Lewyn Martell

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About Lewyn Martell

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  1. I don't accept R+L=J is certain at all. In fact, we don't even know for certain that Lyanna was pregnant or gave birth in the Tower of Joy. About the only thing we can say for certain about Jon is that he has one Stark parent, i.e. either Lyanna as mother or Brandon or Ned as father. A fruitful route of enquiry is to ask whether Ashara Dayne bore a living child (not stillborn) and is still living herself (not drowned in a suicide). Working backwards, what caused Ashara's suicide: the killing of her brother Arthur Dayne or the death of her child. The killing of her brother seems a remote possibility. The death of her child is only a basis for suicide if her child died. We know from Edric Dayne that the Dayne family hold Ned in high rather than low regard, which is hardly likely if he was responsible for her suicide either by killing Arthur Dayne or by fathering a child on her which was stillborn. Even if we accept Ashara Dayne's child was stillborn and she killed herself afterwards, there is still the question of who the father of her child was. Some mooted possibilities are (i) Ned, (ii) Brandon, (iii) Aerys and (iv) Rhaegar.
  2. Two good reasons: (1) Being Rhaegar's (only) daughter is different from being Aerys' younger daughter. Targaryen succession in such a case has never been fixed and a similar situation is what led to the (first) Dance of Dragons. Viserys has EVERY interest in having Dany believe she is his younger sister rather than the child of his older brother. (2) To claim that Dany is Rhaegar's daughter seems far-fetched and remote. How could one even proof that Rhaegar fathered her when he is dead. It is much more plausible and believable to say that Dany is Rhaella's daughter. Of course Rhaella is dead also but maternity is certain whereas paternity is not. Regarding the claim that Rhaella was pregnant on Dragonstone, gave birth and died in childbirth we have only the words of whomever was on Dragonstone with them - principally Sir Willem Darry. I think there is a chance that it will turn out that Dany is some Lyseni baby that Sir Willem Darry acquired in order to be traded for support for Viserys's claim to the Iron Throne. It will turn out that Dany has zero Targaryen blood in her.
  3. Romaine3: Robb needs to take responsibility for his own decision to marry Jeyne Westerling. He was well aware of House Frey and he had Catelyn there to tell him. It certainly wasn't for Edmure to explain it to him. Edmure even agreed to marry a Frey himself to try to retrieve the situation.
  4. The babies are central to ASOIAF. Running through them, my thoughts are as follows: Jon Snow: Must have one Stark parent, i.e. Lyanna, Brandon or Ned. Aegon/Young Griff: Is either son of Rhaegar and Elia or a complete outsider. I lean very much towards him being a complete outsider, i.e. fAegon. He is modelled on real world pretenders Lambert Simnel and Perkin Warbeck who fronted rebellions against Henry VII in the years after the Wars of the Roses. Daenarys: Is she really the child of Rhaella and Aerys? There are a number of reasons to doubt it: Rhaella was 40 and had numerous miscarriages, stillbirths and infant deaths. Daenarys was born nine moons after Rhaella left King's Landing. The duration of a normal pregnancy is ten moons from the last menstrual period of the mother. There must be some doubt as to whether Rhaella was ever pregnant at all. Rhaella died giving birth to Daenarys - who acted as her wet nurse during the first few days of her life (and the next year or so) - it would have had to have been a woman from Dragonstone. There's also the issue of Daenarys' inconsistent childhood memories - the house with the red door and the lemon tree. Daenarys could be some random Lyseni orphan (which possibility GRRM teases in the scene of Tyrion and Jorah in the brothel in Volantis) or, alternatively, she could be the child of Rhaegar and Lyanna or someone else. If she is the child of Rhaegar and Lyanna why would Sir Willem Darry lie about it and say she is Viserys's sister - because as the child of Rhaegar and Lyanna there is an open question as to whether she or Viserys has a better claim to the Iron Throne whereas if she is Viserys's sister his claim is clearly better than hers. I do think the random Lyseni orphan outcome would be very characteristically GRRM. Alfie Allen, who plays Theon on GoT, said the following in an interview about asking GRRM who Jon Snow's real parents are: To me, the key questions on this are: (1) Was Ashara Dayne pregnant (as related in Barristan Selmy's internal thoughts)? (2) If so, who was the father of her child? (3) Was Ashara Dayne's child really stillborn (as related in Barristan Selmy's internal thoughts)? (4) Why did Ashara Dayne kill herself or disappear? (5) Why do the Daynes hold Ned in such high regard (as related to Arya by Edric Dayne) even though Ashara Dayne killed herself/disappeared? (6) What is the danger that Jon presents to Cat and her children? Or, to put it another way, why would Ned not just tell Cat that Jon is Rhaegar and Lyanna's child if that is the case. (7) Did GRRM screw with Dan and Dave in order to protect his novels from their TV dramatisation? We now know that the answer that Dan and Dave gave because that has been reflected in GoT this season. However, note that GRRM didn't say whether they were right or wrong; he just smiled. Although the words "at that point" imply that George did