C.T. Phipps

This is ridiculous. Seriously. What sort of nonsense suggests that the writers are inventing a feminist agenda. ITS ALWAYS BEEN FEMINIST. The story is called the "Princess and the Queen." Also, why do people keep trying to defend the Greens? They've ALWAYS been the villains of this. Martin is a feminist and like half of A Song of Ice and Fire is about the female perspective in Medieval life and how it fucking sucks. I think people need to check themselves if they don't think Martin has been promoting a pro-woman POV for the books. And he did it decades before a misogynist dumbass became the US President. Note: My family knew personally Trump when I was a kid and considered him a complete asshole.

Alternatively: She couldn't kill members of her family versus complete strangers.

Alicent doesn't change very much. The problem is her "nuance" is hard to understand. She believes Rhaenyra is a liar who will kill her children. It's just the AUDIENCE doesn't believe Alicent should believe that. So they ascribe her other motives.

Alicent thinks she's Catelyn but she's actually Cersei is the best way to summarize her character for me.

I mean part of the issue is the "James Bond villain" syndrome of it. One of the things Roger Ebert noted in A View To a Kill is that a lot of the movies depend on the KGB or other forces trying to control lunatics. Alicent and Otto are not going to be able to direct the Crown prince with the largest of all dragons. They unleashed a monster and he does what he wants.

This seems like the opposite of your point. You seem offended the show makes no attempt to judge Daemon for his actions but leaves them up to the viewer. You seem to want the show to punish him or frame his actions differently as a moral point.

I've read your argument and it's "because Daemon didn't kill popular beloved characters but only characters the audience isn't particularly attached to, that means the show is trying to present him as a goodie-goodie." I am very curious what exactly you think they should have changed to portray Daemon the way you want. Because it seems like they want to portray him as a ruthless man but with redeming qualities, which is how he's in the book. I admit, though, I think they're way too whitewashing on the Greens and need to up their evil significantly.

I mean Alicent has already covered up the murder of Harwin Strong and his father. And now covers up for her son's rapes. She's "nuanced" but already crossed the Moral Event Horizon.

On my end, I don't think that Alicent ever actually believes that Rhaenyra wants to kill her sons but she can't really 100% be certain that she won't because Rhaenyra lies to her face about things like screwing Daemon. There's also the fact that she is loyal to her father, House, and the traditions of Westeros that say that Aegon should be king. I don't think people need to overthink it. Alicent is on the side of tradition and hates that Rhaenyra has defied so much of it that it infuriates her more. Unlike @Lord Varys, I also don't have a problem with the idea she's mentally alone and isolated because we see how her ladies in waiting treat her as they basically force her into King Viserys bed and create a sense of isolation with her. It's probable that she has acquaintances but no one to complain about what she's REALLY feeling - that she hates Viserys and her marriage to him and her former best friend is now her political enemy. So Alicent crumbles under the pressure of being the "Good One" and comes to hate Rhaenyra as the Bad One.

I unapologetically hope they portray the Greens as aboslute evil and scum and the Blacks as flawed heroes who need to destroy the Greens utterly.

Not that I expect you to be persuaded but could you explain how murdering his wife was justified? I feel like that was grossly out of character but designed to address the kind of things you claim he is being whitewashed of.

I mean he commits suicide over betraying Rhaenyra or Nettles.

But yes, HBO wanted to start with the Dance of the Dragons but George Martin insisted on otherwise with others supporting him. They really-really wanted to skip past all of this character building to get to the "good" stuff in the Civil War despite the fact that the actual Dance is pretty compared to all of the twists and turns as well as politicking that precedes it in the first twenty years. Really, they should have done the Dance in one season and three seasons of this season's contents.

I mean more that Daemon is the kind of guy to commit suicide by cop over his young mistress.

Yes, absolutely. They were going to rule in Vaemond's favor and have him take the brunt of the accusation. Otto was sitting on the Iron Throne and this was going to be the moment where Rhaenyra was disinherited, her children declared bastards, and Aegon reaffirmed as the Crown's Heir. It utterly went sideways instead. Alicent might hesitate but Otto wouldn't.

My take on the subject was the producers wanted to get to Daemon and Rhaenyra as a power couple as quickly as possible. They unfortunately underestimated that people would be interested in Ser Harwin AND Laenor.

