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Not "cool kind of slavers", but "not guilty in baby killing kind of slavers". Even in Westeros punishment is different for slave trading (exhile) and murder (execution). Why do you think that execution of every slaver, including slave owners, is just?To me it's because they were wealthy and thriving in a city where it's ok to raise the Unsullied that way. It was no secret what was done to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Pray tell, what would be a "justice-like" punishment for scum who sell and buy people like cattle? What mitigation of punishment is to be applied in their cases, or alternatively, in which way should the baby-killing faction's punishment be more draconic?I certainly can't consider every slave-owner in history to be someone who deserved to be killed out of hand. Would we really argue that Themistocles, Cicero, Augustus, George Washington all deserved death for owning slaves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaarioKnowsBest Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 I certainly can't consider every slave-owner in history to be someone who deserved to be killed out of hand. Would we really argue that Themistocles, Cicero, Augustus, George Washington all deserved death for owning slaves?If they are owning slaves in a city where it's permitted to train slaves the Unsullied way I won't get bent out of shape about their death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoamingRonin Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 I certainly can't consider every slave-owner in history to be someone who deserved to be killed out of hand. Would we really argue that Themistocles, Cicero, Augustus, George Washington all deserved death for owning slaves? No, we wouldn't, because they have absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand. Let's stay on topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EstEst Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Pray tell, what would be a "justice-like" punishment for scum who sell and buy people like cattle? What mitigation of punishment is to be applied in their cases, or alternatively, in which way should the baby-killing faction's punishment be more draconic? Someone proposed a community service, a month ago. :) Like work in sewers. On a serious note, I don't know. Murderers have to be executed, of course. Not only those involved in training of Unsullied, but also all other slaves and slavers accused of murder, after a fair trial with witnesses and whatnot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-Ro Posted November 15, 2013 Author Share Posted November 15, 2013 I really think that if dany wanted those free unsullied she could have just killed the guys she was dealing with to get them. She did not have to kill everyone above the age of 13 for it. And if she wanted to free the slaves after, she could have done so without such violence. She has 8k unsullied and three dragons, all she has to do is say all the slaves are free and anyone who tries to stop me will be killed. She had the force to do so and no one would have stopped her. The affects of doing it this way are two fold. Not everyone dies, and there is not a total and complete collapse of an entire cities people. Also I dont like these arguments about the age of majority being 13. I dont really care. If in our world a group of people came in and started killing everyone above the age of 21 I think there would be outrage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 No, we wouldn't, because they have absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand. Let's stay on topic. It is relevant. Much of this discussion turns on whether it is legitimate to kill people for being slave-owners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordStoneheart Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Youre forgetting that slavery is legal in this city so they've done nothing wrong. This is a horrible defense. According to themselves they've done nothing wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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