What would have the kings of winter thought of Ned

[Bright Blue Eyes]

Are these in a specific book or scattered around several books? I remember Bran in the crypt talking about a slew of Starks. I'm currently rereading the series and I'm on ACoK currently. I do remember the Wolf's Den, but not the Rape of the Sisters.

Pretty scattered. The Rape of the Sisters is mentioned in Dance, Davos I, when he is on the Sisters.

[E-Ro]

The information on stark kings of old is scattered but interesting when it does come up.

[MagnusPrime]

The information is spread throughout all the books that the Stark history of rule was not all like that of ned and rickard.

Like many said Ned wasn't ever truly in a position of power without the swords to back it up in King's Landing. Which makes me wonder if Tywin had a sizable force of men when he was hand?

As ruler of winterfell and the north Ned would have the respect of his forefathers, but because he still pledged allegiance to a throne which for the most part never concerned itself with the north just because his best bro was sitting there is probably a sore spot.

And it boggles the mind that Ned did not stay in better contact with Jon and Robert throughout the years. He was an intergral part of throwing down thast regime did he not think it was his place to make his views heard on how the kingdom was being run? At the very least he should have made yearly visits to kings landing to see how Robert was doing. Writing and visiting regularly probably would have slowed Robert's decline.

Ned had the chance to influence all of westeros and yet it seems he just chose to sequester himself from the other 6 kingdoms except in times of crisis.

[David C. Hunter]

They would have disapproved of him going south, they would have disapproved of him forsaking his honor on the Septon Baelor, they probably would of disapproved of him marrying a southerner, but he was still a northmen in the end and they would seek revenge without mercy

[House_Scattergood]

It seems to me that ppl try to defend Ned's end because his plans got foiled by an 11 years naive girl. But what about the fact that his plans got shit stormed all over by an 11 year old girl

[House_Scattergood]

I also keep hearing about what he should have done the years following Roberts rebellion. Its weird I've read each book some could say "too many" times and I've never even thought of that. He had the opportunity to spread a mass string I influence over the governing of the realm and didn't so that alone is enough reason to say he allowed the lanisters to become too powerful. Imagine a small council with Ned Stannis and Jon Arron

[Winter's Knight]

It seems to me that ppl try to defend Ned's end because his plans got foiled by an 11 years naive girl. But what about the fact that his plans got shit stormed all over by an 11 year old girl

Ned's plans were blown by Ned. He walked into the Throne Room and denounced Joff while surrounded by Goldcloaks and Lannister guards.

Ned's "plans" basically ran as follows:

1. Warn Cersei
   
2. Trust LF.
   
3. Denounce Joff.
   

[MagnusPrime]

We know Ned was not a dummy but GRRM chose to potray ned in a way that has you hitting your head against a wall.

He gets to KL and sees that the place is swarming with lannister men. Sure he had his house hold guard but damn if he wasn't quick to lend them out and diminish the amount he kept for his personal guard. At the very least you would of thought he would send word back home to send 500 or so more men to augment his strength.

Then there is the not sending the girls away back to winterfell as soon as he woke up after being attacked in the streets by Jaime. Fucking. Lannister. It may just be me but if the brother of the woman whom I suspect of betraying my best bro attacked me and then said best bro went off fucking hunting then it is time to pull up stakes call the banners and let loose the wolves of war.

Ned should have realized that Robert wasn't willing to fight for control of his throne that so many spilled their blood to win for him then he should not bother to risk his and his family's lives to try and keep his regime in power.

He should have heeded his house's words and left the fools to play their little games.

[Gerold_Hightower]

The moment he fights Dayne, Hightower and Whent = That's our boy!

The moment he tells Cersei he knows = What a moron!

[JimJam]

The information is spread throughout all the books that the Stark history of rule was not all like that of ned and rickard.

Like many said Ned wasn't ever truly in a position of power without the swords to back it up in King's Landing. Which makes me wonder if Tywin had a sizable force of men when he was hand?

As ruler of winterfell and the north Ned would have the respect of his forefathers, but because he still pledged allegiance to a throne which for the most part never concerned itself with the north just because his best bro was sitting there is probably a sore spot.

And it boggles the mind that Ned did not stay in better contact with Jon and Robert throughout the years. He was an intergral part of throwing down thast regime did he not think it was his place to make his views heard on how the kingdom was being run? At the very least he should have made yearly visits to kings landing to see how Robert was doing. Writing and visiting regularly probably would have slowed Robert's decline.

Ned had the chance to influence all of westeros and yet it seems he just chose to sequester himself from the other 6 kingdoms except in times of crisis.

It was suprising for me too. With exception of Greyjoy's rebellion, Ned was staying in the North and didn't care about Seven kingdoms at all. Robert is rightfully blamed for being bad and lazy king, but Eddard has its own part of responsibility. He certainly knew that Robert isn't so capable and focused on ruling the kingdom and Jon Arryn was already old during the rebellin.