HOUSE OF THE DRAGON 1x08 "THE LORD OF THE TIDES" is one of the biggest episodes in the series and it's interesting because it is one of the quieter ones. While there's yet another unnecessary time skip, it carries over from the previous episode's development so I'm able to ignore it. It is a powerful episode with a lot of character development as well as culmination of several important plot arcs. I wouldn't say it's my favorite of the episodes but it is strong enough that I am going to say the show has bounced back from several issues it had previously been suffering due to the constant barrelling forward without pausing to analyze previous characterization. The premise is Ser Vaemond Velaryon, brother of Corlys, is making a play to become Lord of Driftmark. Corlys has gotten himself severely injured fighting in the Stepstones and this is understandable since the guy has to be, in-universe, in his sixties at the very least. Vaemond also has the point that the official heirs of Driftmark are, in fact, Rhaenyra's bastards with no Velaryon blood in their veins. It should be noted by my pendantic Westerosi scholar heart, though, that he's still not the heir but Daemon's daughters as female children come before uncles in the Andal tradition. Ser Vaemond has an ace in the hole to forward his claim because he is going to be taking it before Ser Otto Hightower as he's acting as regent for the dying bedridden King Viserys. Given Otto wants more than anything to disinherit Rhaenyra and her heirs, it seems like a slam dunk. Unfortunately, for Otto, Rhaenyra is warned about his treacherous plan and heads to King's Landing where the Hightowers are hiding behind religion as well as have attempted to remove all of her supporters. Alicent also has an interesting balance between being her darker ruthless side with her nicer more mothering side. Some of the things she does are unforgivable like the fact she covers up for her son's rape in what I'm sure is meant to be an invocation of several other mothers doing the same for afluent white kids in today's society. She also attempts to reconcile with Rhaenyra after one last tragic plea by Viserys before it is all ruined by a misunderstanding. Speaking of Viserys, Paddy Considine is the MVP of the episode with his best performance yet. He really deserves a Emmy nod if not the actual award. Using the very last of his life, he manages to thwart the Hightower's attempt to seize power. He may not have been a good king but he was a good man (ignoring the whole killing his wife during childbirth thing). He finally dies at the end of the episode but it was after his best act of kingsmanship. I also have to give credit for the establishing of the stakes between the sons of Alicent Hightower with the sons of Rhaenyra. Some people complain about the fact that the Blacks are being shown to be superior morally while the Greens are shown to be monsters. You know? I have no problem with that whatsoever. The Greens were scum in the books and the Blacks were far more likable, the show is just following suit. I do have an issue with the fact that Viserys' last words seem to be what gets Alicent to decide on betraying Rhaenyra to crown her son. But not much of an issue as I don't think that she would have honored Viserys' wishes anyway. She's spent twenty years grasping for power and trying to think she was justified in the process. People make too much of the misunderstanding when Alicent clearly was ignoring he was out of his mind. All she wanted was some sort of sign that he wanted Aegon to be on the throne and would have interpreted anything her way (which she did). In conclusion, solid episode and I am very excited for next week.

HOUSE OF THE DRAGON 1x08 "THE LORD OF THE TIDES" is one of the biggest episodes in the series and it's interesting because it is one of the quieter ones. While there's yet another unnecessary time skip, it carries over from the previous episode's development so I'm able to ignore it. It is a powerful episode with a lot of character development as well as culmination of several important plot arcs. I wouldn't say it's my favorite of the episodes but it is strong enough that I am going to say the show has bounced back from several issues it had previously been suffering due to the constant barrelling forward without pausing to analyze previous characterization. The premise is Ser Vaemond Velaryon, brother of Corlys, is making a play to become Lord of Driftmark. Corlys has gotten himself severely injured fighting in the Stepstones and this is understandable since the guy has to be, in-universe, in his sixties at the very least. Vaemond also has the point that the official heirs of Driftmark are, in fact, Rhaenyra's bastards with no Velaryon blood in their veins. It should be noted by my pendantic Westerosi scholar heart, though, that he's still not the heir but Daemon's daughters as female children come before uncles in the Andal tradition. Ser Vaemond has an ace in the hole to forward his claim because he is going to be taking it before Ser Otto Hightower as he's acting as regent for the dying bedridden King Viserys. Given Otto wants more than anything to disinherit Rhaenyra and her heirs, it seems like a slam dunk. Unfortunately, for Otto, Rhaenyra is warned about his treacherous plan and heads to King's Landing where the Hightowers are hiding behind religion as well as have attempted to remove all of her supporters. Alicent also has an interesting balance between being her darker ruthless side with her nicer more mothering side. Some of the things she does are unforgivable like the fact she covers up for her son's rape in what I'm sure is meant to be an invocation of several other mothers doing the same for afluent white kids in today's society. She also attempts to reconcile with Rhaenyra after one last tragic plea by Viserys before it is all ruined by a misunderstanding. Speaking of Viserys, Paddy Considine is the MVP of the episode with his best performance yet. He really deserves a Emmy nod if not the actual award. Using the very last of his life, he manages to thwart the Hightower's attempt to seize power. He may not have been a good king but he was a good man (ignoring the whole killing his wife during childbirth thing). He finally dies at the end of the episode but it was after his best act of kingsmanship. I also have to give credit for the establishing of the stakes between the sons of Alicent Hightower with the sons of Rhaenyra. Some people complain about the fact that the Blacks are being shown to be superior morally while the Greens are shown to be monsters. You know? I have no problem with that whatsoever. The Greens were scum in the books and the Blacks were far more likable, the show is just following suit. I do have an issue with the fact that Viserys' last words seem to be what gets Alicent to decide on betraying Rhaenyra to crown her son. But not much of an issue as I don't think that she would have honored Viserys' wishes anyway. She's spent twenty years grasping for power and trying to think she was justified in the process. People make too much of the misunderstanding when Alicent clearly was ignoring he was out of his mind. All she wanted was some sort of sign that he wanted Aegon to be on the throne and would have interpreted anything her way (which she did). In conclusion, solid episode and I am very excited for next week.

I mean not very well since some slurred words and ramblings by a delirious man turned her back.

Oh that's just nonsense. Mushroom is the source of 90% of Rhaenyra being a harlot stories. Something that is worse than all of the murder and brutality stories by Westeros standards.

I don't think it was clear at all. I think she was THINKING about it but Alicent has been on this road for 16 years. Do we really think she would be turned around by Viserys' speech at the table?

The fact he's a rapist. And even then, they're not going full Mushroom where he's screwing children.

Given his accusations put his wife and his stepchildren in danger, I absolutely think killing him is a good thing from the perspective of a husband. But no, I don't think you come back from Uxoricide.

I mean if she didn't misinterpret his last words, she would have been talked into it by Otto or Larys or her Septon. Alicent wants to believe she's doing the right thing. Because no logical person would believe the rambling of her insane half-dead husband is the secret.

I mean, she would have grasped at any justification.