confirm the position expressly subsequently, was that really the case? How much has GRRM told Dan and Dave about what will happen? In March 2014 Hollywood Reporter reported Dan and Dave as saying: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/game-thrones-showrunners-know-how-687589 To return to the questions I posted, some answers below: (1) Was Ashara Dayne pregnant (as related in Barristan Selmy's internal thoughts)? Answer: Yes - Barristan Selmy was in King's Landing at the same time as Elia and is in no doubt about her pregnancy. (2) If so, who was the father of her child? Answer: We don't know - it could be Ned, it could be Brandon, it could be Rhaegar Targaryen, it could be someone else. (3) Was Ashara Dayne's child really stillborn (as related in Barristan Selmy's internal thoughts)? Answer: Possibly? (4) Why did Ashara Dayne kill herself or disappear? Answer: GRRM has confirmed that her body was never found. (5) Why do the Daynes hold Ned in such high regard (as related to Arya by Edric Dayne) even though Ashara Dayne killed herself/disappeared? (6) What is the danger that Jon presents to Cat and her children? Or, to put it another way, why would Ned not just tell Cat that Jon is Rhaegar and Lyanna's child if that is the case. Answer: The danger that Jon presents is being a legitimate child of Brandon Stark or Ned Stark? This is ultimately about the age of Jon relative to Robb. If Robb is older than Jon then Jon could not be Brandon Stark's son and would have been conceived after Ned was already married to Cat and could not be legitimate. However, if Jon is older than Robb then Jon could have been fathered by Brandon Stark on Ashara after a secret wedding between them or could have been fathered by Ned Stark on Ashara after a secret wedding between them and fathered prior to Ned's wedding to Cat. (7) Did GRRM screw with Dan and Dave in order to protect his novels from their TV dramatisation? Answer: Should we accept what GoT shows because that is clearly what Dan and Dave believe? Unless GRRM is screwing with Dan and Dave then we have to accept that. However, I believe that GRRM is or was screwing with them. I think that GRRM very deliberately led them to think that they were right. He could always correct them later if he wanted to - but, after season 4 he decided to cease involvement with GoT, being unhappy in particular with the Talisa/Robb storyline. It's very obvious that Dan and Dave have only the sketchiest idea what is happening with the characters and are just rushing to bring things to an end. I think GRRM is going to enjoy having the last laugh on them.
  5. I've never understood why the Tullys agreed not only to fight with Robb and the North but also to bring the Riverlands into a kingdom with the North under Robb as King. First, the societies of the Riverlands and the North don't have any particular closeness. The North and Dorne are different from the other five kingdoms to a significantly greater degree than the five kingdoms are from each other. Secondly, why should Edmure Tully accept Robb as his liege lord? Robb, his nephew, is significantly younger than him. The Tullys could have done as the North did and declare independence under a Tully king which would have been allied with the King in the North. Yes, there is an element of gratitude to the Northmen for coming south, raising the siege of Riverrun, etc. However, the only reason that Riverrun is under siege is because of Cat's and Ned's actions, not because of anything Hoster or Edmure have done. Thirdly, and perhaps most importantly, unlike the North which is both geographically defined and geographically defensive, the Riverlands is completely wide open. It's probably the least defensible of all of the seven kingdoms. It's very difficult to see how the Riverlands could sustain itself as an independent kingdom, something it has never been in the past. The right approach for Robb and the North would have been to ally with Renly and/or Stannis to overthrow Joffrey, Cersei, Tywin and the Lannisters generally and put either Stannis or Renly on the throne in King's Landing, after the Lannisters are defeated, make Kevan Lannister head of the house and allow him to retain Casterly Rock, and maybe make Addam Marbrand, or someone else from a non-Lannister Westerlands house, Warden of the West. After Stannis lost the Battle of the Blackwater the writing was on the wall for Robb but, more significantly, for the Tullys. The only good argument I have seen for what the Riverlands lords did is that they thought Edmure useless and that it is better to have as king a competent leader such as Robb. However, it was perfectly possible for the Riverlander lords to accept Robb as war leader of the combined North/Riverlands force without acknowledging him as king. In my view, the Riverlander lords proclaiming Robb as their king is a case where the realism and credibility of the Song of Ice and Fire falls down.
  6. I have seen some theories that Val and Jon Snow are sister and brother. It's a variation on the idea of a twin birth at Tower of Joy. Under this theory Mance Rayder is Rhaegar Targaryen, Dalla is Lyanna and Val and Jon are their children. I was thinking about this when I thought of Jean Valjean - the principal character in Les Miserables. Les Miserables also has characters who are brother and sister without being aware of it. http://lesmiserables.wikia.com/wiki/Gavroche_Thénardier A great question to ask George RR Martin is whether he thinks that Les Miserables has influenced A Song of Ice and Fire in any way.