Jump to content

Bael's Bastard

Members
  • Content count

    2,866
  • Joined

  • Last visited

1 Follower

About Bael's Bastard

Recent Profile Visitors

2,130 profile views
  1. Bael's Bastard

    Martins history or Tolkiens?

    I prefer GRRM's, because what I've read of Tolkien's seems to present what really/actually happened, while GRRM's presents myths, accounts, and interpretations without always telling us what really/truly happened, and that is what history in our world is.
  2. Bael's Bastard

    Winter wars of the past?

    Do you have a quote to support the idea it was winter, or just speculation? Ned crossed the mountains to the Fingers to get north. Only Robert used Gulltown, after he and Jon captured it.
  3. Bael's Bastard

    Winter wars of the past?

    Not necessarily. The False Spring interrupted close to two years of winter before winter returned with a vengeance at the end of 281 AC and for at least the first weeks of 282 AC, so it isn't clear how long, if at all, into the rebellion winter lasted.
  4. Bael's Bastard

    Question regarding Mad King !!

    Who do you think that would have been? The Blackfyre male line came to an end with the death of Maelys I Blackfyre in 260 AC, so by 277-283 AC, when Varys was brought to Westeros by King Aerys, there was no male-line Blackfyre to put on the throne. It would either have to be a female Blackfyre, a male from a female line, or a Targaryen from a line passed over for Aegon V and his line (such as a male line descendant of Aerion, or a female line descendant of Rhaegel or Daeron).
  5. Bael's Bastard

    Division of the Kingsguard of Aerys II

    It might be that Aerys's orders were made in a way that did not explicitly require Hightower to return with Rhaegar., in which case he could be convinced to fulfill Rhaegar's command to remain there without transgressing any command of Aerys. But I think it might also be possible that it was not so clean as that. Rhaegar might not have trusted Hightower to return to King's Landing with whatever new knowledge he might have acquired since leaving King's Landing, and required him to remain at the tower in exchange for Rhaegar returning to King's Landing. Perhaps he would have allowed Hightower to return to King's Landing without him, and face the consequences of failing to fulfill Aerys's command, while they moved to another location where Hightower wouldn't be able to lead a new party to them, assuming he survived his failure. Or perhaps Rhaegar might have even been willing to command Dayne and Whent to hold their own Lord Commander against his will at the tower while he returned to King's Landing, in the event Hightower wouldn't remain willingly. We have little to go by, but I have a feeling Hightower is there with a very different mindset and for very different reasons than Dayne and Whent. I don't think Ned finds him there because he is on "Team Rhaegar."
  6. Bael's Bastard

    Division of the Kingsguard of Aerys II

    I believe the source is the World of Ice and Fire mobile app.
  7. Bael's Bastard

    Division of the Kingsguard of Aerys II

    If Ned's fever dream is any indication, I think Hightower was firmly in the camp of supporting Aerys no matter what. I don't think even Dayne and Whent would have openly defied or gone against the king, though I do believe they were in the camp of helping Rhaegar accomplish his objectives from within their vows. But I suspect Rhaegar gave Hightower an ultimatum that he would agree to return to King's Landing but Hightower had to remain at the tower. I don't think Hightower was there because he sided with Rhaegar.
  8. Bael's Bastard

    Question regarding Mad King !!

    I don't think such abuse is necessary to explain Aerys's response, though I wouldn't be surprised to learn that he was treated worse than the accounts have described. Tywin had already threatened to kill every man, woman, and child if they did not surrender, and the king was not going to be perceived as being outdone by his Hand. He had only traveled to Duskendale in the first place because Tywin advised him not to, and he suspected Tywin of intending to get him killed once he was in captivity. "Those who knew the resolve of Tywin Lannister knew better. Instead, the Hand's heart grew harder, and he sent Duskendale's lord one final demand for surrender. Should he refuse again, Lord Tywin promised, he would take the town by storm and put every man, woman, and child within to the sword. (The tale, oft told, that Lord Tywin sent his bard to deliver the ultimatum, and commanded him to sing "The Rains of Castamere" for Lord Denys and the Lace Serpent is a colorful detail that is, alas, unsupported by the records)."
  9. Bael's Bastard

    Question regarding Mad King !!

