Jonathan N

I can't agree more. If I could make GRRM to read one comment on this blog, this would be it.

This! :-)

This. Can't agree more. How on earth did giving Sansa to the Boltons "secured northmen"??? He didn't have "to love her more than himself" to not give her away to the Boltons, he could have just kept her.

dp

Littlefinger's giving Sansa away isn't believable. He has been acting for a number of seasons as being obsessed with her. Sansa's believing that she can exert revenge on Boltons on her own isn't believable. She has done nothing in the previous seasons that showed she was planning revenge or that she considered herself capable of taking back Winterfell populated by the army of her enemies.

Littlefinger sending Sansa to Winterfell never made any sense. Just like JCRB pointed out upthread, Prince Doran sending Trystane to KL didn't make any sense. Yes, there is some kind of laughable explanation for the viewers, but this explanation doesn't withstand any scrutiny.

The point JCRB is making is precisely that it is NOT the same thing, even if the action is the same or similar -- books make it organic, believable, consistent with the characterization, and the show doesn't. And it is not just an opinion of some feminist book purists - if you check out professional reviews, you'll see that this criticism is quite widespread...maybe, just maybe because it is actually well deserved, don't you think?

Sorry, DP

This. Such an obvious plot hole. Doesn't make any sense.

I agree. Rockroi is my hero - hilarious essay, and very much to the point.

First of all, there is no need to be rude. Second of all, we don't think we can write a better story than D&D, we think GRRM has written a better story than D&D. There is a difference. And we don't idealize GRRM either. If he started on WOW as soon as he finished DWD, we wouldn't be in a situation we are in right now. This is just a statement of fact, has nothing to do with the sense of entitlement.

This! *love the sarcasm, just love it!*

This *love the sarcasm, just love it!*

dp

This

I agree with the main point--lack of subtlety in writing this season, female characters reduced to certain stereotypes, etc. You put it very well, thanks for your posts. But how can you say Arya is reduced to a stereotype, and claim Braavos storyline is working in the same paragraph???

Can't agree more

This

Oh I agree with your point, that is the show's implication. The show definitely positions Jaqen as a friend/mentor, and the Waif as somewhat hostile. But I am just saying the viewers don't really see Arya changing, acquiring those enviable faceless men skills. We saw her learning and growing when she was traveling with the Hound, we saw the experience changing her. With faceless men training, it just doesn't ring true to me. It is kind of schematic. Even when she was scrubbing the floors, she was just moving her hand back and force or in circles, not really cleaning anything. And I am generally annoyed that they made too many characters too good looking this season. The Waif should be uglier/more damaged. Yazzan (sp?) should be grossly overweight. And don't even get me started on Dorne. Prince Doran Martell is supposed to be sort of ill and decrepit. It is not that I am such a purist that any deviation from the book description irks me; it is that the changes result in loss of individuality, loss of personality. Everybody is young, thin, and good looking. It is a blessing they had to cast Tyrion and Varys early on, before the apparent advent of "beautiful people."

I agree with "one of the worst decisions" characterization here, but I think it is debatable which D&D decision have been the worst one so far, there were quite a few really bad ones this season. My vote goes to the show Littlefinger sending Sansa away. Given as all earlier episodes portrayed him as being this sort of pedophile, obsessed with Sansa, it didn't make any sense whatsoever, from character development perspective. And Sansa going along with it for "revenge" is a close second, IMO.

Meh: Arya. What she is doing seems interesting but it seems less tied to the plot than Dany and significantly smaller after that scene North of the Wall. She seems like what she is doing is interesting, just not at all important. I agree, but I also agree with the post you responded to: the show failed to portray how Arya develops faceless men's skillset--they show her being slapped when she lies to them, but she says things in exactly the same way, we are supposed to believe she is becoming much better at lying, but we don't really see that.

Interesting thought about the arm. I thought they put it on his forearm, rather than fingers, because he wouldn't be able to wear gloves a la JonCon to cover it up, being a slave and all. But maybe you are right. Would be great to have the Red Priest show up.

hallam, on 01 Jun 2015 - 12:08 AM, said: Seriously hallam???? I am not a diehard show supporter, admittedly, but I discovered the books having watched the show first. Although I don't post that much myself, I thoroughly enjoy the discussions here, including people speculating on what may be in store for the readers/viewers. It is quite ridiculous to try to shut people up on a blog the whole purpose of which is to give people a platform to express themselves.

To be completely honest, I don't find flayed women and imprisoning innocent men particularly entertaining either, per se. I do understand that when these are organic to the plot, and used sparingly, they may be necessary to tell the story, but in and out of itself, I don't find flaying and rape entertaining, no. And neither do a lot of other people, hence the storm of criticism that you apparently call the whining.

This. How on earth is Sansa's or Gilly's or Daenerys' rape entertaining???