[Bright Blue Eyes]

It was suprising for me too. With exception of Greyjoy's rebellion, Ned was staying in the North and didn't care about Seven kingdoms at all. Robert is rightfully blamed for being bad and lazy king, but Eddard has its own part of responsibility. He certainly knew that Robert isn't so capable and focused on ruling the kingdom and Jon Arryn was already old during the rebellin.

But what should he do? Neither planes nor skype are available, and a two-way trip to Kings Landing would take half a year.

[The Fallen]

I figured the stories would be scattered. I do recall some of them, but as I was flying through the series (I read all the books during a 6-month period) I didn't retain everything. Another point is that the times are different. That's why I joked around about the Kings taking modernity into account.

I'm not surprised that Ned followed an isolationist policy because that seems to be the Stark way. They've never had ambitions beyond the North, including the Kings. Also, the rebellion and everything that led to it might have just left such a bad taste in his mouth that he decided to never deal with the South again. Their last dealings south of the Neck didn't go well for them.

It seems to me that the events that led to Ned being captured developed pretty fast. Lets pick up when Jaime surprises and attacks Ned. After he awakes he immediately makes plans for the girls and non-essential staff to leave KL. He didn't want to use the Kingsroad, he felt it was safer on a ship, and the only delay was in finding someone they could trust with a fast-enough ship. He also realized that he was short-handed, but there was no time to bring any down. He probably feels secure enough in the thought that he can count on Robert.

Ned telling Cersei to flee wasn't a disclosure of his 'plans'. That suggest that Ned was scheming, planning and plotting. Ned himself wasn't going to take any actions. That would've been up to Robert. Ned is simply warning about what will happen when Robert finds out. Unfortunately for Ned, Robert can't be saved from himself and returns mortally wounded. At that point Ned's choices become slim and none.

[Ser Hippie]

Ned telling Cersei to flee wasn't a disclosure of his 'plans'. That suggest that Ned was scheming, planning and plotting. Ned himself wasn't going to take any actions. That would've been up to Robert. Ned is simply warning about what will happen when Robert finds out. Unfortunately for Ned, Robert can't be saved from himself and returns mortally wounded. At that point Ned's choices become slim and none.

It doesn't reveal "plans" because Ned doesn't really have a plan beyond hoping Cersei runs away.

Ned tells Cersei he's going to tell Robert the truth when he returns from his hunt. Cersei doesn't need specifics at that point, she simply needs to eliminate Ned as a threat, which she does by paying off the Gold Cloaks and moving quickly (with the benefit of Ned being unwilling to tell Robert the truth beforehand) to frame the situation as Ned making a play for power.

If he hadn't told her, she wouldn't have known what a threat he was to her (or, he could acted differently following their meeting, of course). Even after he reveals his knowledge to Cersei, he could have acted more prudently by seizing Cersei/the children like Renly wanted, or telling Robert (or maybe Ser Barristan), leaving immediately, not trusting LF, etc.

[House_Scattergood]

For who ever said it would take half a year to get from winterfel to kl or vice versa needs to read the first few chapters of agot. It takes about a month each way.

[MagnusPrime]

Do not forget that we have ravens to communicate by. And the letters do not have to be a daily thing but atleast every two weeks or month. Ned could hve boarded a ship at white harbor to go to kings landing. And even if they went by land they would not be traveling with such a large retinue as Robert and his family came with. For one there would be no damn carriage to worry about! So the starks could make good time going by either mode of travel and atleast they could pop in to say hello to hoster and edmure if traveling by land.

Ned going back to a isolationist policy in regards to the north was not possible. The man helped bring down the old regime and installed his best buddy on the throne. If anything the actions of the last regime proved that the starks had to show the realm that they were apart of westeros as well and that they had close ties with the royal family.

Also ned never got his revenge for any member of his family. Aerys was killed by jaime and rheaghar by Robert. Ned did not spill one drop of targ blood.

[Torron]

They would have thought he was a total badass and been really pissed at the Lannisters.

[The Fallen]

Ned's biggest mistake was not telling Robert. One of Robert's last orders could have been for his family to be seized and to have anyone loyal to him back Ned. Not sure how many swords that would've been since Cersei had managed to surround him by Lannister loyalists. Either way, Ned is dead. May the Kings keep his crypt nice and cold until he arrives. If they're not too ashamed of him. By the way, how about Ned shooting down Cersei's offer of a good time in return for Ned's silence? That had to really hurt the ego.

I didn't mean that he killed any Targaryens himself, although had Jaime not killed Aerys we might have seen Ice unsheathed to dispense justice. But he got revenge by helping to destroy the Targaryen dynasty. What the Starks, Arryns, Baratheons and Tullys accomplished was major in my eyes. Is it underrated? And which of those four Houses is the most powerful? Well, three really. The Tullys are at the bottom of the totem pole.