    Varys had been whispering in Aerys's ear for at least a few years by the time the real Aegon was born, let alone by the time the possibly-younger AeGriff was born. Rhaegar and Elia were wed in 280, and Rhaenys was born the same year. If Tyrion is correct about his assumption that AeGriff is fifteen or sixteen, he might not have even been born or even conceived yet at the time of the Sack of King's Landing, It will be interesting to find out, assuming we do, what Varys's plots against House Targaryen looked like before they had AeGriff to work with.
  10. Bael's Bastard

    Question regarding Mad King !!

    @Stormking902 I am not sure we know the full extent of how Aerys was treated physically while in captivity, but it was clearly a shattering experience for the already unstable king, who suspected that his Hand Tywin and his son and heir Rhaegar had intended to get him killed. "Captivity at Duskendale had shattered whatever sanity had remained to Aerys II Targaryen. From that day forth, the king's madness reigned unchecked, growing worse with every passing year. The Darklyns had dared lay hands upon his person, shoving him roughly, stripping him of his royal raiment, even daring to strike him. After his release, King Aerys would no longer allow himself to be touched, even by his own servants. Uncut and unwashed, his hair grew ever longer and more tangled, whilst his fingernails lengthened and thickened into grotesque yellow talons. He forbade any blade in his presence save for the swords carried by the knights of his Kingsguard, sworn to protect him. His judgments became ever harsher and crueler. Once safely returned to King's Landing, His Grace refused to leave the Red Keep for any cause and remained a virtual prisoner in his own castle for the next four years, during which time he grew ever more wary of those around him, Tywin Lannister in particular. His suspicions extended even to his own son and heir. Prince Rhaegar, he was convinced, had conspired with Tywin Lannister to have him slain at Duskendale. They had planned to storm the town walls so that Lord Darklyn would put him to death, opening the way for Rhaegar to mount the Iron Throne and marry Lord Tywin's daughter." (TWOIAF - The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II)
  11. Bael's Bastard

    R+L=J vs N+A=J (GRRM looses either way)

    Rhaegar and Lyanna are very likely to have married before Jon was born, in which case he would not be a bastard, and would have legitimately been in the Stark line of succession, though obviously only after Ned and Catelyn's children. But as a legitimate female line Stark Catelyn would have had no need to fear Jon. It would be Jon's paternal ancestry that would have been a threat to not only Jon, but Ned and his family for housing him.
  12. Bael's Bastard

    R+L=J vs N+A=J (GRRM looses either way)

    People claim a lot of crazy things, but there is no evidence for B+A=Jon or B+L=Jon or M+L=Jon. Wylla and fisherman's daughter things are almost certainly red herrings, like Ashara, having been explicitly stated by Eddard, Edric, and Godric in AGOT ASOS, and ADWD.
  13. Bael's Bastard

    R+L=J vs N+A=J (GRRM looses either way)

