bent branch Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 I love this debate and have followed many others throughout the years. And I still can't make any guesses. I do make note that we don't know what happened to Maege Mormont or Galbart Glover since being sent to find Howland. But I digress...What I really want to know is where was the HM coming from and where was he/she going? Wasn't HM seen near the Glass Garden? Can that be perhaps near or on the way to or from the rookery or Maester's tower? A certain letter being sent?Total crackpot I know, but it just jumped in my head while reading this thread. If you google map of Winterfell you can find some good maps that will help you see how it is laid out. The glass gardens are in the northwest corner of Winterfell. Immediately adjacent to the glass gardens are the broken tower (where Little Walder's body was found), the only entrance into the God's Wood, and the lichyard. The next structures are the crypts and the first keep. The HM must be coming from one of these areas since this area sort of dead ends. All of this is near the north gate. The maester's tower and the rookery are about as far as you can get from this area and still be in Winterfell. Could the HM be heading there? Certainly, but from this area the HM could be heading practically anywhere in Winterfell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balerion's Whiskers Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 ok bemused, Benjen is now a toss up with Hal Mollen on my list. You've made a convincing argument. The clincher was the encounter with the Liddle...it does look like that he had some sort of orders to let them proceed. Given that the northmen would go to great lengths to protect Ned's sons, it appears that he was in the only shelter available for a reason and knew exactly who he was speaking with. Why wouldn't he try to get them to a holdfast where they could be protected? Instead, he gently questioned them and then slipped out, leaving a gift of food. Very subtle writing, but hints are there if you look.If the only way into Winterfell is through the crypts, then it is Benjen. If there are other ways into the castle,(hidden doors through the walls and such) then trusted retainers would have this knowledge. I do agree that the existence of the crypt entrance is highly likely and that knowledge of this has been lost. Even if Rickard knew and shared with Brandon, that's gone now. I don't think Ned ever knew. (and most likely Rickard didn't either)I do think that GRRM gives us 'rabbit trails' that go nowhere to keep us from figuring things out for sure (Ned's woman in the boat for one) and it wouldn't be out of character for him to give us a few different 'trails' in this case either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balerion's Whiskers Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 I just had to come back and post what a refreshing thread this is...no flaming, snarkiness or rudeness. Here lately, it seems that you can't post anything without someone getting angry and obnoxious. That's why I rarely post...why bother if no one listens and wants a sensible debate?Even though many of us in this thread have differing points of view, we've produced our arguments in a civilized way which is what this board should be about. We're here for our love of the world that GRRM has gifted us with and even though we have differing interpretations on what he's telling us, we should all be respectful of how others see the material.My thanks to everyone in this conversation for acting like adults and keeping the tone of this thread decent.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The scourge of westeros Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 I just had to come back and post what a refreshing thread this is...no flaming, snarkiness or rudeness. Here lately, it seems that you can't post anything without someone getting angry and obnoxious. That's why I rarely post...why bother if no one listens and wants a sensible debate?Even though many of us in this thread have differing points of view, we've produced our arguments in a civilized way which is what this board should be about. We're here for our love of the world that GRRM has gifted us with and even though we have differing interpretations on what he's telling us, we should all be respectful of how others see the material.My thanks to everyone in this conversation for acting like adults and keeping the tone of this thread decent..this^^^ it's really disconcerting at times how confrontational and dismissive certain posters can be given that we don't even have the full story to work from; were all just making educated guesses in the end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The hand that holds Dawn Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 OK, I thought I would re-read some of the sample chapters today at work (Its Friday, cut me some slack).....and I noticed something very interesting... I've never done a spoiler quote before, so if this doesn't work, can a mod please fix? Spoiler In Theon's winds of winter sample chapter, we get the following, "He'd wanted to rip it off Umber's face, to make certain that underneath was only an empty socket, not a black eye shining with malice. Instead he had whimpered through his broken teeth and said, "I am — " " — a turncloak and a kinslayer," Crowfood had finished." and how does the hooded man greet Theon? -- "Theon Turncloak. Theon Kinslayer." Coincidence? I think not. This really leads me to believe that the hooded man is at least part of the great norther conspiracy and possible an Umber. (Could it even be Crowfood himself?) Thoughts? Edit: Crappolla, I just found the exact speculation online...guess I don't have that original of a finding.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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