Line of succession to the Iron Throne

[srini]

I have some confusion over the Line of succession to the Iron Throne as per the customs, not game of thrones

The line of succession to the Iron Throne is the ordered sequence of all those people eligible to succeed to the Iron Throne of the Seven Kingdoms, according to customs.

Baratheon Line with Cersei's children:

Tommen Baratheon, Current King

Myrcella Baratheon or Stannis Baratheon (Not clear on their order)

Shireen Baratheon

Baratheon Line without Cersei's children:

Stannis Baratheon, Current King

Shireen Baratheon

Any idea on who is currently in line after "Shireen Baratheon".

Targaryen Line:

Aegon VI Targaryen (If Young Griff is not fake), King

Daenerys Targaryen, Queen

Tommen Baratheon or Stannis Baratheon (Depending on Above Baratheon Lines)

[Gnivil]

In the Baratheon succesion the next in line would be some distant cousin, someone who Robert/Stannis/Renly's aunty married into, most likely. If we're going by the Targaryen succesion the next in line would be any descendents of Rhae or Daella (Aegon V's sisters), after that probably House Martell, then house Blackfyre (if they're still around through the female line of course).

[Bright Blue Eyes]

Which line of succession, there are a lot of different ones:

Lannister opinion:

Robert Baratheon

Joffrey Baratheon

Tommen Baratheon

Myrcella Baratheon

Stannis Baratheon (attainted)

Shireen Baratheon (attainted)

Renly Baratheon

Free for all

Stannis opinion:

Robert Baratheon

Stannis Baratheon

Shireen Baratheon

Renly Baratheon

Free for all

Traditional Targaryen succession:

Aegon V Targaryen

Jaeharys II Targaryen

Aerys II Targaryen

Rhaegar Targaryen

Aegon Targaryen

Jon Targaryen (has taken vows)

Viserys Targaryen

Rhaego Targaryen

Robert Baratheon

Stannis Baratheon

Renly Baratheon

...

Doran Martell

Quentyn Martell

Trystane Martell

some Martell cousins

...

Lord Plumm

Brown Ben Plumm if legitimate

...

Robert Arryn

Harrold Hardyng

...

Andal style Targaryen succession:

Aegon V Targaryen

Jaeharys II Targaryen

Aerys II Targaryen

Rhaegar Targaryen

Aegon Targaryen

Jon Targaryen (has taken vows)

Viserys Targaryen

Danaerys Targaryen

Rhaego Targaryen

Robert Baratheon

Stannis Baratheon

Shireen Baratheon

Renly Baratheon

...

Doran Martell

Quentyn Martell

Trystane Martell

Arianne Martell

some Martell cousins

...

Lord Plumm

Brown Ben Plumm if legitimate

...

Robert Arryn

Harrold Hardyng

...

[No Song so Sweet]

In traditional Targaryen there are no female heirs? I didn't know that. Also assuming that we take the Lannister claims, can Tommen just attaint Stannis and erase him from his blood right to the throne?

[Bright Blue Eyes]

In traditional Targaryen there are no female heirs? I didn't know that. Also assuming that we take the Lannister claims, can Tommen just attaint Stannis and erase him from his blood right to the throne?

Yes. After the Dance of Dragons, the Targaryens included a "no females sitting the IT" clause. Their sons could inherit, but not the women themselves. Examples of this clause at work are Aegon III, Viserys II and Aegon V.

Yes, traitors can be attainted and stripped of their claims. Of course that only works as long as Tommen is accepted as the legal king...

[Knight Of Winter]

In traditional Targaryen there are no female heirs? I didn't know that.

After disastrous civil war - Dance of Dragons - Targs changed the rules of primogeniture so that male heirs come before women heirs.

Some of us think it means that only males through male line come before women, but not males through female line (e.g. Viserys come before Rhaenys, but Stannis doesn't), while others think it means women come afetr all males (e.g. Stan comes before Dany). The issue is still undecided.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

[snip]

Andal style Targaryen succession:

Aegon V Targaryen

Jaeharys II Targaryen

Aerys II Targaryen

Rhaegar Targaryen

Aegon Targaryen

Jon Targaryen (has taken vows)

Rhaenys

Viserys Targaryen

Danaerys Targaryen

Rhaego Targaryen

Robert Baratheon

Stannis Baratheon

Shireen Baratheon

Renly Baratheon

...

Doran Martell

Quentyn Martell

Trystane Martell

Arianne Martell

some Martell cousins

...

Lord Plumm

Brown Ben Plumm if legitimate

...

Robert Arryn

Harrold Hardyng

...

This but I added Rhaenys.

[Bright Blue Eyes]

Thanks. I totally forgot her.

[Mourneblade]

The Baratheons are attainted under the Andel Targaryen Line.

[Asha's Suckling Babe]

The Baratheons are attainted under the Andel Targaryen Line.

Yes.

Actually both Baratheons and Arryns should be.

