TheLeviathan73

With that last part I certainly agree.

I commend your honesty, you are one of the few anti-show people I've seen with the capacity to be fair even while being harsh.

Martin's co-author tweeted that he doesn't give them storylines separate for the show. Only what he plans to write.

He's faced a lot of moral dilemmas. He doesn't have to be a raging, evil maniac to make this choice. He just has to believe in his destiny and a utilitarian view on life above all else. And he does. Maybe another way to say this is that he can love his daughter and still do this. In fact, if he didn't love his daughter he might have done it long ago. Since this is confirmed to happen (for all intents and purposes) by his hand - the geographical differences are rather moot. The truth is that he's going to face a need at some point soon in the books and he'll resort to his greatest sacrifice.

You wouldn't be the first person to level that criticism at Martin. And I disagree about the characterization. Stannis has ultimately put his belief in his destiny above everything else because he believes that he alone can save the realm. This is just the hardest sacrifice of them all, but one his own words (from the book) foreshadows that he understand he might have to make at some point. He's following the Agamemnon storyline that Martin chose for him. People are confusing the horror of the sacrifice with a break in character. The moral dilemma he was facing he has faced before and each time he made the same choice - make the sacrifice to save lives and fulfill the destiny he believes he has. To NOT sacrifice Shireen and take his chances without Mel's blessing would've been the true break in character.

She pretty much confirms that if George tells them something, he's going to do it. So there you go book trolls...confirmation it was going to happen by Stannis' hand. Get over it, it's the character arc Martin has had in mind for him since the beginning and plenty of smart readers saw it coming.

You should just routinely post this all the time. The "the show mistreats women but not the books" may be the most obnoxious meme out there. The books pretty much abuse everyone, but especially women.

George has missed that memo for awhile. In any case, it's precisely that righteous belief in himself that has compelled him to make all sorts of morally horrifying choices. He has to make these sacrifices to fulfill his destiny as the true king and savior of Westeros. That's what he has always believed and when you couple it with a profound utilitarian approach to life saving and the pervasive influence of a religious zealot that serves as one his primary advisors....you get shit like this. Like it or not, this is coming.

The brutalization of women and girls is a consistent theme in the books and in the show. Hell, the brutalization of basically anyone that isn't a powerful man. Also, for those that over-emphasize Stannis' predicament in the show, the title of the episode and his conversation with Shireen are very relevant to his motivations. It's the same motivation he's had from the start of his campaign for the throne - his belief that what he is doing is destiny for the good of the realm. He gets that directly from Melisandre and he is basically eating out of her hand. (In both the book and the show) There is nothing inconsistent about this with the books, when he reaches a point of doubt again he will seize upon his perceived destiny and do whatever it takes to achieve it. As he's done from the start.

My takeaway from it was that it had less to do with the desperation of the circumstances and more about just how deep in Stannis' brain Mel is.

I don't think he did this because of desperation, I think his motive was that Melisandre told him the only path forward was to sacrifice her. Ultimately, as things started to go bad he thought back on her powers and how her visions have been accurate thus far and concluded he could delay as long as he wants but it wouldn't change the choice he had to make. Hence the conversation with Shireen.

It was rushed, but Stannis himself in the books foreshadows this with his talk of the nature of sacrifice. Melisandre won't sacrifice her against the wishes of Stannis, people are just going to have to accept that this is going to happen in some form or fashion.