Tar

[westerosian]

I wonder if the tar that is used to cover heads to prove the victims identity is not a black pitch, but rather a clear or nearly clear shellac?

It seems that there is a general agreement that the heads are coated with a translucent resin.

[CassBlackfyre]

I always just assumed it was black tar, the same thing that was used in medieval times to preserve the severed heads on spikes. Like william wallace.

[Missionary]

I always assumed that they got their tar from peat, so that would make it black right?

Edit: We need a new book.

[King Pellinore]

You can also get tar from trees (pine-tar, birch-tar, etc). I'm not sure if it's any lighter or more translucent.

[westerosian]

yes, I had initially assumed it was black too. But that would make identifying the head much harder. a clear tar would allow a better identification of the head.

"by having a criminal with similar features executed and his head dipped in tar so the Freys falsely believe him to be Davos." DD29

I agree its a fine point, but Vulcans embrace technicality.

[CassBlackfyre]

yes, I had initially assumed it was black too. But that would make identifying the head much harder. a clear tar would allow a better identification of the head.

"by having a criminal with similar features executed and his head dipped in tar so the Freys falsely believe him to be Davos." DD29

I agree its a fine point, but Vulcans embrace technicality.

But it wasn't Davos head, so a clear tar would have gave it away!

[westerosian]

that's the idea a translucent substance of some type. just not black tar.

[westerosian]

yeah, maybe you are right. it just seems that a clear coating would give a general but unclear picture of the identity, but so a person of similar features would be needed but it could still fool the observer. see through, but hazy. my idea of a pitch covered head is that they all more or less look the same aside from size and general shape of head. not nearly enough to base an identification on. the tar would be at least 500 mm ( a guess) which would make any sort of identification difficult at best. never having seen a head dipped in tar I don't really know how easy they are to identify.

[westerosian]

p 388 DD ' your coloring, beard, common features,'

what use would similar coloring and a trimmed beard be under black pitch?

the entire passage seems to suggest visibility.

[Missionary]

I do like to think of it being translucent. Like candle wax only grey/black.

[westerosian]

does kind of change your picture of things huh?

[westerosian]

yes, whatever kind of 'tar' it is I don't know. just not black tar. you can see through it.

[Missionary]

does kind of change your picture of things huh?

It does in a way yes. It validates putting your enemies heads on spikes for one. why do it if its unrecognisable? :P

[westerosian]

yeah

[Missionary]

It also now makes sense why Ramsay Flayed the fake Bran and Rickons heads in aCoK, so they become unrecognisable through translucent tar.

Thanks OP for pointing this out to me, I always assumed it was pitch black tar :)

I see you're relatively new here as well. Welcome :cheers:

[westerosian]

when I said it changes your picture of things I meant that when one reads a book on creates visual images of people and events. this one Is likely very different from the one I would assume most people make when picturing a tar covered head.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

p 388 DD ' your coloring, beard, common features,'

what use would similar coloring and a trimmed beard be under black pitch?

the entire passage seems to suggest visibility.

Does the books say that THIS specific head is even tarred? I recall Manderly saying something about using the onion shoved in the double's mouth to twist the features of the face. I don't recall anything about tar being used on this specific head itself, though.

[westerosian]

What!?! it is stated twice. p 388 " we dipped your head in tar" and " we tarred him well" Also, that it is not explicitly stated that a clear tar is used in this case would tend to show that a clear tar is common practice. I kind of thought this issue might have already been discussed. I just wanted to post something on this board since I have never done so before. Also, ' we tarred him well' would go to show that a heavy and thick coating was used to further distort the view of the head.

[Lady Fevre Dream]

What!?! it is stated twice. p 388 " we dipped your head in tar" and " we tarred him well" Also, that it is not explicitly stated that a clear tar is used in this case would tend to show that a clear tar is common practice. I kind of thought this issue might have already been discussed. I just wanted to post something on this board since I have never done so before. Also, ' we tarred him well' would go to show that a heavy and thick coating was used to further distort the view of the head.

That's why it was phrased as a question? I've read it many times, but I couldn't quite remember. Thanks for the quotes, though. It does answer my question, doesn't it? Ironically, I had just taken out ADWD to read some Davos chapters while my daughter was supposed to be in class, alas.........class was cancelled.

[Iona]

I was always under the impression that the tar was dark, but I never thought they would use a very thick coat. You could still be able to see the features and recognize the heads (like Sansa did when Joff took her to look at Ned's head on the spike). With regards to the Davos chapter, I thought that bit about "we tarred him well" was suggesting that they added an extra layer to make sure no-one notices the head is a hoax.