[The Bittersteel]

I made this point on my thread about House Martell's claim but I think it's relevant to bring it up here too. As Targaryen succession tries to avoid females wherever possible and Dornish law treats them equally isn't it highly unlikely Doran is the heir to the Daenerys-Maron union in terms of the Iron Throne? Unless they mix the systems in this case.

[Bael's Bastard]

I doubt Stannis would come before Dany in any actual Targaryen succession, even before he rebelled against them. In both councils we know of pre and post Dance, female descendents of the king being succeeded were considered with his male descendents. Ultimately a male was chosen in both cases, but never a non-Targaryen. Both times those considered were descendent of the last king, and did not include male descendents of daughters of previous kings, but did include granddaughters of the last king, even though they lost to actual male Targs.

[illrede]

After disastrous civil war - Dance of Dragons - Targs changed the rules of primogeniture so that male heirs come before women heirs.

Some of us think it means that only males through male line come before women, but not males through female line (e.g. Viserys come before Rhaenys, but Stannis doesn't), while others think it means women come afetr all males (e.g. Stan comes before Dany). The issue is still undecided.

I think on account of the Targaryens themselves not being certain. It is something that keeps making its own precedents. The last time it got dusted off was Egg's coronation. It very well could disqualify Daenerys, strictly interpreted. If she shows up with an army, her objection stands on firm grounds- army and willingness to use it.

EDIT: Why this has gotten so interesting is that there just aren't any unattainted branches of the royal bloodline available to anyone, and with that, there are practically no legitimate male heirs. Whoever gets the sad task of coming together to sort this out is going to be looking at Shireen Baratheon, Trystane or Arianne Martell, Daenerys Targaryen- real obscure prospects viewed from as little as a generation back.

[Fanless Mace]

Remove the Lannister kids from the list of Baratheons please. I'm afraid I've come over to the Stannis Is the One True King side of the ledger. There are no Baratheon children other than Shireen. Let's not support this charade of bastards any longer!

Oh, and I don't see ME on that list yet...please amend. :-)

[The Marquis de Leech]

Stannis' Targaryen claim is through the female line. If females don't count (i.e. Salic Law), then neither does he. The scenario whereby females can transmit but not inherit falls foul of the idea that no-one should have a better claim than the person occupying the throne. If Stannis was on the throne, he'd have to abdicate if Daenerys had a son, which is ridiculous.

[The Marquis de Leech]

Note also that Doran has inherited his title through Dornish succession. It is possible that Targaryen inheritance, as applied to the Martell line, would give a different Martell-Targaryen Heir than Doran.

[The Marquis de Leech]

And don't forget Maester Aemon, any surviving Blackfyre descendents (remember he was legitmised - the male line's gone, but if Daenerys can claim, then any Blackfyre female-line person can claim), and Bloodraven.

[illrede]

Stannis' Targaryen claim is through the female line. If females don't count (i.e. Salic Law), then neither does he. The scenario whereby females can transmit but not inherit falls foul of the idea that no-one should have a better claim than the person occupying the throne. If Stannis was on the throne, he'd have to abdicate if Daenerys had a son, which is ridiculous.

Still happens, and heck that's half the Blackfyre rebellion right there.

Invent the mechanism that being a scion of a reigning monarch improves your standing... and Daenerys' son is still Stannis' heir. We are at the point that all of the outcomes of the various nebulous mechanisms hypothetically applied still range down to the same small pool of people.

[The Marquis de Leech]

Still happens, and heck that's half the Blackfyre rebellion right there.

Invent the mechanism that being a scion of a reigning monarch improves your standing... and Daenerys' son is still Stannis' heir. We are at the point that all of the outcomes of the various nebulous mechanisms hypothetically applied still range down to the same small pool of people.

No, the Blackfyre claim was based on the idea that Daeron was not really Aegon IV's son, so the crown should go to the legitimised Daemon Blackfyre. It was arguing that Daeron should have never been King to start with.

Our scenario with Stannis being displaced by Daenerys' son is different. It holds that Stannis' rule is fine and dandy, until one day a distant relative pops out a boy, so he has to abdicate. Which is nonsensical. Either Salic Law applies, in which case the Targaryens are extinct, or women (and female-line men) inherit after male-line men. In the latter scenario, Daenerys comes before Stannis.

[The Bittersteel]

No, the Blackfyre claim was based on the idea that Daeron was not really Aegon IV's son, so the crown should go to the legitimised Daemon Blackfyre. It was arguing that Daeron should have never been King to start with.

Our scenario with Stannis being displaced by Daenerys' son is different. It holds that Stannis' rule is fine and dandy, until one day a distant relative pops out a boy, so he has to abdicate. Which is nonsensical. Either Salic Law applies, in which case the Targaryens are extinct, or women (and female-line men) inherit after male-line men. In the latter scenario, Daenerys comes before Stannis.

I think it's important to bear in mind that these laws aren't iron clad, they can be changed by the reigning monarch. In the circumstances your suggesting I agree Stannis would never abdicate for a third cousin once removed, it's just silly.