    I disagree that the first book made it obvious, and I find that most people read about it long after it had been deduced, rather than deduced it themselves, especially from the first book alone. I am not sure what the show did, which you shouldn't be discussing in this forum, as the rules state. But the idea of a romance, whether one sided or whatever the circumstances, is explicitly part of the Targaryen narrative in the books, as early as Daenerys's first chapter in AGOT. "Her brother Rhaegar battling the Usurper in the bloody waters of the Trident and dying for the woman he loved." (AGOT - Daenerys I) "Rhaegar had died for the woman he loved." (AGOT - Daenerys VIII) "The singers would have us believe it was all Rhaegar and Robert struggling in the stream for a woman both of them claimed to love, but I assure you, other men were fighting too, and I was one." (AFFC - Brienne VI) "If he loved you, he would come and carry you off at swordpoint, as Rhaegar carried off his northern girl, the girl in her insisted, but the queen knew that was folly." (ADWD - Daenerys VII) "Prince Rhaegar loved his Lady Lyanna, and thousands died for it." (ADWD - The Kingbreaker) We should obviously be skeptical that it is as cut and dry as the Targaryen "love" narrative that is introduced in the first Daenerys chapter of the first book, just as we should be skeptical about the Baratheon "rape" narrative introduced soon after in the second Eddard chapter of the first book. But the point is that the "love" angle is there in the books. Rhaegar seems to have at one point been plotting to restrict his father, a plot which seems to have been thwarted in part thanks to Varys informing Aerys of his intentions, leading to Aerys's attendance at Harrenhal. That is, unless getting Aerys to attend Harrenhal and reveal his descent to the realm was part of Rhaegar's plan, in which case Varys was either knowingly or unknowingly acting on Rhaegar's behalf when he informed Aerys of Rhaegar's Harrenhal intentions. Whatever the case, Rhaegar was obviously not so obsessed with the prophetic and mystical as to be oblivious about politics. Yet, he still did what he did, both at Harrenhal and in kidnapping Lyanna, and couldn't have been so clueless as to think there would be no consequences. The prophecy angle makes Rhaegar so determined to fulfill prophecy that he disregards any possible consequences in his attempts to fulfill it. I don't buy that, although I can see him trying to attach prophetic significance to his feelings for Lyanna after he had already become impressed by her, if not fallen for her. I am also not entirely sure I buy the angle that Rhaegar was in love with Lyanna when he named her queen of love and beauty, though I am not against the idea that it developed at some point. I think he crowned her queen and love and beauty only as a result of seeing/finding out what she did earlier at Harrenhal. What I am quite certain of, is that Rhaegar's crowning Lyanna at Harrenhal was, however unintentionally, responsible for turning Aerys's suspicions toward Lord Rickard and House Stark, at a time when he had already descended into madness and burning traitors, was already going back and forth on whether his son was plotting against him, and was being advised by his closest advisers that his son was indeed plotting against him, and that this was proof that he was courting House Stark to his cause.
  14. Bael's Bastard

    R+L=J vs N+A=J (GRRM looses either way)

    Most of those are not options at all, between having no textual basis for some of those relationships, and timelines making some of them impossible anyways. And it is highly unlikely that GRRM had Ned or Lord Godric explicitly reveal the identity of Jon's mother.
  15. Bael's Bastard

    Question regarding Mad King !!

    @Lord Varys I don't think that is an entirely accurate assessment. Aerys had already demonstrated his capriciousness, paranoia, and cruelty years before Duskendale, even if Duskendale exacerbated those traits, and brought him to a whole other level of madness and brutality. "By 270 AC, he had decided that the queen was being unfaithful to him. "The gods will not suffer a bastard to sit the Iron Throne," he told his small council; none of Rhaella's stillbirths, miscarriages, or dead princes had been his, the king proclaimed. Thereafter, he forbade the queen to leave the confines of Maegor's Holdfast and decreed that two septas would henceforth share her bed every night, "to see that she remains true to her vows."" (TWOIAF - The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II) After Aerys's remarks about Joanna's death in 273 AC: "Never a man to make a show of his emotion, Lord Tywin continued on as Hand of the King, dealing with the daily tedium of the Seven Kingdoms, while the king grew ever more erratic, violent, and suspicious." (TWOIAF - The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II) Then, after Jaehaerys's birth in death in 274 AC: "The march of the king's madness seemed to abate for a time in 274 AC, when Queen Rhaella gave birth to a son. So profound was His Grace's joy that it seemed to restore him to his old self once again...but Prince Jaehaerys died later that same year, plunging Aerys into despair. In his black rage, he decided the babe's wet nurse was to blame and had the woman beheaded. Not long after, in a change of heart, Aerys announced that Jaehaerys had been poisoned by his own mistress, the pretty young daughter of one of his household knights. The king had the girl and all her kin tortured to death. During the course of their torment, it is recorded, all confessed to the murder, though the details of their confessions were greatly at odds." (TWOIAF - The Targaryen Kings: Aerys II) We can accuse Pycelle, or the Citadel, or Yandel of exaggerating stories about Aerys, but they are what we have to work with, and they indicate he was already far from harmless before Duskendale. And I would imagine this is just the tip of the iceberg of the violence he committed between in the early-mid 270s. It just got worse after Duskendale, after which he became even most distrustful of his own family, and his Hand.
×